Bill O'Reilly -- what a buffoon.

And Time left this out, why? Now I believe this thing is authentic.

Why does Time hate the troops????

Ummm, was there some reason you wanted to expose this poor guy to either being forced out of the service or being fragged like they did to Pat Tillman? I'll be sure to tell his family I read it here first...You are really publishing some stupid shit these days, Kevin. You used to be just wishy-washy and useless, but now you are dangerous.

Kevin, thanks for advertising Ashcroft's new book (lower right part of the page). Al just LOOOVES him. He has a lifesized picture of Ashcroft all lubed up with Crisco. I don't know how wittle Ally-kins got it, but boy, does Al love it!

Fucking mercenaries are destroying the US military.

I'm hoping they take heavy casualties.

Bill O'Reilly -- what a buffoon. And Time left this out, why?

Because it would show his liberal Clintonista bias.

From Time:

His honest but wry narration and unusually frank dissection of the mission contrasts sharply with the story presented by both sides of the Iraq war debate, the Pentagon spin masters and fierce critics.

Um...how does this "contrast sharply with the story presented by [the Iraq war's] fierce critics" again?

--ian

From where did you get these added bits? And what is your source for the marine's identity?

Ah, Kevin.

Every group, especially one 130K strong, is going to have a couple of Michael Moore - Paul Krugman duds in it. Talk about cherry picking feedback.

How about all the positive reports coming back from anonymous American soldiers in Iraq. The Iraqi economy is exploding with growth, and Iraqi consumers now have more consumer devices than ever before.

Things might look bleak now, especially since you guys are so desperate to give an ear to any two-bit lefty editorialism coming out of idiot orifices. But I think real Americans are smart enough to stick this thing out, and Iraq is going to be stronger and freer because of it.

FYI, this letter has already been published all over the web. There's nothing new here.

KD: FYI, this letter has already been published all over the web. There's nothing new here.

That may be, but his identity has not been published, as far as I know. What is your source for it?

You found one left-leaning Marine officer. Good for you!

The Iraqi economy is exploding with growth,

Parody right?

and Iraqi consumers now have more consumer devices than ever before.

I assume you're talking about cell phones and IEDs

"Iraqi consumers now have more consumer devices than ever before."

So they can listen to their IPod while they are tortured and beheaded. Sweeeeet.

It is interesting to see how everyone is reading this through their own presuppositions.

(it would help if people actually read the links...for example, Time did publish one of his two O'Reilly comments)

there is nothing to indicate that Devlin is "left-leaning"....trust me, he is not the only conservative who thinks O'Reilly is a buffoon (I am not concluding that he is a conservative either).

as for his comments being in opposition to both sides...well yeah.

his comments on the Iraqi police force are obviously quite positive and frankly, surprising.
he also notes that American esprit d'corps is relatively high.

on the other hand, the insurgency isn't exactly getting weaker.

It's not a matter of left-leaning or right-leaning, it's a matter of seeing what is in front of you while you are in Iraq for months.

I've been there several times since Oct 2003, the latest in May 2006. It's not getting better.

One index of success or failure is the number of educated Iraqis who are leaving for Jordan or other places. This year, with the death squads and sectarian killings, lots of Iraqis who have stuck it out up to now are leaving.

That's a fact, Jack.

To egbert:

You know egbert, I'm an independent moderate, and have voted for Republicans as well as Democrats over the years. I actually supported the Iraq war. But right now comments like yours have alienated me from the Republican party. This officer is over in Iraq risking his life for us, and you dismiss him because his take on what's going on is contrary to your party's talking points. He's over there, he's fighting and could be killed, but you think it's appropriate to denigrate his service because you don't like what he says. You don't even attempt to express your disagreement while honoring his service. You just call him names. That's shameful, beneath contempt. You're not only a coward, but you are downright unpatriotic and un-American. You seem representative of the current incarnation of the Republican party: The party is above country, integrity, ethics and everything else of value. It's the party, the party, the party, and only the party. The party defines you and controls you, like a little automaton. I wish you could feel shame, but I know that like all small-minded, weak-willed authoritarians, from fascists to communists, you're incapable of even the slightest decency.

