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Tilting at Windmills

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January 17, 2007
By: Kevin Drum

SACRIFICE....George Bush talks to Jim Lehrer about sacrifice and the Iraq war:

LEHRER: Let me ask you a bottom-line question, Mr. President. If it is as important as you've just said -- and you've said it many times -- as all of this is, particularly the struggle in Iraq, if it's that important to all of us and to the future of our country, if not the world, why have you not, as president of the United States, asked more Americans and more American interests to sacrifice something?....

PRESIDENT BUSH: Well, you know, I think a lot of people are in this fight. I mean, they sacrifice peace of mind when they see the terrible images of violence on TV every night.

Jeebus. Is Bush getting even worse with every passing day? I swear, he can hardly open his mouth these days without saying something so dumb and tin-eared it just makes your jaw drop. It's like reading the second half of "Flowers for Algernon."

Kevin Drum 11:49 AM Permalink | Trackbacks | Comments (225)

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Comments

"Is Bush getting even worse with every passing day?"

No, he's always been an incompetent shithead.

Posted by: cazart on January 17, 2007 at 12:01 PM | PERMALINK

Americans of all political stripes should view this clarion call for sacrifice as nothing less than an obscenity. Not just because the President's escalation supports no strategic military objective or because the vast majority of Americans oppose it, but because Bush's call for sacrifice comes five years too late. A quick comparison to FDR, an earlier president facing wartime crisis, shows why.

For the comparison, see:
"Bush and FDR on Sacrifice."

Posted by: AngryOne on January 17, 2007 at 12:03 PM | PERMALINK

If fighting in Iraq is as important to the future of the world as President Bush says, why doesn't Tony Blair and the Brits (and most of the rest of the Coalition of the Willing for that matter) support the surge?

Posted by: pj in jesusland on January 17, 2007 at 12:04 PM | PERMALINK

...and we're sacrificing peace of mind at this moment knowing there's a dunderhead in the White House.

Posted by: rusrus on January 17, 2007 at 12:04 PM | PERMALINK

Bush is not getting dumber. 'Twas ever thus.

But if you actually believed anything this pathetic moron told you about Iraq, the real question is, how dumb are you?

Posted by: olds88 on January 17, 2007 at 12:06 PM | PERMALINK

Remember, all the liberal hawks endorsed W's view and integrity over Al Gore's.

Posted by: Gore/Edwards 08 on January 17, 2007 at 12:06 PM | PERMALINK

Yeah but Algernon wasn't a sociopath...


Posted by: ROTFLMLiberalAO on January 17, 2007 at 12:10 PM | PERMALINK

Is Bush getting even worse with every passing day?

Hard to say. His public statements are certainly getting worse (loss of "peace of mind" equivalent to getting your legs blown off by an IED??!!), but there's no way to know if this is just a more candid expression of the world view he's always held, or if it's evidence that he's heading towards some imminent psychotic break.

Posted by: cyntax on January 17, 2007 at 12:11 PM | PERMALINK

By the same token, my peace of mind was destroyed when my wife forced me to watch Legally Blonde. My God, the sacrifices I make!

Posted by: ajl on January 17, 2007 at 12:13 PM | PERMALINK

Be fair - the guy's never actually had to sacrifice anything in his sixty-odd years of privileged, cosseted, bailed-out-by-Dad's-buddies life. Of course he has a tin ear about such things.

Besides, to GWB, watching the news is a sacrifice in a very real sense. The news increasingly is absolute proof that he's screwed up yet again, and it terrifies him.

I'm very glad I'm not George w. Bush.

Posted by: Paul or the Giant Rabbit on January 17, 2007 at 12:13 PM | PERMALINK

think a lot of people are in this fight. I mean, they sacrifice peace of mind when they see the terrible images of violence on TV every night.

I swear, he can hardly open his mouth these days without saying something so dumb and tin-eared it just makes your jaw drop.

Hah? Why Kevin? Is it because you aren't sacrificing your peace of mind when you see American soldiers killed by terrorists because leftists like yourself are rooting for America to fail in Iraq? Yeah, that makes sense.

Posted by: Al on January 17, 2007 at 12:13 PM | PERMALINK

so clearly, if our country took the advice of, say, the commenters at Protein Wisdom, and required the media to show only nice images from Iraq, we wouldn't even have to suffer from unpeaceful minds!

Posted by: cleek on January 17, 2007 at 12:14 PM | PERMALINK
Is Bush getting even worse with every passing day?

No. But the deferential attitude of the media is progressively eroding, and revealing what's always been there.

Posted by: cmdicely on January 17, 2007 at 12:15 PM | PERMALINK

This statement isn't stupid. It's plainly George Bush's way of endorsing the media's gloomy portrayal of events in Iraq. In fact, he's demanding that the coverage become gloomier, so as to sacrifice more of Mr. & Mrs. America's peace of mind.

Posted by: Grumpy on January 17, 2007 at 12:17 PM | PERMALINK

One of the scarier things about the current Bush WH is that they don't seem to care anymore how what they do or say is perceived. Bush's comment is just an example of that sloppiness. Another example of their indifference to perception is the current systematic firing of the DOJ lawyers. If the WH had any concern about political "optics", they would not have engaged in such a ham-handed act of revenge.

The WH now looks like a team that knows it's lost its political clout irretrievably, and is just doing and saying what it feels like doing and saying. Acting out on vile impulses is a perfectly OK thing to do, from their point of view, because they have nothing to lose. And if there's anything obvious about Bush's personality, it's that he's a truly petulant and spiteful man, with a chip on his shoulder that grows by the day.

These last two years are not going to be pretty.

Posted by: frankly0 on January 17, 2007 at 12:18 PM | PERMALINK

Just wondering if you're still a fan of "24".

Posted by: Cyn2 on January 17, 2007 at 12:18 PM | PERMALINK

Lehrer is a bad example, being the obedient lapdog he is, but I swear I am starting to hear some actual questioning of authority from the MSM.

Reporters and anchors may not yet be challenging shrub to his face, but a few are actually following up with "that was not correct" or "the report actually states" or "in fact, what happened was."

Way too little way too late - and they're probably rediscovering their ability to bite just in time to make life hell for the Democratic candidates.

Funny how the pendulum swings are always timed so that republican presidents get all the slobbery kisses from the MSM and Democratic ones get all the rabid bites.

Posted by: Yellow Dog on January 17, 2007 at 12:18 PM | PERMALINK

If the sanitized versions of the war which are allowed national coverage cause anguish, imagine what more visceral views would do.

But is he worse? Yes, because now that he is a lame duck, his handlers are letting him talk off script more. Maybe the goal is to make any other Republican look more presidential than this guy????

Posted by: ml on January 17, 2007 at 12:20 PM | PERMALINK

Hah? Why Kevin? Is it because you aren't sacrificing your peace of mind when you see American soldiers killed by terrorists because leftists like yourself are rooting for America to fail in Iraq? Yeah, that makes sense.
Posted by: Al

Nice try Al, but what's at issue is the equivalency of this "sacrifice" with what the soldiers are being asked to do and with the sacrifices asked of the homefront during previous wars.

This is the only president in history to engage in a war without levying taxes to support it contemporaneously with fighting it. Why is that?

Posted by: cyntax on January 17, 2007 at 12:20 PM | PERMALINK

Kevin, thank you for high-lighting this. When I heard the interview, that exchange immediately grabbed my attention.

I thought it was the sorriest thing I have ever heard a leader say in such a situation and I expected it to be a focus of today's commentary.

But, no.

Once gain you are more than eaning your pay.

Posted by: Keith G on January 17, 2007 at 12:26 PM | PERMALINK

"Like reading the second half of "Flowers for Algernon."
That would be true if, in the story, the doctors involved and Ms. Kinneman had the 'operashun' with the effect being a temporary LOWERING of their awareness.
Charilie's progriss riport never changes! Only the perceptions of those around him.

Posted by: jay boilswater on January 17, 2007 at 12:26 PM | PERMALINK

The similarities between Rove's BushSpeak and Orwell's NewSpeak have been mentioned before. Here is another example. The obscenity of comparing death, injury and destruction with not seeing nice images on the television and being worried about the future is beyond the pale. I am not sure but I would guess he and his handlers belief that if he repeats it often enough, the American people will agree the unpleasantness we see on television each night equals the genuine sacrifices of our soldiers, the Iraqi people and our grandchildren who will ultimately pay for his optional war.

Unbelievable, I thought 1984 had become a historical footnote. I guess it is the Bush administration's model for America.

Posted by: Ron Byers on January 17, 2007 at 12:26 PM | PERMALINK
Way too little way too late - and they're probably rediscovering their ability to bite just in time to make life hell for the Democratic candidates.

Um, even when fawning over the lies spewing from the White House in this administration, the media never lost its ability to attack Democratic candidates on real or imagined grounds.

Posted by: cmdicely on January 17, 2007 at 12:28 PM | PERMALINK

I can't count how many times I have heard him discuss violence on TV when someone asks him about the war. I think the first time I noticed it was during the press conference in April, 2004 when he was asked whether he had ever made any mistakes ("something will pop into my head here ..."). Someone asked him about the war and he said "nobody likes to see dead people on their television screens..."
It seems like such a disconnect; the actual death and destruction is not the problem, it's that he might have to see it on TV. I guess reality is just a theory to a man in a bubble.

Posted by: MP on January 17, 2007 at 12:29 PM | PERMALINK

"It's like reading the second half of 'Flowers for Algernon.'"

Yeah, but we never got to see the first half.

This administration has been a bit like a twisted version of "Of Mice and Men," where Lennie has been put in charge and his name has become George, and the character of the original George has been turned into a dark-hearted manipulative liar called Cheney.

