Editore"s Note
Tilting at Windmills

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June 15, 2006
By: Kevin Drum

TNR MEETS YEARLYKOS....Ryan Lizza writes about the YearlyKos convention:

Throughout the four-day convention, bloggers, politicians, and reporters circle one another like a trio of underwater species not quite sure who eats whom anymore. The bloggers alternatively ridicule and suck up to the reporters. The politicians prostrate themselves before the bloggers one minute and then roll their eyes at them in off-the-record pow-wows with the "mainstream media" the next. The press smile and yuk it up with the bloggers during the day and escape to decadent, MSM-only meals at night. All three groups seem to agree that everything in their respective spheres is changing because of the blogs, but nobody is quite sure how.

The whole thing is pretty funny. There's no way of knowing how fair or accurate it is, of course, but it's certainly the most entertaining piece I've read so far about YearlyKos.

Kevin Drum 8:10 PM Permalink | Trackbacks | Comments (35)

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Comments

Ha ha?

Posted by: David Weman on June 15, 2006 at 8:16 PM | PERMALINK

Having Kos and his minions around is like having a thousand crazy uncles over to Thanksgiving dinner.

Posted by: American Hawk on June 15, 2006 at 8:18 PM | PERMALINK

All three groups seem to agree that everything in their respective spheres is changing because of the blogs, but nobody is quite sure how.

As usual, the liberal TNR doesn't know what it's talking about. Blogs right now exist only because bloggers are able to steal free bandwidth in order to publish their blogs. When net neutrality ends, companies will force liberal bloggers to pay for the bandwidth they're using up which could be used for better things like video over the internet and providing healthcare for the elderly. Since liberal bloggers won't have the money to pay for all of the bandwidth they've been stealing many liberal blogs will end. The days of liberal blogs having any influence will end once net neutrality ends. Thank God for that.

Posted by: Al on June 15, 2006 at 8:51 PM | PERMALINK

C'mon, fake Al. You're not even trying anymore.

Posted by: Ken on June 15, 2006 at 8:59 PM | PERMALINK

How does internet bandwidth provide health care for the elderly?

Posted by: Alan on June 15, 2006 at 8:59 PM | PERMALINK

"Together We Can Do Better."

BWHAHAHAHAAA!!

Posted by: Frequency Kenneth on June 15, 2006 at 9:07 PM | PERMALINK

I really like having TNR behind the pay wall. Even if I foolishly decide to read it, I can't.

Alterman commented on how much money Peretz went through while destroying TNR's influence. Someone should write a book "The Martin Paretz Business Plan".

Kevin's comments remain a pesthole.

Posted by: humble blogger on June 15, 2006 at 9:15 PM | PERMALINK

humble blogger
I really like having TNR behind the pay wall. Even if I foolishly decide to read it, I can't.

It's not behind a pay wall. It's behind a registration wall.

This was a home run paragraph (my bold)


But there is still a discomfiting sense among the bloggers here that, as with Armando, nothing in their world will be the same after this weekend. They are moving from faceless writers talking in what sometimes seems like an echo chamber to a national movement courted by presidential candidates and covered seriously by the press. They are finally meeting the politicians they bash and praise from the safety of their basements. Las Vegas could be the beginning of a new era of blogger influence and authority. Or it might just be the weekend they all sold out.

I vote for "they whored themselves". It is better when the blogs are anonymous. Good ideas should survive in and of themselves.

Posted by: Red State Mike on June 15, 2006 at 9:29 PM | PERMALINK

American (chicken) Hawk >"...like having a thousand crazy uncles..."

So the crazyness runs in your family line eah ?

Your posts here now make a lot more sense

"As long as people believe in absurdities they will continue to commit atrocities." - Voltaire

Posted by: daCascadian on June 15, 2006 at 9:41 PM | PERMALINK

You mean to say, you didn't enjoy the accounts of the tinfoil hat contest?

Posted by: republicrat on June 15, 2006 at 9:54 PM | PERMALINK


AL: Since liberal bloggers won't have the money to pay for all of the bandwidth they've been stealing many liberal blogs will end.