"But I think real Americans are smart enough to stick this thing out..." by egbert at 4:00 pm. I remember practically those very same words were said by people like Robert McNamara and General William Westmoreland regarding a place called Vietnam. How many dead Americans do you believe should qualify in "sticking it out" for a decidely less than noble cause? Should it be 25,000? Or should it be around 58,000, about the same number of Americans who died in another unnecessary war in Southeast Asia? More idiotic wars come along and still more people willing to sacrifice others, not the children of the elite, on the altar of militarism.

Al is there seven dwarf's sitting there with you or billy goat gruff,maybe a troll or two.Reality is a dark place for you and G.W.

Nick, don't be so mean to Egbert! If not for the brave warmongers like Egbert and Al, there would be no Freedom in the world!

*SOMEONE* has to insist on going to war all the time! Otherwise, countries could end up like CANADA!

No Quarter had the entire letter posted weeks ago.

Bambambam: read the whole letter. This guy is for real. Kevin may have cherry-picked the what-a-bunch-of-maroons highlights the same way TIME cherry-picked the oh-aren't-our-boys-keeping-their-sense-of-humor highlights, but the full letter is a clear-eyed, non-partisan slap of reality. Here are baby marines doing a better job than the grown-ups in power, and here are Iraqi police demonstrating incredible courage one minute and disgusting torture the next.

Read it.

Nick, I too noted and was offended by the off-handed insults typed by two previous posters. While I was thinking how to respond to their craven lack of, well, everything, I read your post.

I could not do better. Thanks.

"Found one left-leaning Marine officer. Good for you!" Frank J. (biggest chickenhawk in the USA)

Frank is insulted that this marine officer insulted his hero Bill O'Reilly. Other than that there is nothing liberal or conservative about this letter.

egbert is a parody, guys

sigh, ebert and Al are trolls guys. their comments are clearly being written by someone attempting to caricature conservatives.

The Deputy Prime Minister brought along an American security contractor (read mercenary), who told my Commanding General that he was there to act as a mediator between us and the Bad Guys.

Gee, I can see why a military member would see this as fraternizing with the enemy, but the Deputy Prime Minister must find a way to communicate with opposing forces, call it appeasement, or whatever, but eventually Iraqi leaders have to find some common ground and if that falls to the job to a American security contractor, than so be it.

I mean, lets face it, we aren't winning this war.

REad this letter over on Larry Johnsons site, No Quarter a few weeks ago.
As for there being "one" left leaning Marine...pfft, there are a lot more than just one.

Where the hell is anyone getting "leftist" off this letter?

And what says Devlin wrote it?

sigh, ebert and Al are trolls guys. their comments are clearly being written by someone attempting to caricature conservatives.

which is silly of them, because we have nathan caricaturing himself if we need that sort of thing

As soon as those making fun of Col. Devlin sign up to head over to Iraq I`ll start thinking of them as something other than a bunch of scared little punks sans intestinal fortitude.

Let us know when the papers are signed & you are on your way.

"Every once in a while, you've got to do something hard, do something you're not comfortable with. A person needs a gut check." - Corporal Chad Ritchie, U.S.M.C.

Does anybody else feel, after reading that letter, that they'd like to buy Col. Devlin a beer? Maybe his whole section? Man, I sure would...

Colonel, if you read this, send me an email, I mean it. I'm in CA, I'll hop a plane just to raise a frosty one with you.

Bambambam: read the whole letter. This guy is for real. Kevin may have cherry-picked the what-a-bunch-of-maroons highlights the same way TIME cherry-picked the oh-aren't-our-boys-keeping-their-sense-of-humor highlights, but the full letter is a clear-eyed, non-partisan slap of reality. Here are baby marines doing a better job than the grown-ups in power, and here are Iraqi police demonstrating incredible courage one minute and disgusting torture the next. Read it. Posted by: Yellow Dog

Who cares? This thing was a mistake from the beginning. Bless Kurdish independence (by leaving behind a few dozen piece of armor and crappy Blackhawk helicopters to keep the Iranians and Turks honest) and bring the troops home now. We cannot "fix Iraq" because it's a fake country. The only intelligent thing Bush ever said (though it's a given that it was written for him) is that nation-building doesn't work. Ever.