Posted by: WCharles on January 17, 2007 at 12:34 PM | PERMALINK

What are we sacrificing? The Center for American Progress reports:

$1.2 trillion: With the money going to the Iraq war, the United States could set up a universal health care system, provide universal preschool, carry out the recommendations of the 9/11 commission, double cancer research funding, increase funding to Gulf Coast reconstruction, and enact a "global immunization campaign to save millions of children's lives."

Posted by: asdfg on January 17, 2007 at 12:38 PM | PERMALINK

george bush, Well, you know, I think a lot of people are in this fight. I mean, they sacrifice peace of mind when they see the terrible images of violence on TV every night.


Isn't that exactly the Republican view, though? If they even know it exists and they can't excercise immediate control over it they're wildly upset and beside themselves.

Posted by: cld on January 17, 2007 at 12:46 PM | PERMALINK

cmdicely - absolutely right. I should have clarified that the MSM seems to defer to elected authority only when that authority is republican. Democrats get attacked whether they are the elected authority or not.

Posted by: Yellow Dog on January 17, 2007 at 12:47 PM | PERMALINK

You really should have gotten the whole quote

MR. LEHRER: Let me ask you a bottom-line question, Mr. President. If it is as important as you've just said - and you've said it many times - as all of this is, particularly the struggle in Iraq, if it's that important to all of us and to the future of our country, if not the world, why have you not, as president of the United States, asked more Americans and more American interests to sacrifice something? The people who are now sacrificing are, you know, the volunteer military - the Army and the U.S. Marines and their families. They're the only people who are actually sacrificing anything at this point.

PRESIDENT BUSH: Well, you know, I think a lot of people are in this fight. I mean, they sacrifice peace of mind when they see the terrible images of violence on TV every night. I mean, we've got a fantastic economy here in the United States, but yet, when you think about the psychology of the country, it is somewhat down because of this war.

Now, here in Washington when I say, "What do you mean by that?," they say, "Well, why don't you raise their taxes; that'll cause there to be a sacrifice." I strongly oppose that. If that's the kind of sacrifice people are talking about, I'm not for it because raising taxes will hurt this growing economy. And one thing we want during this war on terror is for people to feel like their life's moving on, that they're able to make a living and send their kids to college and put more money on the table. And you know, I am interested and open-minded to the suggestion, but this is going to be

(emphasis added)

so, y'kno, being scared is a sacrifice, but let's just everyone move on. and btw i'm not rasing taxes.


and yes, he's always been that stupid. where the hell have you been?

Posted by: e1 on January 17, 2007 at 12:49 PM | PERMALINK

i wish al would come back from vacation. that sub is lame.

Posted by: benjoya on January 17, 2007 at 12:49 PM | PERMALINK

Bush Kettle, me pot, vis a vis spelling at least:

"rasing taxes" == raising taxes

carry on.

Posted by: e1 on January 17, 2007 at 12:51 PM | PERMALINK

Ah, I see that Chickenshit Al is still here. Go to Iraq, you miserable worm of a coward.

Every word that Bush says, including "a", "the" and "and", is a lie.

Of course, my comment is a takeoff.

Posted by: POed Lib on January 17, 2007 at 12:55 PM | PERMALINK

asdfg wrote: What are we sacrificing? The Center for American Progress reports: [...]

Not to mention, develop and deploy clean, renewable electricity generation from wind turbines and photovoltaics and a new-generation smart electrical grid and new-generation electric vehicles to eliminate all oil imports and thus the "need" to wage wars of aggression to control the world's oil supplies, and to solve the problem of global warming.

Posted by: SecularAnimist on January 17, 2007 at 12:55 PM | PERMALINK

Bush in 60minutes said the soldiers are volunteers, so they are at his disposal, Rumsfeld said much the same, the troops have no right to complain. A draft would not allow him to say such a thing. To pay taxes is bad for the economy, not a sacrifice any true Republican should have to make. So the draft and taxes is out that leaves the terrible sacrifice of shopping, go to the mall it is what the country needs.

Posted by: Renate on January 17, 2007 at 12:59 PM | PERMALINK

Poor Americans, they see the violence on TV every night, what fragile and sensible souls. But he sleeps well.

Posted by: Renate on January 17, 2007 at 1:05 PM | PERMALINK

Don't forget the most fateful day of the Bush presidency-the PREZTEL CHOKING incident.

I'm convinced the oxygen deprivation caused by that nefarious carbohydrate snack item (some reports had Bush completely unconscious) caused an already borderline psychotic to totally degrade into the criminally insane lunatic we have today.

Posted by: Martin Morgan on January 17, 2007 at 1:09 PM | PERMALINK

In the last 3 or so years, I, personally, have been perceiving a deterioration in Bush's mental abilities. I honestly believe he has some kind of progressive brain disease or injury, and I'm not just writing that to be provocative.

If you really want to freak out, look around for video of him in his debates with Ann Richards. He's fairly lucid, speaks in paragraphs, can marshall facts and figures to support his arguments, etc. He's not exactly Bill Clinton out there, but when you see that video, you literally will not believe it's Bush.

Posted by: Raleigh on January 17, 2007 at 1:11 PM | PERMALINK

Al said, "Is it because you aren't sacrificing your peace of mind when you see American soldiers killed by terrorists because leftists like yourself are rooting for America to fail in Iraq?"

OK, so I should listen to you wise, longtime posters and just ignore Al. But it's difficult to ignore such an ass.

Al, I defy you to present any evidence that liberals are "rooting for America to fail in Iraq." The fact is liberals would have loved for the U.S. to march into Iraq and find all those WMDs AND be greeted like liberators, just as was described by the administration when speaking their expectations. But it was liberals, true liberals, who saw all this mess coming - 4 YEARS AGO. And so if liberals seem to be gloating a bit now it is because they're just so dammed right.

Posted by: Lamonte on January 17, 2007 at 1:18 PM | PERMALINK

"I think it's pretty obvious that this war is no pleasure for me. For five years I have been separated from the rest of the world. I haven't been to the theater, I haven't heard a concert, and I haven't seen a movie."

-- Hitler, August 1944

Posted by: Bruce Moomaw on January 17, 2007 at 1:21 PM | PERMALINK

It's like reading the second half of "Flowers for Algernon."

I really think Kevin is being a little unfair to Charlie Gordon here.

Posted by: Peter Principle on January 17, 2007 at 1:23 PM | PERMALINK

"If you really want to freak out, look around for video of him in his debates with Ann Richards. He's fairly lucid, speaks in paragraphs, can marshall facts and figures to support his arguments, etc."

That was not GWB debating Richards--that was his stunt double. Unfortuantely, the stunt double opposed the war in Iraq--he didn't trust that Chalabi character--and was fired back in 2002, so GWB now has to make these appearances himself, with unfortunate results for the country.

Posted by: rea on January 17, 2007 at 1:26 PM | PERMALINK

Thanks for the full quote, e1.

"I mean, we've got a fantastic economy here in the United States, but yet, when you think about the psychology of the country, it is somewhat down because of this war."

There ya go. Bush admits that his war is hurting the economy. Has he considered that the economy would be even more "fantastic" if people didn't have a war to worry about?

Posted by: Grumpy on January 17, 2007 at 1:28 PM | PERMALINK

I think what we've got to look forward to over the next two years is all kinds of random, pointless actions from the Bush WH.

This is really the garbage time of the Bush Presidency. The game is lost, everybody knows it, and crazy stuff is all we're going to see.

Posted by: frankly0 on January 17, 2007 at 1:49 PM | PERMALINK

I don't quite agree. It is like reading an alternative version of Flowers for Algernon where the guy is always an idiot--he just gets more idiotic and people become more willing to call him on it at the end. I certainly missed the part where George Bush was a temporary genius.

Posted by: SS on January 17, 2007 at 2:02 PM | PERMALINK

Bush is suffering from increasing brain damage caused by farting and holding his own head under the covers.

This is in addition to all the previous damage.

Posted by: Ranger Jay on January 17, 2007 at 2:05 PM | PERMALINK

Is Bush getting even worse with every passing day?

No, he has always been this dumb. That is why for the first four years of his admin, he wasn't allowed to talk to the press. It's just that now we are hearing the guy -- uncoached, unscripted, and no Rove talkinign in his ear -- speak his mind, such as it is.

Posted by: Disputo on January 17, 2007 at 2:11 PM | PERMALINK

Terrible images of violence. Reads like a popular YouTube video or a TV executive's dream program.

Posted by: Brojo on January 17, 2007 at 2:14 PM | PERMALINK

--reading the second half of "Flowers for Algernon."

Oh Jeebus Kevin, like Bush was ever the first half of "Flowers for Algernon".

Bush was the brain that NEVER was dude, I guess that is why I never understood centrist Dems I guess, wanted to meet Bush half-way. Repugs under Bush were not centrist or even really right-wing. When was conservativism the same as dictatorship, why is war hidden? It was all hedged to look like capitalism was democracy, corporate control was freedom but somehow government control was considered not-freedom? Repugs surely lost their way. Conservatives turned like worm into something hideous, without ethics and morality.

Posted by: Cheryl on January 17, 2007 at 2:21 PM | PERMALINK

I feel at a terrible disadvantage, having only seen the Cliff Robertson movie, and that probably 25 years ago. But Bush's remark is jaw-droppingly dumb and insensitive. See, those of us who don't watch a lot of TV news, we haven't sacrificed anything. So the Iraqis don't have to be grateful to us.

Posted by: Wendy on January 17, 2007 at 2:24 PM | PERMALINK

[W]hy have you not, as president of the United States, asked more Americans and more American interests to sacrifice something?

...Lehrer asked the one who insists on paying for his war's ruinous cost with a tax cut. "Nuff said.

Posted by: Gregory on January 17, 2007 at 2:29 PM | PERMALINK

I cringed when I read Bush's answer to that question. I agree with Kevin's criticism.

I also cringed when I saw that ridiculous question, Lehrer ought to have asked Bush what Americans can do to help our side win in Iraq, not how we can sacrifice. Pointless sacrifice does no good for anyone.