It sure is something to look forward to, huh? The idea that any law abiding citizen would have any reason to be on the internet other than for the purpose of spending money is downright un-American. I am concerned about one thing, though, Al: What's going to happen to you? Back to full-time shopping, I guess, eh?


Posted by: jayarbee on June 15, 2006 at 10:17 PM | PERMALINK

talking in what sometimes seems like an echo chamber

Anyone who can say of dKos that it's "like an echo chamber" has obviously never spent any time there and is just assuming it's run like the right-wing group blogs they have visited.

Posted by: Thumb on June 15, 2006 at 10:22 PM | PERMALINK

Alright, I know I'm in there! If I don't come out with my hands up, I'm coming in after me...

Posted by: The Bush Administration on June 15, 2006 at 10:27 PM | PERMALINK

TNR?

Who cares.

Posted by: luci on June 15, 2006 at 10:35 PM | PERMALINK

C'mon, fake Al. You're not even trying anymore.

I disagree. That was an inspired piece of fake-Al performance art. I mean, it wasn't just parroting actual right-wing talking points, fake-Al spouted a bunch of stuff that could be right-wing talking points in the near future. In short, fake-Al anticipated a near-future real Al (if he's still alive) posting.

Posted by: Constantine on June 15, 2006 at 10:53 PM | PERMALINK

Is real Al ill? I hadn't heard. I picked a bunch of poison ivy today. I could make a bouquet.

Posted by: markg8 on June 15, 2006 at 11:03 PM | PERMALINK

KD, I didn't find the tone funny so much as nasty.

Posted by: Me2d on June 15, 2006 at 11:08 PM | PERMALINK

Unfair and inaccurate. Here are some debunkings:

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2006/6/15/173347/995

Posted by: pontificator on June 15, 2006 at 11:38 PM | PERMALINK

TNR?

Who the fuck cares?

Posted by: Mel J on June 15, 2006 at 11:58 PM | PERMALINK

Peter Beinart was on the Hugh Hewitt show for an hour on Thursday. Topic: What do the Dems need to do in order to be taken seriously on national defense?

Hugh Hewitt and Peter Beinart are serious people. Too bad for the Dems, most of the energy in the Democratic party is with the Moonbat Left.

Posted by: Down goes Frazier on June 16, 2006 at 12:18 AM | PERMALINK

Humble: Actually, all my links to TNR are available free of charge. You do have to register, but that's all. In fact, with rare exceptions, I never link to anything that's not freely available or that has a passthrough link.

Posted by: Kevin Drum on June 16, 2006 at 1:11 AM | PERMALINK

Ah "premium" service-so many ways to pay more for EVERYONE.

Posted by: doug r on June 16, 2006 at 1:30 AM | PERMALINK


KEVIN DRUM: Actually, all my links to TNR are available free of charge. You do have to register, but that's all. In fact, with rare exceptions, I never link to anything that's not freely available or that has a passthrough link.

Yeah, well, as Al tells us, that's all going to change soon. The internet is going to be taken away from the communists who run it now and given to the fascists who run everything else, as was the intention of its founder, Joseph Goebbels.


Posted by: jayarbee on June 16, 2006 at 1:33 AM | PERMALINK

Peter Beinart was on the Hugh Hewitt show for an hour on Thursday. Topic: What do the Dems need to do in order to be taken seriously on national defense?

It's amazing that someone with putatively liberal leanings would participate in such a discussion. I can't imagine Bill Kristol discussing "What can the Republicans do to show that they are capable of running the government?"

Posted by: Boots Day on June 16, 2006 at 1:44 AM | PERMALINK

I saw the Daily Kos thread, there were of course no debunkings, only the same well worn complaints. The press is out to get them, TNR isn't a real liberal magazine/is falling in sales/is jealous of kos diarists like them, and anything other an a glowing review of the whole porject and how wonderful these people are is a false smear. Martyrdom + Persecution complex x infinity.

This and the George Allen confederate flag piece have really improved my opinion of Ryan Lizza. I previously considered him lightweight compared to others at The New Republic.

Posted by: Dustin Ridgeway on June 16, 2006 at 1:48 AM | PERMALINK

There were four men at yearlykos who aspire to be president in two years.

There were over 1,000 bloggers.