Bad guys? what is this? a Western?

Doctor Jay: Does anybody else feel, after reading that letter, that they'd like to buy Col. Devlin a beer?

I'll buy him a case of beer as soon as Kevin (or anyone) tells me how we know Devlin and the author of the "letter to home" are one and the same.

Type: devlin marine letter into Google and you get ZERO results.

What is Kevin's source that the letter author and Col. Devlin are the same person?

To Verify, WHO, and others:

A diary at Daily Kos over the weekend argued that this letter probably was written by Devlin. As far as I know, that diarist did original research and is the first to make that argument. Shame that Kevin did not give him a tip of the hat.

Perfect timing...two adorable little boys at the next table are listening to Green Day:

I beg to dream and differ from the hollow lies
This is the dawning of the rest of our lives

Say hi to the president gasman!

Until these tough as nails conservatives who are posting comments are willing to go over and there and fight and/or actually come up with a meaningful plan and timeline for success over in Iraq, then you right-wing failures out there don't have anything worth listening to.

For the past 3 1/2 years, we've been hearing the same garbage from you right-wingers. You think this guy's letter is just one man's opinion and he's some left-winger who doesn't know what's going on in Iraq, fine. But rather than dismissing him or engaging in bleeding right-wing rhetoric about how bad Saddam was, tell us how well the war in Iraq is going and how those of us who think it's a total or near total failure are wrong. Otherwise, just shut up and start whining about something else.

I am sure that no soldier called Walter Cronkite a buffoon during the Vietnam War.

The liberals are celebrating a letter which is nothing more than a symptom of the on-going devolution and debasement of our culture, where even the well meaning and patriotic broadcasters are fair game. Sadly the phenomenon has spread to our soldiers.

The author of that Daily Kos diary is 'Chris Copy Editor'. Here is the link

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2006/10/7/141136/955

Oh, well, if a diarist at Daily Kos said it, I'm sold. They're never wrong.

"Armor Piercing ammunition"

That would be from all those ammo dumps and weapons depots we left unguarded so they could be looted in April-May-etc 2003. Yep, that's your brilliant war planning at work.

American Hawk: Did you bother to read the diary? Or are you commenting out of ignorance of what he argued?

Oh, well, if a diarist at Daily Kos said it, I'm sold.

atta boy - don't consider the evidence, just go with your gut!

smintheus: A diary at Daily Kos over the weekend argued that this letter probably was written by Devlin. As far as I know, that diarist did original research and is the first to make that argument. Shame that Kevin did not give him a tip of the hat.

Yes, especially since he was asked outright and given the opportunity to credit the source of his speculation, presented as fact. So it's a shame also that he didn't characterize the melding of these two persons as "probable" (Which, itself, is stretching it based on my reading of the Kos diarist. Best evidence: Irish temper. Come on!), as opposed to the assertion he made that they are one person.

That would be from all those ammo dumps and weapons depots we left unguarded so they could be looted in April-May-etc 2003. Yep, that's your brilliant war planning at work.

Eh, I wouldn't read too much into that. Pretty much any rifle round, particularly ball ammo and not JHPs, will penetrate body armor.

Kevlar vests and flak jackets are designed to resist puncture and stop pistol caliber ammo. Anybody who knows anything about ballistics or has seen Mail Call knows the only way to stop your average rifle round is hard plate armor, the ceramic trauma plate type armor that a few units have...but not enough. The problem is that that shyte is HEAVY, and makes the soldier a LOT less mobile. Many soldiers and marines would prefer to be mobile over being bulletproof.

For the love of pete: rifle ammo IS armor piercing ammo. The idea that they've got some kinda super duper ammo that they wouldn't have had otherwise a few years back is silly. Any 7.62x39 round is gonna hop right through any ballistic vest going.

smintheus-- At the time I wrote that comment, a link wasn't posted, and I wasn't going to go on a daily kos scavenger hunt. I'm going to read it over and I'll be back shortly with my assessment. Thanks for posting the link.

Verify, WHO and others:

Whoever you are, your reading is not very careful. The diarist presented a number of reasons for associating Devlin with the senior Marine intelligence officer of the letter. For example, he pointed out that Devlin is known to have spoken in honor of the man whose death the letter writer noted in sorrow.