Posted by: ex-liberal on January 17, 2007 at 2:34 PM | PERMALINK

My thanks to Kevin, Froomkin, and others for watching this man on TV. I cannot do it anymore, especially when he is without a script.

Posted by: Hedley Lamarr on January 17, 2007 at 2:41 PM | PERMALINK

Pointless sacrifice does no good for anyone.

One wonders why, then, "ex-liberal" is so enthusiastic about the pointless sacrifice of blood and treasure we're making in Iraq.

Oh, wait -- it isn't "ex-liberal"'s blood or treasure (see: tax cuts), is it? Well, carry on then.

By the way, "ex-liberal," your abilities as a media critic match yours as a military and political analyst: piss-poor.

Posted by: Gregory on January 17, 2007 at 2:42 PM | PERMALINK

I bit off thread but Kevin would never cover this:

1. Yesterday, Kofi Annan's former right-hand man at the United Nations, Benon Sevan, was indicted by a federal grand jury for bribery and conspiracy to commit wire fraud in connection with the U.N.'s Oil for Food program. Does the fact that the Oil for Food program turned into one of history's biggest frauds, while propping up Saddam's regime in the meantime, discredit the U.N.?

The above was from Powerline. The list of UN scandals is getting quite extensive. For you libs thinking we're going to embrace the UN once GWB is out of office you are out of your mind. The most likely scenario is a GOP attack on the UN to expose liberals as appeasing saps.

Posted by: rdw on January 17, 2007 at 2:48 PM | PERMALINK

So, like, if my son watches more TV between now and the time he is 18 can he say he's done his national service and not have to register with the Selective Service?

Posted by: pj in jesusland on January 17, 2007 at 2:56 PM | PERMALINK

Shorter rdw: I read Powerline so you don't have to!

Rest assured, rdw, it's long been obvious that only a Powerline reader could adopt the foolishly triumphalist tone you do.

Posted by: Gregory on January 17, 2007 at 3:00 PM | PERMALINK

Lehrer ought to have asked Bush what Americans can do to help our side win in Iraq, not how we can sacrifice. Pointless sacrifice does no good for anyone.

Sure, that would have been a good question. But Bush would have given an equally stupid answer. Because he doesn't want to tell people to buy smaller cars or hybrid cars, and to drive less, and to fly less, and to buy fewer petroleum products, and to enact laws that reward this behavior and penalize the opposite behavior. He doesn't want to tell people to support legislation to end tax cuts and to create a new tax on energy derived from petroleum to support his war. He doesn't want to put a lot of money into developing the alternative energy sources that will be THE KEY to attaining stability in the Middle East.

Bush says he doesn't care about being popular, and it's true that he doesn't care about being popular with the average citizen. But he cares deeply about being popular with his "base"--the richest 1% of Americans--of whom he is one. And he'll have even more money when he inherits his parents' fortune. That's why he won't ask Americans to make needful sacrifices. His based doesn't want any f---ing around with the consumer-based economy.

And by the way, even pointless sacrifice, when it is shaped by a great leader, can become a powerful symbol that unites people behind a cause. But of course we have a pathetically tin-eared, incompetent leader.

Posted by: cowalker on January 17, 2007 at 3:07 PM | PERMALINK

This Bircher anti-UN stuff is so tired. It is like they are part of the vanguard of 1960.

How old are these boring guys anyway?

Posted by: bellumregio on January 17, 2007 at 3:10 PM | PERMALINK

One thing for sure, W. isn't sacrificing any peace of mind over the war. He brags about how well he sleeps at night. Face it, any sane person in his position wouldn't sleep very well.

Posted by: fafner1 on January 17, 2007 at 3:17 PM | PERMALINK

I'm convinced that if Bush dropped his pants and defecated on camera, MSM would report it as a rare moment when the prez showed us his human side, and allowed the public to see a side of him we've never seen before.

Posted by: meade on January 17, 2007 at 3:18 PM | PERMALINK

*I thought it was the sorriest thing I have ever heard a leader say in such a situation and I expected it to be a focus of today's commentary.*

You may have forgotten this little gem on the #1 tee: "There are a few killers who want to stop the peace process that we have started, and we must not let them. I call upon all nations to do everything they can to stop these terrorist killers. Now, watch this drive."

Posted by: wishIwuz2 on January 17, 2007 at 3:21 PM | PERMALINK

Peace of mind ought not be a primary experience when the nation is at war. This is how distorted we've become. In the real world, all should share the sacrifice in war, and nearly everyone left behind would have someone to worry about on the front lines. There will always be moments of tranquility, even with these worries, but it shouldn't be primary and clearly wouldn't be disturbed by images on a TV (since these people would probably want to be watching TV to get some inkling of how things are going and whether success is coming so their loved one[s] may come home).

Posted by: Jimm on January 17, 2007 at 3:23 PM | PERMALINK

They also serve who only stand and wait.--John Milton

Can anybody doubt that we at home also sacrifice? As a nation we have sacrificed our honor and credibility over this fiasco in Iraq, not to mention seeing our freedoms eroded.

Posted by: Tom Courts on January 17, 2007 at 3:23 PM | PERMALINK

Of course, when I mention "war", this is pointing out why Bush's conception is wrong, since he feels we're in a "war" in Iraq.

I don't.

We are occupying Iraq...the war was over a long time ago.

Posted by: Jimm on January 17, 2007 at 3:24 PM | PERMALINK

Can anybody doubt that we at home also sacrifice? As a nation we have sacrificed our honor and credibility over this fiasco in Iraq, not to mention seeing our freedoms eroded.

Well put.

Posted by: Jimm on January 17, 2007 at 3:25 PM | PERMALINK

During the California electricity crisis, people who had to heat their hot tubs just a few hours per day instead of 24, or who had to raise their indoor daytime air temperature to 76, also referred to these changes as sacrifice. This is a little less than the "sacrifices" our forebears made crossing the Great Plains.

Posted by: MatthewRMarler on January 17, 2007 at 3:32 PM | PERMALINK

I also cringed when I saw that ridiculous question, Lehrer ought to have asked Bush what Americans can do to help our side win in Iraq, not how we can sacrifice. Pointless sacrifice does no good for anyone.
Posted by: ex-liberal

Since Gregory covered the glaring irony of ex-lib's statement so handily in regards to the watr, no reason to revisit. But I was amused that ex-lib didn't give the benefit of the doubt to President Bush that Jim Lehrer obviously did. Namely that if Bush asked the public to sacrifice that of course it would be a substantive contribution to our success in Iraq.

But I have to say (for the first time ever), I'm with ex-lib on this: just cause President Bush asks for a sacrifice doesn't mean it would make a difference. Thankfully we've got the 110th Congress to keep an eye on these details-- lawd knows they've got their work cut out for them.

Posted by: cyntax on January 17, 2007 at 3:34 PM | PERMALINK

only a Powerline reader could adopt the foolishly triumphalist tone you do.

American exceptionalism is real. It needs to be touted as the model for the rest of the world to follow.

As the same time loser instititions as well as loser ideologies need to be exposed as failures. The UN is a total failure. We need to set it up as an example for what not to do. The advantage of sending up John Bolton as the Ambassador was to develop a talented and articulate expert on the rot inside the UN who could then retire at a young age to work at conservative think tanks or organize the opposition to the UN.

One of the great ironies of politics is that with a Conservative President in office the rest of the conservative world is obligated to follow his lead. Or in this case, go easier on the UN than it otherwise would. Once the 2008 begins this 'moratorium' will end and the effort at fully discrediting the UN will gain considerable momentum. It will become politically impossible for any Democratic candidate for President to embrace the UN. Moreover, if a Democrat were to win it would remain open season on the UN for the next 4 years.

Posted by: rdw on January 17, 2007 at 3:37 PM | PERMALINK

As the same time loser instititions as well as loser ideologies need to be exposed as failures.

Oh, don't worry, rdw, they are, they are.

Posted by: Gregory on January 17, 2007 at 3:43 PM | PERMALINK

Lehrer asked the one who insists on paying for his war's ruinous cost with a tax cut.

It's called brilliant economic management. We are entering the 6th year of a powerful recovery with record high stock market averages, very low unemployment, inflation and interest rates as well as surging tax collections AND surging exports. These tax cuts, like the various Reagan supply-side cuts, are what have separated the amazing US economy from Old Europe. We remain the worlds greatest ecnomic power and our share of Global GDP is GROWING not shrinking.

It's a clear example of American Exceptionalism. The rich keep on getting rich.

Posted by: rdw on January 17, 2007 at 3:47 PM | PERMALINK

During the California electricity crisis, people who had to heat their hot tubs just a few hours per day instead of 24, or who had to raise their indoor daytime air temperature to 76, also referred to these changes as sacrifice. This is a little less than the "sacrifices" our forebears made crossing the Great Plains.
Posted by: MatthewRMarler

Go back to Little Green Footballs or whatever pond you crawled out of. This crisis was brought to us by none other than Enron, who under this administration helped shape the nation's energy policy. The minutes of that meeting Cheney is still jealously guarding.

If all you can manage to from what happened in California is a non-equivalent comparison between pioneers and corporate pillaging of the 7th largest economy in the world, you are a seriously under-powered in an intellectual capacity.

Posted by: cyntax on January 17, 2007 at 3:48 PM | PERMALINK

The advantage of sending up John Bolton as the Ambassador was to develop a talented and articulate expert on the rot inside the UN who could then retire at a young age to work at conservative think tanks or organize the opposition to the UN.

I have to admit, I admire rdw's chutzpah at spinning the failure of Bush to get Bolton's nomination through a Republican Senate as a success. But then the Drexel Hill Dimwit goes and ruins it with this:

One of the great ironies of politics is that with a Conservative President in office the rest of the conservative world is obligated to follow his lead.