I did a study that took me about 10 or 11 hours yesterday using technorati to find out how many blogs were posted about the candidates and to categorize those blogs. It's posted at dailykos under "yearlykos statistics."

Do you know how many blogs there were that mostly without comment quoted the mainstream media's quote of one of these guys saying how important bloggers are? Forty.

Do you know how many posts there were that reasonable covered details of what the candidates had to say? Six. Three for Clark and three for Warner. None for Vilsack and Richardson.

It's a disservice to the candidates and a disservice to the readers, in my opinion.

Be surprised if any of them let themselves be used again like this next year.

Posted by: catherineD on June 16, 2006 at 1:54 AM | PERMALINK

I disagree. That was an inspired piece of fake-Al performance art.

Nah. A good fake Al can make his point with a maximum of two uses of the word "liberal"; this "Al," whoever he (or she) is, pounds us over the head with no less than five "liberals," in an effort to conceal the inanity of his pointless rant.

Lame, if you ask me. To learn how it's done, this fake Al needs to study more experienced fake Als (and the real one - if there really is a real one).

Posted by: Ken on June 16, 2006 at 2:21 AM | PERMALINK

I vote for "they whored themselves". It is better when the blogs are anonymous. Good ideas should survive in and of themselves.

Then maybe you can explain why your tribe has to lie cheat and obstufucate all your agendas to get them passed?

Why must your tribe always resort to wedge issues and fear-mongering to win. Why can't the might conservative ideas be implemented on the merits?

Posted by: SnarkyShark on June 16, 2006 at 6:39 AM | PERMALINK

Having Kos and his minions around is like having a thousand crazy uncles over to Thanksgiving dinner.

but a dinner with (un)American Hawk, Al, GOP, fKenneth, Charlie (in all his incarnations), THE OBJECTIVE HISTORIAN ALICE PATTON, Norman and rdw and the gang would be a real hoot, a veritable blast, a, a....

drat but I've seemingly got a prior engagement.

Posted by: snicker-snack on June 16, 2006 at 8:31 AM | PERMALINK

Good ideas should survive in and of themselves.

Which is why the Republicans need their Noise Machine, of course.

Posted by: Gregory on June 16, 2006 at 8:39 AM | PERMALINK

Speaking of the noise machine...

Peter Beinart was on the Hugh Hewitt show for an hour on Thursday. Topic: What do the Dems need to do in order to be taken seriously on national defense?

Sock puppet, why should anyone take Beinart or Hewitt seriously on any subject, the Democrtats and national defense in particular?

Posted by: Gregory on June 16, 2006 at 8:42 AM | PERMALINK

Kevin,
This was the vilest article written about YearlyKos, even worse than the drivel written by Maureen Dowd and Adam Nagourney.

Next year, come and see real democracy in action for yourself at YK07, and don't relie on mediawhores for your info.

Posted by: Ed in Montana on June 16, 2006 at 11:22 AM | PERMALINK

As noted above, the fact that this is from TNR says a lot.

What exactly has TNR been right on over the past five years?

Here's hoping they decide to join Holy Joe as "independants" in the near future.

Posted by: Davebo on June 16, 2006 at 11:46 AM | PERMALINK

TNR is a Stalinist tool, like other corporate media. Corporate media is intent upon treating the masses as a herd to be taken to whatever destination its corporate masters determine is in capital's best interest. The internet empowers individuals, so it is antithetical to the collusion between the MSM and the corporate puppets we call politicians. Blogs can represent individuals, become organizing tools, or become part of the corporate arsenal to cow the masses. Blogs can be libertarian, fascist and everything in between. As long as people have choice and Bloggers have free expression and the net remeains neutral, it is possible the distributed knowledge the internet is capable of providing can contribute to public discourse and knowledge, as it is doing now. This is why the MSM has to pay attention to its potential and power, and is why it acts enviously and contemptuously towards it. The worry should be that the internet will be co-opted into the MSM corporate plutocracy, ending all of the wonderful work of the thousands of individuals who work hard to bring their bit of knowledge to the rest of the world. The politicians, wealthy corps and MSM are working very hard right now to end the freedom of expression and availability of unfiltered information that the internet provides. We should be very worried.

Posted by: Hostile on June 16, 2006 at 12:35 PM | PERMALINK
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