But on the other hand, sometimes sarcasm can indeed substitute for argument.

Perfect timing...two adorable little boys at the next table are listening to Green Day:Posted by: shortstop

You're not cruising Chuck E. Cheese again?

Okay,

Piece one: Irish temper-- People can say that without being Irish. Even if we take it literally, there's probably thousands to tens of thousands of Irish in Iraq right now.

Piece two: Both Delvin and the author of the email.... knew the same guy who died. They both ish he hadn't died.

That's... extremely circumstancial evidence.

Piece three: Both of them appear to have come to Iraq in February. Rotations happen in masses; natrally, many marines came in during February. Heck, since it's probably somebody in Delvin's general area, it's no surprise they rotated in together.

There's nothing that says it's *not* Delvin, but this is extremely weak evidence. I'm assuming Kevin has something stronger. Right Kevin?

It's possible Devlin wrote the letter, but it's also plausible that there would be other Marines who fit the circumstancial evidence outlined in the diary. If this is what Kevin is going on - and who knows, maybe he has independent confirmation - it's awfully odd to just present the assumption as fact.

smintheus: But on the other hand, sometimes sarcasm can indeed substitute for argument.

The argument is that speculation isn't evidence. And someone else's uncredited speculation, as in this case of Drum's reporting, is irresponsible and deceptive.

I am waiting for my brother (who actually knows Devlin) to email me back with his take on whether ot not Devlin wrote the letter. He retired in April a Lt. Colonel after 25 years in.

Oh, what the hell. Apparently, political animal is in fact free reporting mode, 'cuz elections are coming up. I'll join the club:

KARL ROVE HAS JUST BEEN INDICTED BY FITZGERALD.

ISRAELIS PERPETRATED 9/11.

THE ECONOMY IS IN A RECESSION.

NEW BATTLESTAR GALACTICA SIGNIFICIANTLY WORSE THAN ORIGINAL.

Most Profound Man in Iraq - an unidentified farmer in a fairly remote area who, after being asked by Reconnaissance Marines (searching for Syrians) if he had seen any foreign fighters in the area replied "Yes, you."

In a smarter world, the bullshit term 'foreign fighters' would be confined to the garbage disposal. To Iraqis, there are 140,000+ foreign fighters in Iraq.

But Wrath of Khan remains the Best. Star Trek. Ever.

Off-topic...but couldn't resist....

The Washington Post is reporting today, rather belatedly, that Kolbe (R- Arizona) was aware of Foley's salacious e-mails with an underage page in 2000. One of Foley's Instant Messages sent in January 2002 to a page stated that Kolbe once invited four pages to use his Washington home while Kolbe was in Arizona.

There is also much focus on the relationship between House Speaker Dennis Hastert and his chief of staff, 56-year old Scott Palmer. Hastert and Palmer, Hastert's longtime unmarried adviser, live together in a DC townhouse along with Hastert's Deputy Chief of Staff, Mike Stokke, while Hastert's wife Jean lives in Yorkville, Illinois and stays at a hotel when she visits Washington.

WMR has also learned of additional Senate links to the Pagegate scandal. There is much focus on GOP Sen. George Allen's predominantly white male staff. There is also interest in the activities of a senior GOP Senator from a Rocky Mountain state.

WMR's State Department sources have also reported that the visits of Hastert and other congressional leaders and staff members to certain Southeast Asian nations and the Northern Marianas should come under the scrutiny of the House Ethics Committee, now officially investigating "Pagegate." The Northern Marianas became infamous in the scandals involving Tom DeLay and Jack Abramoff because of the presence in the US slave labor territory of Asian children being used as prostitutes. Conveniently, Foley co-chaired the House Caucus on Missing and Exploited Children, which would have had authority to investigate charges of child prostitution in the Northern Marianas.