...except, of course, that the Republican Senate didn't -- twice, yet.

Ah, rdw -- he never ceases to amuse.

Posted by: Gregory on January 17, 2007 at 3:48 PM | PERMALINK

don't worry, rdw, they are, they are.

You mean like the vaunted CUBAN socialized health care system? Libs still think it's to die for. And Fidel is doing just that. He had a simple case of diverticulitis and they butchered 3 different operations each time making it worse. They are literally killing him. Tell me that's not justice!!!!

Posted by: rdw on January 17, 2007 at 3:52 PM | PERMALINK

American exceptionalism is real. It needs to be touted as the model for the rest of the world to follow.

How can the rest of the world follow an "exceptional" model? If it's an exception it can hardly be the model, now can it?

More and more I'm coming around to the idea that rdw is a brilliant parodist rather than an insane sad old man....

Posted by: Stefan on January 17, 2007 at 3:57 PM | PERMALINK

the failure of Bush to get Bolton's nomination through a Republican Senate as a success

I didn't say that as a success. I said appointing him was a success. He's still ambassador Bolton. He has all of the fame, exposure and experience of every other Ambassador. The Senate vote changes none of that.

Now he's out of govt making a fortune in the private sector working for the effort to permanently destroy the UN. He's doing the speaker circuit, giving lectures and will be writing books. He's a relatively young man with a full career, a very lucrative career, yet in front of him.

You are of course aware getting blocked by the Senate adds to his reputation among conservatives. He gets to charge even more. The man is a sharp and gifted speaker. He will be quite an asset.

Posted by: rdw on January 17, 2007 at 3:59 PM | PERMALINK

If it's an exception it can hardly be the model, now can it?

Don't be silly. It's really not hard. Michael Jordan and Tiger Woods are each the exception AND the model for their respective sports. Few of us could ever dream of have the talent of these two men but their hard work and smart decisions are worthly of admiration and emulation.

America is what the rest of the world needs to aspire to become.

Posted by: rdw on January 17, 2007 at 4:04 PM | PERMALINK

al: Is it because you aren't sacrificing your peace of mind when you see American soldiers killed by terrorists

more people are murdered in washington d.c. everyday...

Posted by: wingnuttery on January 17, 2007 at 4:12 PM | PERMALINK

RDW: "America is what the rest of the world needs to aspire to become."

Yes, because every other country in the world deserves to have a leader as capable as George Bush

Posted by: Botecelli on January 17, 2007 at 4:13 PM | PERMALINK

Stefan wrote: More and more I'm coming around to the idea that rdw is a brilliant parodist rather than an insane sad old man

I agree.

Posted by: Gregory on January 17, 2007 at 4:14 PM | PERMALINK

This crisis was brought to us by none other than Enron

The crisis was brought about by the twits in California. And the news is it's going to happen again. Look for Texas, Arizona and Nevada based utilities to reap a windfall supplying the airheads with juice for their many toys. I do so admire that hollywood crowd. I mean is anyone more dedicated to the environment than leonardo?

Have you ever seen a better saleman for hybrids? I wonder if he uses his hybrid to cool his 15,000 sq ft home? Ya think? I wonder if his private jet is a hybrid? Ya think?

Posted by: rdw on January 17, 2007 at 4:19 PM | PERMALINK

The crisis was brought about by the twits in California.

Yeah, that's true, because there are those tape recordings of the twits in California conspiring with utilities to manipulate energy supplies. Oh, wait...

Posted by: Gregory on January 17, 2007 at 4:29 PM | PERMALINK

I do so admire that hollywood crowd. I mean is anyone more dedicated to the environment than leonardo?
rdw

That makes about as much sense as the rest of your ravings: Hollywood=California.

But hey, why start using your brain now when you can regurgitate powerline and Rush Limbaugh talking points?

Basically rdw, you aspire to the most corrosive aspects of the American Dream: to be a robber baron. Ah, how you must pine for the Gilded Age.

Posted by: cyntax on January 17, 2007 at 4:38 PM | PERMALINK

Deer Keven;

My name is Charlie Gordon and i didnet like your sayin i was like the presnit! I nevur hurten anybodie so STOP IT!

Charlie

Posted by: Charlie Gordon on January 17, 2007 at 4:47 PM | PERMALINK

cyntax to rdw: "But hey, why start using your brain now when you can regurgitate powerline and Rush Limbaugh talking points?"

The unfortunate rdw suffers from irreversible, progressive senile dementia. He's a "Reagan conservative".

Posted by: SecularAnimist on January 17, 2007 at 4:48 PM | PERMALINK

have all of you forgotten? Bush asked, no demanded, heroic sacrifice after 9/11. He demanded you go "shopping."

What? None of your struggled to plunk down plastic for things we desire? None of your number resisted the almost impossible task of givng in to the clarion calls of sales?

None of you resisted not leaving grad school and enlisting in the military so you could risk your lives in the Mesopotamian War of Prevention?

Whither the patriots?

Posted by: Allen on January 17, 2007 at 4:48 PM | PERMALINK

The unfortunate rdw suffers from irreversible, progressive senile dementia. He's a "Reagan conservative".
Posted by: SecularAnimist

Ah, thanks for the clarification SA. That would explain his near manic postings about it being morning again in America economically speaking... if you're already rich.

Posted by: cyntax on January 17, 2007 at 5:05 PM | PERMALINK

"he (Bush: maf) can hardly open his mouth these days without saying something so dumb and tin-eared it just makes your jaw drop"

And just how is this phenomenon anything _new_?????

Posted by: michael farris on January 17, 2007 at 5:07 PM | PERMALINK

"The man [John Bolton] is a sharp and gifted speaker. He will be quite an ass."

Fixed it for you.

Posted by: just sayin on January 17, 2007 at 5:22 PM | PERMALINK

rdw wrote: "You are of course aware getting blocked by the Senate adds to his reputation among conservatives."

Yes, I have noticed that so-called "conservatives" admire liars, criminals, gangsters and thugs like John Bolton.

"The man is a sharp and gifted speaker."

So was Hitler.

"He will be quite an asset."

Bolton will no doubt be an asset to the corporate-funded right wing extremist propaganda machine in their ongoing efforts to brainwash ignorant, weak-minded, gullible dupes like yourself.

Posted by: SecularAnimist on January 17, 2007 at 5:37 PM | PERMALINK

rdw wrote: "American exceptionalism is real. It needs to be touted as the model for the rest of the world to follow."

It sounds like rdw is advocating that "the rest of the world" should invade America under false pretenses, occupy the country with thousands of troops, overthrow the government, kill tens of thousands of innocent civilians, wreck our cities and destroy our infrastructure, seize control of our valuable natural resources, precipitate a religious civil war, and execute Bush by hanging.

Posted by: SecularAnimist on January 17, 2007 at 5:48 PM | PERMALINK

The apple falls close to the shrub:

"Why should we hear about body bags and deaths? It's not relevant. So why should I waste my beautiful mind on something like that?"

--Barbara Bush, Good Morning America, 3/18/03

Posted by: Dwight on January 17, 2007 at 5:48 PM | PERMALINK

he's drinking again.....

Posted by: sandiford on January 17, 2007 at 5:56 PM | PERMALINK

you aspire to the most corrosive aspects of the American Dream: to be a robber baron. Ah, how you must pine for the Gilded Age.

You think the robber barons had anything on Bill Gates, Warren Buffett, The Waltons, Larry Ellison, Michael Dell, Oprah or the other 320 American billionaires?

How about Michael Jordan, Tiger Woods, George Clooney, Michael Moore, Madonna, Bill Clinton, etc.?

This is the guilded age my friend. Have you seen the size of the average American home and the list of appliances in it? American closets are bigger than British flats. 90% of American fireplaces installed in the last 3 years work on remote control.

Are you kidding me?

Life isn't just good in America. It is very, very good.

Posted by: rdw on January 17, 2007 at 6:05 PM | PERMALINK

I didn't read the first half of The Flowers of Algernon, Kevin, but this idiotic statement simply reinforces my belief that Bush is a delusional sociopath who cannot understand other's suffering and has never been held accountable for anything in is life.

Impeachment would be a teachable moment for this loser.

Posted by: The Conservative Deflator on January 17, 2007 at 6:08 PM | PERMALINK

The man [John Bolton] is a sharp and gifted speaker. He will be quite an ass."

But he'll be a very wealthy ass won't he?

This is why they have 59 flavors my friend. Ambassador Bolton may not be your cup of tea but he's extremely well respected among conservatives and if you look at newspapers sales, book sales, radio programing and the lecture circuit then you know he's got a very bright future.

Posted by: rdw on January 17, 2007 at 6:09 PM | PERMALINK

You are of course aware getting blocked by the Senate adds to his reputation among conservatives. He gets to charge even more. The man is a sharp and gifted speaker. He will be quite an ass.
Posted by: rdw

bilking ignorant redneck repubs is (1) not that difficult, and (2) not to be discouraged.

Posted by: Nads on January 17, 2007 at 6:12 PM | PERMALINK

Impeachment would be a teachable moment for this loser.

Impeachment is William Jefferson Clintons legacy. It is his only lasting legacy. There is nothing else of his 8-yrs worthy of remembering. He will always be the Rock Star President and nothing more and you will always be his groupies.

Quite fitting actually.

Posted by: rdw on January 17, 2007 at 6:24 PM | PERMALINK

As I read rdw's last few comments I regret that I addressed him harshly in my last comment.

I should be more compassionate towards someone who is obviously in an advanced stage of mental degeneration.

Posted by: SecularAnimist on January 17, 2007 at 6:31 PM | PERMALINK

rdw: America is what the rest of the world needs to aspire to become.

Yeah, well that's all over now, thanks to your boy. The rest of the world laughed at Clinton's mall foolishness, but they're not laughing now, as you would know if you ever left your mental bunker.

Posted by: Kenji on January 17, 2007 at 6:47 PM | PERMALINK

Kenji wrote: "The rest of the world laughed at Clinton's mall foolishness, but they're not laughing now, as you would know if you ever left your mental bunker."

rdw will never leave his "mental bunker", the comfortable cocoon of the so-called "conservative" fantasy world that the right-wing extremist propaganda machine weaves for ignorant, weak-minded gullible dupes.

What "the rest of the world" really thinks is -- as he has repeatedly said -- "irrelevant" to him. Only what the talking heads on Fox News and the editorials in The Wall Street Journal tell him to think is "relevant".

And what they mostly tell him to think is that Ronald Reagan and George W. Bush are the greatest heroes the world has ever known, and that he should worship the ultra-rich, and buy as much stuff as he can to help the ultra-rich get even richer, and be happy in this wonderful country with 320 billionaires getting richer every day and rejoice that he can watch them on his HDTV.

Posted by: SecularAnimist on January 17, 2007 at 7:03 PM | PERMALINK

This is the guilded age my friend. Have you seen the size of the average American home and the list of appliances in it? American closets are bigger than British flats. 90% of American fireplaces installed in the last 3 years work on remote control.

You're starting to channel Norman Rogers now.

By guilded can we infer you support unions?

Posted by: cyntax on January 17, 2007 at 7:05 PM | PERMALINK

Think of how many brain cells rdw has sacrificed, from watching Fox News all the time. That has to count for something.

Posted by: SecularAnimist on January 17, 2007 at 7:13 PM | PERMALINK

Oh and rdw? You might not want to cite Warren Buffet as an example of what you aspire to be:

    Mr. Buffett... is at least as exercised about the tax system as I am.

    Put simply, the rich pay a lot of taxes as a total percentage of taxes collected, but they don’t pay a lot of taxes as a percentage of what they can afford to pay, or as a percentage of what the government needs to close the deficit gap.

    It turned out that Mr. Buffett, with immense income from dividends and capital gains, paid far, far less as a fraction of his income than the secretaries or the clerks or anyone else in his office. Further, in conversation it came up that Mr. Buffett doesn’t use any tax planning at all. He just pays as the Internal Revenue Code requires. “How can this be fair?” he asked of how little he pays relative to his employees. “How can this be right?”
    ...
    “There’s class warfare, all right,” Mr. Buffett said, “but it’s my class, the rich class, that’s making war, and we’re winning.”

I think SA is right old bean, you might be at the point where the brain cells lost are hampering your ability to think even slightly clearly.

Posted by: cyntax on January 17, 2007 at 7:16 PM | PERMALINK

Yeah, well that's all over now, thanks to your boy.

$14T GDP, 4.5% unemployment, low inflation, interest rates, surging exports, tax receipts and a life-style most of the rest of the world can only imagine.

How is it possible for 4% of the worlds population to control almost 25% of the worlds GDP? And to do so over 60 years with every indication we'll do so for another 6,000 years. How is that possible?

Posted by: rdw on January 17, 2007 at 7:47 PM | PERMALINK

Mr. Buffett... is at least as exercised about the tax system as I am

Are you sure.

For someone so exercised about the unfairness of it all he's sure doing his part setting the gold standard for tax avoidance.

Warren is the quintessentuial liberal. Only Bill Clinton can talk out of more sides of his mouth at once. The man is a fraud however his gift to the Gates foundation is incredibly generous. He's not all bad.

Posted by: rdw on January 17, 2007 at 7:52 PM | PERMALINK

Finally, his handlers are letting Bush be Bush, the Educator-in-Chief.

During the California electricity crisis...these changes as sacrifice.... MatthewRMarler at 3:32 PM

You may not remember back that far, but the "sacrifice" was one of the purse, being ripped off by privatization and those Bush campaign supporters like Enron taking advantage of it by limiting the availability of electricity and overcharging for it.
American exceptionalism is real. It needs to be touted as the model for the rest of the world to follow. rightist dim wit 3:37 PM

No, it's not; and no, they won't.
The rich keep on getting rich. rightist dim wit
at 3:47 PM

Especially, during Republican regimes who give them special tax breaks.
This is the guilded age my friend. rightist dim wit at 6:05 PM

The Gilded Age was followed by the Great Depression
... newspapers sales, book sales, radio programing and the lecture circuit then you know he's got a very bright future. rightist dim wit
at 6:09 PM

There is always a market for right wing loons, especially those who are notoriously wrong on issues, but crediting that clown with newspaper sales is bizarre.
... nothing else of his 8-yrs worthy of remembering rightist dim wit at 6:24 PM

8 years of peace and the greatest growth of economic properity the nation has ever known. That's a hundred times better than the clown in the White House whose lack of achievements you drool over.

Posted by: Mike on January 17, 2007 at 7:56 PM | PERMALINK
How is it possible for 4% of the worlds population to control almost 25% of the worlds GDP? rightist dim wit at 7:47 PM
Debt, greed and power. Right now the US is like Donald Trump: too far in debt to allow them to fail. However, we may find that the rest of the world grows tired of carrying that debt. The economic might of the US is dependent on some nations like China, Venezuela, Saudi Arabia who aren't enamored with American braggarts. Posted by: Mike on January 17, 2007 at 8:02 PM | PERMALINK

Warren is the quintessentuial liberal.

OK, then why did you bring him up as a poster-child for your economic boosterism?

Only Bill Clinton can talk out of more sides of his mouth at once. The man is a fraud however his gift to the Gates foundation is incredibly generous. He's not all bad.
Posted by: rdw

Yeah, how much has Cheney given to charity?

Posted by: cyntax on January 17, 2007 at 8:06 PM | PERMALINK

By guilded can we infer you support unions

I've always supported unions. I don't support stupid unions.

My son-in-law is a union carpenter who at age 28 made a very healthy 76K in 2006 not counting his real estate investments and side work. An ambitious carpenter can make a great deal of money buying older properties, putting some sweat equity in, generating a very healthy cash flow and with smart buying nice capital gains.

He was promoted in November and will easily make $90K in 2007. While housing isn't great the commercial sector is on fire and there's a shortage of skilled labor. He doesn't appreciate it but his pension and savings plans are terrific with very nice annual contributions to a series of 401k type saving plans. The young man is pursuing an aggressive growth strategy consistent with his age and the fact he has real estatre investments. Having started just after 9/11 he's gotten excellent stock market returns and is now realizing he needs to keep his eyes and ears open for stock market tips.

How about that, a union caopitalist. We're all part of the investor clasw now. Once a stong cold democrat he's starting to have 2nd thoughts. His wife is now in her 3rd year as a nurse and will make over $60K in 2007. He was more than a little bit horrified when I explained to him he's rich and will be paying higher taxes if he votes his party.

It gets even better.

I told him in order to be a true lib he had to understand just because he works his ass off and takes risks like buying and rehabbing properties doesn't mean he's entitled to the financial benefits. It's up to liberal politicians to decide how much he gets to keep and they'll take the rest and spread it around.

I knew from the outraged look I received I've got a conservative in training. He's still resistant but resistance is futile. He can't believe his lifelong self-identification as a liberal was so far off base. After I explained the Honourable John Street, Mayor of Philadelphia, was in fact a much better judge of how his money should be spent than he was he looked ill. I thought he was about to lose his lunch.

So I eased up. But he's all mine. By the end of 2007 he will be a Reagan Republican.

I will say one thing in his defense. He won't shop at Walmart. Of course over 80% of union members DO shop at Walmart but he's not one of them.

Posted by: rdw on January 17, 2007 at 8:10 PM | PERMALINK

why did you bring him up as a poster-child for your economic boosterism

What is economic boosterism? If you mean speaking the obvious, that the American economy is the 8th wonder of the world than I plead quilty. I think a modest man from Omaha amassing $35B in wealth is a pretty good example of why it's the 8th wonder. An even better example of American Exceptionalism is the Gate foundation amassing $150B dedicated to the eradication of childhood and communicable diseases worldwide. of which Warren Buffett is a major, major contributer.

Posted by: rdw on January 17, 2007 at 8:14 PM | PERMALINK

Yeah, how much has Cheney given to charity?

Your stupid is showing. The family has been very, very generous with a record that embarrasses the Gore's and the Clintons while in public life. Ms. Cheney has written at least two successful books with each dime contributed to a charity.

Posted by: rdw on January 17, 2007 at 8:16 PM | PERMALINK

The economic might of the US is dependent on some nations like China, Venezuela, Saudi Arabia who aren't enamored with American braggarts.

America's debt is very low and we are dependent on no one. The countries you name are far more dependent on the USA than vice-versa. China's economy woulod collapse if we put a tariff on their imports. Saudi Arabia relies on the US defense shield. Venezuela is now desperate for our export markets because they need every dime for their social programs to prop up a poor economy.

You of course saw the Saud's reaction to Irani and Venezuelan demands for more production cuts?

The answer was no. It seems Iran is a threat to the Sauds and they want to bring average prices down to put the economic squeeze on.

The fact is markets work. There are no shortages and OPEC won't be creating them. Even if they did. The USA has already proven energy is only a small portion of the economy. It was Old Europe who got hammered economically.

Posted by: rdw on January 17, 2007 at 8:25 PM | PERMALINK
... that the American economy is the 8th wonder of the world.... rightist dim wit at 8:14 PM
Here is a book on economics that should help you Pay particular attention to the chapters on debt. Total American debt is 40 Trillion, with a T, and soaring Posted by: Mike on January 17, 2007 at 8:25 PM | PERMALINK

America's debt is very high and we are dependent on every trading country. The countries you name are as dependent on the USA as vice-versa. China's economy would collapse if we put a tariff on their imports as ours would, too. Saudi Arabia relies on the US defense shield as we rely on their cheap oil. Venezuela is now desperate for our export markets because they need every dime for their social programs to prop up a poor economy while they reap the returns of the high $ price of oil (still twice the $26 US-Saudi AGREEMENT OF THE 80s and 90s).