Our State Department sources report that it is no secret that a number of U.S. Foreign Service officers working out of the U.S. embassies in Bangkok, Phnom Penh, Hanoi, and Manila have been involved with underage nationals of the host countries where they are assigned. In fact, many have rotated their assignments between countries that look sideways at child prostitution and sex between adults and minors. In fact, John Mark Karr, as previously reported by WMR, was quickly whisked out of Bangkok after his arrest on pedophilia charges. The U.S. Embassy in Bangkok, working with the CIA and Department of Homeland Security, arranged for Karr's quick departure from Bangkok on a business class flight to the United States, where all charges, including those stemming from Karr's "admission" that he killed JonBenet Ramsey and child porn charges, were later dropped. WMR has learned that Karr may have been aware of the identities of top U.S. officials in the child sex trade in Thailand and that he was sprung from Thai authorities to prevent him from testifying in a Thai courtroom.

Global Citizen: But Wrath of Khan remains the Best. Star Trek. Ever.

Agreed. I was watching ith a friend when Spike re-aired it, and he thought it was odd that the sensors picked up 'minute traces of life' on Regula III (Regula II?), but not Khan and his men. I've always assumed that the minute traces of life WERE KHan and his men. It's interesting to get a fresh perspective on things, even though I don't think that's quite right. Actually, the whole 'planet blew up and altered our orbit' thing is so problematic, I'm not sure I want to get into it...

First Contact would, of course, be the second best ever.

I saw that yesterday, relevant. There is another Representative who needs to go.

Who would have ever thought you and I would reach consensus on anything? This is a starting place. My folks emigrated from Eastern Europe - I'll get you on my side yet.:)

American Hawk: Your summary of evidence the diarist presents is incomplete. In particular, you misrepresent the evidence regarding the death of Cpl. Bachar.

He was an intelligence analyst from the SAME Marine battalion as Devlin, who appears to have been the senior analyst in the unit (Devlin is described by the news report as "assistant chief of staff for Bachar's battalion"). The news report quotes Devlin prominently on Bachar's death. In the letter under discussion here, Develin says:

Saddest Moment - Having the battalion commander from 1st Battalion, 1st Marines hand me the dog tags of one of my Marines who had just been killed while on a mission with his unit. Hit by a 60mm mortar. Cpl Bachar was a great Marine. I felt crushed for a long time afterward. His picture now hangs at the entrance to the Intelligence Section. We'll carry it home with us when we leave in February.

That would be a very remarkable coincidence, if that is what it is. A Marine battalion consists of only a few companies, and it normally is commanded by a lt. colonel, sometimes by a colonel. How many more colonels are you going to try to shoe-horn into this particular battalion, besides Devlin? The letter writer pretty clearly is a colonel, or he would not be speaking up at a meeting with his commanding General.

WHO: I'm not criticizing your criticisms of KD for failing to identify the source and tentativeness of this identification. I criticized you for reducing the entire diarist's argument to "Irish temper".

The letter states that the body armor weighs 40 pounds. Doesn't sound like kevlar to me, rather ceramic plate. So, presumably the rounds that the letter writer is referring to are not ordinary rifle ammo.

Walter Cronkite = Bill O'Reilly???

I don't know whether to laugh or cry

smintheus: I criticized you for reducing the entire diarist's argument to "Irish temper".

Well, you know, you put your best foot forward, you lead with your best shot, and all that. In trying to persuade others to a point of view, one should present one's strongest evidence at the outset. The very fact that "Irish temper" was even included, much less led with, makes the entirety of the diarist's argument suspect.

That said, the Cpl Bachar connection is intriguing, if not conclusive.

But again, the thrust of all my comments has been pointed to the disingenuousness of Kevin Drum's matter of fact assertion regarding Devlin.

"the prospects for securing that country's western Anbar province are dim and that there is almost nothing the U.S. military can do to improve the political and social situation there."

That was before the Sunni tribal leaders united to drive out the insurgents, and promised to cooperate with the Iraqi government. It is true, of course, that in each part of Iraq the U.S. military can contribute almost nothing; almost everything has to be done by the government (in power less than a year now) in cooperation with local citizens.

Somebody already linked to this letter a while ago, two weeks or so.

Sebastian -- A kevlar vest won't weigh much more than 5-10 pounds. The 40 pound vest this marine is talking about has to be some sort of ceramic body armor, which a standard 7.62*39 round won't penetrate.

And I suspect that most soldiers would prefer to be mobile rather than bulletproof until they get shot.