You of course saw the Saud's reaction to Irani and Venezuelan demands for more production cuts?

The answer was no. It seems Iran is a threat to the Sauds and they want to bring average prices down to put the economic squeeze on. (No US pressure there, of course.)

The fact is markets work. There are no shortages and OPEC won't be creating them. Even if they did. The USA has already proven energy is only a small portion of the economy. It was Old Europe who got hammered economically. Not that markets are distorted by the big companies or big government, of course. Or thgat the US got hammered in the 70s, Oh no!

Posted by: rdw on January 17, 2007 at 8:25 PM | PERMALINK

Hey. Thanks, rdw.

Duffus.

Posted by: notthere on January 17, 2007 at 8:47 PM | PERMALINK
....America's debt is very low and we are dependent on no one.... rightist dim wit at 8:25 PM
40 Trillion might not be much for you, but it's a big number to the rest of us. You may be too obtuse to realize it, but if Chavez or Saudis decided to cut exports of oil, our economy, the 8th wonder, would tank. If China decided to price its exports in euros, inflation would hit us by 20%. If they decided to change their foreign exchange holding from dollars to euros, our dollar would tank. The global economy means that everyone is interdependent, only debtors are more dependent than creditors. It was Reagan that changed our economy from being the world's biggest creditor to being the world's biggest debtor. Posted by: Mike on January 17, 2007 at 8:58 PM | PERMALINK

If China decided to price its exports in euros, inflation would hit us by 20%

You are an idiot. Toys and t-shirts don't drive inflation. China is terrified of raising prices because it's exports will collapse and ITS economy with it. China needs our markets a lot more than we need their toys.

Posted by: rdw on January 17, 2007 at 9:17 PM | PERMALINK

Chavez or Saudis decided to cut exports of oil, our economy, the 8th wonder, would tank

Not it wouldn't but theirs would. Energy is 2% of the USA economy and VZ supplies less than 10% of our imports. Their 0.2% would easily be replaced by the strategic reserve in the shirt term and other supplies in the medium term.

The 8th wonder already absorbed a tripling of oil prices without blinking.

Posted by: rdw on January 17, 2007 at 9:20 PM | PERMALINK

The global economy means that everyone is interdependent, only debtors are more dependent than creditors

No it doesn't you twit. trade doesn't make us more dependent it makes us vastly richer. Creditors are investors you moron. That's why our interest rates are so low amd our stock markets so high. Everyone wants a piece of America.

Did you know Bill Gates made another $1B today?

Posted by: rdw on January 17, 2007 at 9:23 PM | PERMALINK

It was Reagan that changed our economy

Indeed he did as any logrimthic chart of the stock markets over 100 years time will show you. 1981 was Morning in America. Thanks to his tax rate cuts America's great wealth is in private hands. Europe's wealth is in Public hands. Thus they don't have any.

This brings back great memories of his classy and poignant funeral and the amazing outpouring of love and respect for this giant of the post-WWII era.

It was the libs who wanted to appease the USSR at every turn. It was Reagan who said after being asked the plan for the Cold War, "We win, they lose".

How rude!

How right!

Posted by: rdw on January 17, 2007 at 9:29 PM | PERMALINK


Or thgat the US got hammered in the 70s, Oh no!

Of course the USA got hammered in the 70's. You remember Mr. National Maliase. Then Reagan came in and removed price controls, got the govt out of the business and prices collapsed.

This ain't the 70's. It's Europes economy what wheezes with every price rise. We didn't even approach a recession. Demand is down. Supply is up. Prices are down. Funny how the market works isn't it.

Posted by: rdw on January 17, 2007 at 9:33 PM | PERMALINK
Not it wouldn't but theirs would. Energy is 2% of the USA economy ....rightist dim wit at 9:20 PM
You are becoming sillier and sillier. They export to China and Europe. Oil is the sine qua non of the American economy. Study the oil shock of the 73 .

...Meanwhile, the shock produced chaos in the West. In the United States, the retail price of a gallon of gasoline rose from a national average of 38.5 cents in May 1973 to 55.1 cents in June 1974. Meanwhile, New York Stock Exchange shares lost $97 billion in value in six weeks.

With the onset of the embargo, U.S. imports of oil from the Arab countries dropped from 1.2 million barrels (190,000 m³) a day to a mere 19,000 barrels (3,000 m³). Daily consumption dropped by 6.1% from September to February, 7% by the summer of 1974. During that period, the United States suffered its first fuel shortage since World War II...
You should also study inflation in the 70's. Volcker raised interest rates to over 20% to stop the inflation and crushed the economy. This book on economics that should help you

Posted by: Mike on January 17, 2007 at 9:36 PM | PERMALINK

(No US pressure there, of course.)

Are you referring to the trip Cheney made to Saudi Arabia just before prices started dropping?

Funny but the other clowns on this blog think Dick was summoned by the Sauds to get a verbal tongue lashing. I have no idea over what and they never said.

It's rather obvious the Sunni Sauds have far more to fear from the Shite whackjobs in Iran than anyone else. It's rather obvious Irans economy is in very sorry shape and would be destitute without Oil. It's rather obvious price drops below $60 are bad news with drops below $50 very, very bad news for Iran.

Doesn't help Chavez much either.

Posted by: rdw on January 17, 2007 at 9:38 PM | PERMALINK

"I told him in order to be a true lib he had to understand just because he works his ass off and takes risks like buying and rehabbing properties doesn't mean he's entitled to the financial benefits. It's up to liberal politicians to decide how much he gets to keep and they'll take the rest and spread it around. "

Quite right, RDW. Obviously it's outrageous to tax the rich more than the nonrich, since of course the average person who earns $1 million a year does so by working 25 times harder every day than the average person who earns $40,000 a year.

As for the American economy currently being "the envy of the world": it's odd, in that case, that it's currently not the envy of the American people themselves, who have consistently given Bush negative margins of 12 to 25% on his handling of the economy in the polls for at least the last 4 years. (Take a look at "Polling Report" for the best summary of the data.) The GOP itself keeps expressing bewilderment at this; but might it, just possibly, have to do with the unquestioned fact that virtually all the rise in the GDP under Bush has gone to the top-income few percent of the population, with everyone else's incomes stagnating -- something that emphatically did NOT happen under Clinton? (And that, of course, is before the super-deficits that Bush has planned for the near future kick in, as pointed out by most economists.)

Posted by: Bruce Moomaw on January 17, 2007 at 9:40 PM | PERMALINK
...toys and t-shirts don't drive inflation.... rightist dim wit at 9:17 PM|
The American trade imbalance is approaching 1 trillion per year. We import almost all our clothing and electronics. It's not just toys, it's the necessities and luxuries. .
...No it doesn't you twit. trade doesn't make us more dependent it makes us vastly richer. Creditors are investors you moron.... rightist dim witat 9:23 PM
You need to read this book on economics Creditors are the people you own money to and trade, when you have a negative trade balance makes you poorer not richer. The Chinese economy is growing over 11%, the American less than 3%.
...Thanks to his tax rate cuts America's great wealth is in private hands. Europe's wealth is in Public hands. Thus they don't have any. rightist dim wit at 9:29 P
Europe has less income inequality and more social mobility than the US. The Reagan tax cuts were followed by the biggest deficits in history, up until Bush, and then the biggest tax increase in history, adjusted for inflation. Most of America's wealth is in property and corporate assets, while 10% of the population owns well over 50% of America's assets. Not a healthy situation.
approach a recession. Demand is down. .... rightist dim wit at 9:33 PM
At the time, it was stagflation. Inflation was up in a stagnate economy. It can easily happen again when the government is as foolish with the economy as Bush is: Deficits out of control, trade inbalance, dependency on foreign oil, launching insane wars in the unstable Middle East. Posted by: Mike on January 17, 2007 at 9:48 PM | PERMALINK

"It was the libs who wanted to appease the USSR at every turn. It was Reagan who said after being asked the plan for the Cold War, 'We win, they lose'."

Odd; it was in 1979 -- a year and a half before Reagan even took office -- that Daniel P. Moynihan said correctly in "Harper's": "The Soviet Union will be in serious economic trouble in the 1980s. It could blow up. The world could blow up with it." And, for whatever it's worth, Gorbachev still insists that Reagan's excessive initial hawkishness actually caused the Kremlin hard-liners to dig in their heels and so delayed the arrival of his own Soviet reform government by several years.

As for the line of Reagan's goofier admirers that he "brought down" the USSR by bankrupting them with a military spending spree -- particularly SDI -- it should be pointed out that Reagan himself repeatedly insisted that he had no intention of trying to do that, since (like Moynihan) he was well-aware that whenever the Soviet Union DID go down it might very well go down with a worldwide nuclear bang. Thus his repeated proposals to actually provide the USSR with a copy of our own DSI system so that both nations could supposedly become impervious to nuclear attack simultaneously -- as he told Gorby at Reykjavik, "If I didn't think this system could be shared, I never would have proposed it." (Gorby rejected the offer for the simple reason that, if both nations had near-duplicate systems, both of them would know exactly what countermeasures would allow them to penetrate the other side's shield, and we'd be right back where we started from -- something Reagan couldn't get through his head, possibly because he was already starting to suffer from Alzheimer's -- but at least he wasn't crazy enough to try backing the Soviets into a corner, as RDW and company would like to think he did.)

Posted by: Bruce Moomaw on January 17, 2007 at 9:51 PM | PERMALINK
Not it wouldn't but theirs would. Energy is 2% of the USA economy ....rightist dim wit at 9:20 PM
They export to China and Europe. Oil is the sine qua non of the American economy. Study the oil shock of the 73 .