But Wrath of Khan remains the Best. Star Trek. Ever.

Please. The entire Trek franchise, stacked one on top of another, every episode, every show, every movie and every trinket made still can't compare to Empire Strikes Back.

A kevlar vest won't weigh much more than 5-10 pounds.

The one I wore back when I was an inner-city paramedic weighed 11.5 lbs and made 95 degrees feel like 110, easy. But that was a long time ago, and I'm sure its a lot better now.

Apples and oranges my friend. One is about the future and the other is about the past.

But I am such a geek that I used to drive around with a Starfleet Academy window sticker, and two bumper stickers - One said Honk if you passed P-Chem and the other said Everyone has Avogadro's Number.

Nobody ever honked, but lots of people looked at me strangely.

Housekeeping: Time had the O'Reilly Buffoon blurb.

O'reilly is a buffoon. I've heard lots of officers say that.

A kevlar vest won't weigh much more than 5-10 pounds.

The one I wore back when I was an inner-city paramedic weighed 11.5 lbs and made 95 degrees feel like 110, easy. But that was a long time ago, and I'm sure its a lot better now. Posted by: Global Citizen

Vests using the newest version of ceramic armor weigh 16.1 pounds with the "tactical vest" being half the weight. The soldiers using them claim that they do not hamper mobility. I'm sure they bake you equally well with kevlar or ceramic plates. That they are not issued to all combat soldiers is criminal.

http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/systems/ground/interceptor.htm

I admit I was fuzzy on the weight thing, but I do know that to stop a rifle shot from just about any centerfire rifle cartridge .223 on up requires the ceramic trauma plate. I've read that only having them in the front is bad--soldiers hit from the rear have the round bounce off the plate and then have it cut through them a second time. Bad! Front and rear or not at all should be the way to go (and would explain the weight).

I was simply responding to the "armor piercing" bit--that bogey man of a term gets bandied about quite a bit, and it's the silliest thing going. What's funny is the .270 in my closet is orders of magnitude more powerful than a 7.62 or a 5.56 (.223, as in the good ole M16). Any centerfire rifle cartridge bigger than a .22 is going right on through body armor without a hard plate of some kind.

As for being mobile, that's simply what soldiers there have said from what I've read--I'm not aware of any scientific poll of what they'd prefer. It's kinda like saying I'd rather be wearing a helmet in my car on the way to work if I get in an accident--not really something you plan on. Most soldiers are getting taken out by IEDs and bombs and other such ambushes, and not small arms fire there, right?

Jay:

> I am sure that no soldier called Walter Cronkite
> a buffoon during the Vietnam War.

I am sure that no sensate American calls Bill O'Reilly a journalist.

Oh, and didn't you get the memo? Wingnuts hate Uncle
Walter now, cuz he lost the Vietnam war for us.

Bob

Does Devlin have a wife named Kathleen? That would seem to be the acid test of authorship.

I just got a five-word email from my brother:

"Sounds like Pete to me."

The story of the mercenary interaction has made the rounds, too.

The "vest" the Marine is talking about is likely the interceptor ceramic plate body armor plus the integrated ammo pouches filled with at least six 30 round magazines, pockets with grenades, etc. Part of the full "battle rattle." At least 40 pounds.

My favorite:

Best Chuck Norris Moment - 13 May. Bad Guys arrived at the government center in the small town of Kubaysah to kidnap the town mayor, since they have a problem with any form of government that does not include regular beheadings and women wearing burqahs. There were seven of them. As they brought the mayor out to put him in a pick-up truck to take him off to be beheaded (on video, as usual), one of the bad Guys put down his machine gun so that he could tie the mayor's hands. The mayor took the opportunity to pick up the machine gun and drill five of the Bad Guys. The other two ran away. One of the dead Bad Guys was on our top twenty wanted list. Like they say, you can't fight City Hall.

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The Marine Corps seems to have removed the link to the whole letter sometime this am (Tues October 10). It was there earlier this morning, and now no longer.

never mind -- it's back

"I am sure that no soldier called Walter Cronkite a buffoon during the Vietnam War."

I knew Walter Cronkite. Walter Cronkite was a friend of mine. And, Sir, Bill O'Reilly is no Walter Cronkite.

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