...Meanwhile, the shock produced chaos in the West. In the United States, the retail price of a gallon of gasoline rose from a national average of 38.5 cents in May 1973 to 55.1 cents in June 1974. Meanwhile, New York Stock Exchange shares lost $97 billion in value in six weeks.
With the onset of the embargo, U.S. imports of oil from the Arab countries dropped from 1.2 million barrels (190,000 m³) a day to a mere 19,000 barrels (3,000 m³). Daily consumption dropped by 6.1% from September to February, 7% by the summer of 1974. During that period, the United States suffered its first fuel shortage since World War II...

You should also study inflation in the 70's. Volcker raised interest rates to over 20% to stop the inflation and crushed the economy.

Posted by: Mike on January 17, 2007 at 9:56 PM | PERMALINK

And while we're on the subject of European economies, there's a very interesting recent New Republic piece on the spectacular recent success of the Scandinavian countries -- particularly Denmark -- in creating a much more economically equitable system than the US WITHOUT strangling their economies' growth rate, something which is starting to attract the attention even of right-wing economists:

http://www.tnr.com/docprint.mhtml?i=20070115&s=cohn011507

Posted by: Bruce Moomaw on January 17, 2007 at 9:57 PM | PERMALINK

Study the oil shock of the 73 .

Our economy is two generations removed from 1973. Energy use as a percent of GDP is less 1/4 previous levels amd there are more sources from more places. In just the last 3 years energy demand per unit of GDP has dropped 10%. That's why this economy was able to absorb a tripling of prices in a short period with very little effect.

One of the lessons of that period you obviously forget is that markets work. OPEC knows this because they lost control of pricing during most of the 20 years after 1981.

New sources are discovered and alternatives are advanced which at various price points are fully competitive with oil. Although Solar is still far away from competitive solar is dramatically better than in 1980. The same is true for wind, goal gasification and shale oil.

At $100 a barrel it's very probably coal gasification is a very viable alternative and with out huge coal deposits the USA could moce back to coal.

We are seeing such a surge in Ethanol output now with 40+ annual increases in production expect to move demand to 8% of total gasoline demand by 2012.

Posted by: rdw on January 17, 2007 at 10:18 PM | PERMALINK

Back in 2/10/04 I recall him saying, in response to criticism on the economy and the Iraq War--"We are at war." "I am the war president."
Questions on Iraq War Remain--shorter interview with Dubya:
Intelligence? Yes and No
Saddam? Danger, Danger.
Weapons? Still looking.
Imminent? Too late!
Me? WAR PRESIDENT

Posted by: consider wisely always on January 17, 2007 at 10:26 PM | PERMALINK
One of the lessons of that period you obviously forget is that markets work. ... rightist dim wit at 10:18 PM
The basic economic principles are the same now as then, and we are more dependent on foreign oil now than then. We reached our Hubert peak in the 70's. When you speak of markets, you need to understand that some markets are determined by government subsidies and support, others on supply and demand. Oil demand is high; supply is foreign. In the event of embargo, it would take years to get these alternate sources on line and in sufficient quanity to support our standard of living without drastic disruption. That is a function of our suburban lifestyle and lack of public transportation. We have decreased oil usage per capita thanks to Carter's policies. Reagan, Bush and Bush have done their best to reverse this and support traditional oil companies. Rising cost will lead to some reduction in usage and to some efficiencies, but our transportation system depends on energy hungry big rigs, not energy efficient trains. We use more oil that all of Europe. Posted by: Mike on January 17, 2007 at 10:28 PM | PERMALINK

Gorby rejected the offer for the simple reason that, if both nations had near-duplicate systems, both of them would know exactly what countermeasures would allow them to penetrate the other side's shield, and we'd be right back where we started from -

You simple ass. Reagan didn't fear an attack from Russia. He was also negotiating massive stockpile reductions with the russians you moron. He feared other twits like the nuts in NK or Iran getting missles as the inevitably will.

Reagan knew all along, as he argued most of his life, socialism was an evil disaster not capable of defeating a free and capitalist society. He was on one side of that debate while John Kenneth galbraith and the rest of the airheads on the Harvard faculty held the other.

Your problem here my friend is it's all so well documented. Reagan was fighting commmunism in the unions in the 40's and 50's. His opposition was lifelong and exceedinly well documented. This man you suggest was addled with alheimers went toe to toe with the great John Kenneth Galbraith in the 80's on this subject and absolutely, totally shredded the Harvard wise man. In fact one had to feel sorry for JKG when he died last year at the lack of attention and warmth for a man who was the darling of the liberal intelligencia for decades.

Posted by: rdw on January 17, 2007 at 10:28 PM | PERMALINK

Inflation was up in a stagnate economy. It can easily happen again when the government is as foolish with the economy as Bush is:

No one is as pathetic as Jimmy Carter.

We have record stock markets, fabulously low unemployment, low inflation, low interest rates, very low deficits well under the post 1970 average and record foreign investment and record wealth. The economy is in fabulous shape.

Did you now we have over 315 billionaires?

Did you know that Bill Gates and Warren Buffett have agreed to fund the Gates trusts to the tune of over $150B to be dedicated toward eradicating childhood and communicable diseases in Africa and elsewhere. They will be reguired to spend over $7.5B per year. Two Americans will be spending more than France in Africa and spending it far more effectively.

Posted by: rdw on January 17, 2007 at 10:34 PM | PERMALINK
....Reagan Reagan Reagan...rightist dim wit at 10:28 PM
If Reagan didn't fear a nuclear war, he was a bigger fool than we know. He knew nothing of socialism and was a snitch in the 50's. In the 80's, he committed illegal acts in Iran-Contra and should have been impeached. Reagan sent a cake, a CAKE, via Robert McFarlane to sell 1000 TOW missiles to Iran. Galbraith had nothing but contempt for Reagan and he was right. Reagan was a clueless, criminal cheap, snitch who sold out American interest to Japanese corporations and Iranian ayatollahs. Posted by: Mike on January 17, 2007 at 10:41 PM | PERMALINK

rdw--the stumbling block proved to be Reagan's stance on the ABM Treaty. You are no student of history. The US was not willing or able to part with its hope of nuclear superiority. It instead wished to speed up SDI research.

Posted by: consider wisely always on January 17, 2007 at 10:41 PM | PERMALINK

We use more oil that all of Europe

This just goes to show you just how pathetic Europe is economically. We use more oil yet they suffered a more pervasively negative impact due to the sharp price increases. They are so much more regulated they simply lack flexibility and th ability to innovate.

Even France which produces 80% of their electricity from nuclear suffered more of a blow than the USA economy.

The huberts peak is total bullshit. There's a ton of supply out there and at $75 a ton of alternatives.

We are more dependent on foreign oil because is was smart to be so. It was dirt cheap. Each of the producers except for Saudi Arabia is more dependent on producing the oil for revenues. Now that the price is lower the pressure on Iran, Venezuela, Nigeria, etc, will be to produce even more because they need the cash.

At the same time as prices are falling we are still investing a ton in alternatives. Ethanol will surge while Solar, Wind, etc. get more R&D.

Posted by: rdw on January 17, 2007 at 10:44 PM | PERMALINK
...Did you now we have over 315 billionaires? .... Two Americans will be spending more than France in Africa and spending it far more effectively. rightist dim wit at 10:34 PM
You are becoming repetitious. The number of billionaires in America is a reflection of income inequality in America. The Gates Foundation has recently been shown to support corporations whose interest is inimical to the stated goals of the Foundation. Gates made his money by unfair monopolistic business practices. Some hero. How effective the Foundation will be is making a big assumption. You don't know how any of the funds have been spent nor where nor on whom. Posted by: Mike on January 17, 2007 at 10:47 PM | PERMALINK

In the event of embargo, it would take years to get these alternate sources on line and in sufficient quanity to support our standard of living without drastic disruption.

No nation can afford an embargo which would be a disaster for the global economy. The Sauds would watch their own economy falther and the value of their investments get crushed. They would lose every bit as much. Iran, Venezuela, Liberia and others would starve.

Plus the USA does get 40% of it's OIL from North America and 10% from Liberia, could easily open up ANWR and start the recent 15B field discovered in the Gulf as well as open other older fields to add another 20% to that 50%. The rest can be replaced by the strategic reserve as we ramp up production of natural gas, coal and ethanol.

It's possible we'd get a recession but it would be very short. Most of the OPEC nations would get crushed.

It's not 1970. Our energy productivity is dramatically higher today and improving each year.


Posted by: rdw on January 17, 2007 at 10:52 PM | PERMALINK
... We use more oil yet they suffered a more pervasively negative impact due to the sharp price increases...The huberts peak is total bullshit... .... Ethanol will surge while Solar...rightist dim wit at 10:44 PM
No, since the EU has more people and a greater GDP, it shows that we are far less efficient. You can call empirical facts bullsh*t, but the fact remains that American oil production peaked in the 70's and has declined every year since. No wonder you are such a laughingstock. Ethanol is more expensive than oil, less officiant and depends on government subsidies. Wind, solar, and geo-thermal are sources for electricity, not transportation. Posted by: Mike on January 17, 2007 at 10:53 PM | PERMALINK

The number of billionaires in America is a reflection of income inequality in America

It's a reflection of fantstic wealth creation unrivaled in the rest of the world.

Posted by: rdw on January 17, 2007 at 10:54 PM | PERMALINK
No nation can afford an embargo which would be a disaster for the global economy. ...rightist dim wit at 10:52 PM
Actually, they can. They only need embargo the US and, if our policies continue to be so bad, they just might. The rest of the global economy can exist, it merely would not be so dependent on sales to the American debt-ridden consumer. The world's greated debtor cannot "crush" anyone. It can't even defeat an insurgency in a third-world country. Posted by: Mike on January 17, 2007 at 10:57 PM | PERMALINK
...It's a reflection of fantstic wealth creation unrivaled in the rest of the world.... rightist dim wit at 10:54 PM
It's an expression of the world's willingness to extend unlimited credit to America and of Americans to allow the few to prosper beyond rational need while the masses to suffer with stagnating income and declining wealth. Grow up, face facts, query reality, stop spouting baloney. Posted by: Mike on January 17, 2007 at 11:03 PM | PERMALINK

rdw: This is the guilded age my friend.

At first I thought that RDW had to be a parody, this is not a guilded as as no-one need belong to a guild to make a living.

But in fact, he was correct, if you ignore the spelling mistake. An old usage for the phrase gilded meant smeared with blood. rdw, your leader has made this a gilded age, a very gilded age indeed.

Posted by: Bad Rabbit on January 17, 2007 at 11:08 PM | PERMALINK

The Gates Foundation has recently been shown to support corporations whose interest is inimical to the stated goals of the Foundation.

Pencil-necked libs have been making this claim from day one. The Gates early foundations were focused on education and bringing computers and internet access to schools and libraries. Yes that would be PCs running windows. As expected libs tried to denigrate his largess with these silly claims.

The cool thing about Bill Gates is he flat out doesn't give a crap about liberal pencil necks. Never did and never will. He STILL buys PCs when he thinks it's smart. He doesn't care what you think. That's why the libs were so pissed about his medical trusts. They wanted then folded under the UN. He said, "No friggin way". He's running them.

You have no idea of the magnitude of the wealth out there and the roll of trusts. They are exploding with assets serving all kinds of goals. These are successful wealthy people deciding to fund causes important to them. It's so cool to have these massive amounts of private wealth available this way.

BTW: Living in S.E PA I've become aware of the vast wealth here and in Northern Delaware. There has been a tradition of private/public efforts to preserve land using a variety to techniques designed mostly to keep much of the land in private hands with development rights in public hands. There are thousands of acres of horsefarms where wealthy families traded develpment rights for permanent tax abatements agreeing to maintain the land forever as horse farms. It's still private property and the gain in value will accrue to the wealthy owners but that's as it should be. They'll remain open space forever.

The Harvard and Ivy league trusts are famous but the fact is at many levels of education trusts are large and permanents ensuring private prep schools and other institutions will be forever. Two of favporite regional examples are St Josephs college and St Josephs prep HS in Philly. Each has a series of endowments averaging over 15% annual growth which is likely to accelerate in this stock market boom. At this rate of compounding each institution is very well prepared for the future.

It's really astounding when you consider what the next 25 years will bring with our massive wealth and this will only happen in the USA. It's very likely St Joes Prep, a prestigious catholic high school in urban Philly, will by 2025 or 2030 have a permanent endowment large enough to fund the full tuition for 750 students. In other words the Prep will be forever.

Posted by: rdw on January 17, 2007 at 11:15 PM | PERMALINK

Americans to allow the few to prosper beyond rational need while the masses to suffer with stagnating income and declining wealth

OK, help me out here. If only a few prosper than how is it Best Buy, Circuit City and most of the big retailers almost ran out of big screen TVS and laptops this year?

Only a few are propering?

There's been huge houses spouting up all over the friggin place. I can't go anywhere and not pass a new housing development and they're all large houses. Even the townhouses are large.

So who's living in them?

Posted by: rdw on January 17, 2007 at 11:20 PM | PERMALINK

since the EU has more people and a greater GDP, it shows that we are far less efficient.

No, not quite. Our manufacturing is far more efficient. Our tranportation is far less efficient because we don't need to rely on gasoline taxes to fund the Govt as they do in Europe where tax cheating is the national pastime. That's why they drive little boxes and we drive real cars.

We also spend more on heat for the same reason. We have large houses in many cases with more closet space than they having living space.

Posted by: rdw on January 17, 2007 at 11:24 PM | PERMALINK

Ethanol is more expensive than oil, less officiant and depends on government subsidies.

NO kidding. what's the point?

Wind, solar, and geo-thermal are sources for electricity, not transportation

No kidding, what's the point?

Posted by: rdw on January 17, 2007 at 11:26 PM | PERMALINK
Pencil-necked libs have been making this claim from day one. The Gates early foundations were focused on education and bringing computers and internet access to schools and libraries....rightist dim wit at 11:15 PM
Actually, they have not until the LA Times did a series. You use a lot for words to say nothing which is a typical pointy-head snow job. You are missing the fact that much of the world is moving to open source software which is the death knell of Microsoft's monopoly. Liberals have a far better ideal of economics and the role of idle wealth, inherited wealth, and unearned income than you, but I see you are familiar with tax benefits available to the wealthy. That, of course, is one of the reasons for the huge inequality of income in the US. It is more likely that the next 25 years will lead to another depression because of it. Posted by: Mike on January 17, 2007 at 11:26 PM | PERMALINK

The world's greated debtor cannot "crush" anyone. It can't even defeat an insurgency in a third-world country.

Took good care of Saddam and his sons didn't we?

Posted by: rdw on January 17, 2007 at 11:27 PM | PERMALINK
... what's the point? rightist dim wit at 11:26 PM
The point is that those points you were trying to make are irrelevant to your blather about oil.
No, not quite. Our manufacturing is far more efficient...rightist dim wit at 11:24 PM
No, that data proves that our cars are less efficient, our manufacturing is less efficient, and our homes are less energy efficient. Tax cheating by offshore bank accounts and tax shelters are the great pastime of rich Americans. You need to learn how to interpret data. You miss by 180 degrees.
n how is it Best Buy, Circuit City and most of the big retailers almost ran out of big screen TVS and laptops this year? ...rightist dim wit at 11:20 PM
Easy credit and bloated credit cards. Pay attention. The same with no interest mortgages. And, no, they didn't almost run out of merchandise. Posted by: Mike on January 17, 2007 at 11:34 PM | PERMALINK

Actually, they can. They only need embargo the US

No they can't.

Saudi Arabia could easily replace any Venezuelan cuts. Liberia exports every ounce it can. We don't import a drop from Iran. Production is increasing in Algeria, Libya, Brazil and Turkey is building two larg pipelines to transport central Asian Oil to the Med for distribution. All will be new sources for the USA.

Posted by: rdw on January 17, 2007 at 11:34 PM | PERMALINK

Took good care of Saddam and his sons didn't we?

Yes, it only took $500 billion dollars, almost 200,000 troops and 3000 American lives and grinding our military into the ground to do so.

Bravo.

If we had a trillion dollars and 500,000 troops I estimate we could kill or capture at least five or six guys.

What a brilliant, effective use of resources.

Posted by: astonished on January 17, 2007 at 11:37 PM | PERMALINK
Took good care of Saddam and his sons didn't we? rightist dim wit at 11:27 PM
So you spend 1.2 trillion, 3000+ dead, 20000+ casualties, and over 500000+ dead Iraqis to take out 3 people? That has to be the stupidest argument yet. There are over 1000 attacks on Americans per week. That's not success by any war manual. Posted by: Mike on January 17, 2007 at 11:37 PM | PERMALINK

It is more likely that the next 25 years will lead to another depression because of it

It's got to be so hard for you Mike. Day after day of stock market records. 300+ billionairs and by the time GWB leaves office it'll be over 500.

The next 25 will be even better than the last 25 when Ronald Reagan inherited Jimmy's national maliase. Think sbout it. There's never been another age like this and it's an exclusively American experience.

Posted by: rdw on January 17, 2007 at 11:42 PM | PERMALINK
...Saudi Arabia could easily replace any Venezuelan cuts.... ...rightist dim wit at 11:34 PM
You are assuming that those in the Middle East who were part of the last embargo will not be part of the next. That is silly. One day the people will have control of their governments and our puppets will find other markets that pay cash. Quit dreaming pie-in-the-sky and make realistic plans to reduce our dependency on foreign oil and increase stability and peace in the Middle East. Posted by: Mike on January 17, 2007 at 11:43 PM | PERMALINK

find other markets that pay cash.

The Saudi's prefer dollars and we actually don't export all that much from them either. Canada and Mexico are our two largest importers and Canada will become the larger by far as Tar Sands production increases.

It's also interesting that Brazil is now energy efficient yet has two huge fields off their coast they wish to development for export markets. If they want to move into the 1st world ranks they're going to need these dollars. There's one other apct here as well. Mexico and Brazil hate Chavez more than GWB. IN fact he's a gnat to the USA. He can shut down his citgo stations but someone else will buy them.

Oil is NOT in short supply.

Posted by: rdw on January 17, 2007 at 11:49 PM | PERMALINK
It's got to be so hard for you Mike... rightist dim wit at 11:42 PM
More repetition. Are you running out of fresh talking points? Those stock market records that have you creaming your jeans have taken 6 years to attain. The number of billionaires as proof of income inequality which is a bad thing. Reagan dumped this country into the greatest recession since the Great Depression and gave us the biggest deficits until BushII. No, life isn't hard for me. I confront it as it is, not with some fantasy spin. Study history. Gilded Ages have a way of crashing horribly. For every one that existed, every one crashed. Posted by: Mike on January 17, 2007 at 11:50 PM | PERMALINK
Oil is NOT in short supply. rightist dim wit at 11:49 PM
Oil markets move up and they move down, but in general they move up as demand increases and supply isn't. There have been no major oil finds in decades. Small fields, yes; expensive fields, yes, but as China develops and signs agreements with our allies, it puts the squeeze on us. Also, some suppliers are moving to euro pricing because as the dollar falls in value, the euro has been increasing. This will make our imported oil more expensive. Posted by: Mike on January 17, 2007 at 11:55 PM | PERMALINK

"You simple ass. Reagan didn't fear an attack from Russia. He was also negotiating massive stockpile reductions with the russians you moron. He feared other twits like the nuts in NK or Iran getting missles as they inevitably will."

Really? Gee, that's interesting, RDW; I had no idea that you actually come from a parallel dimension. In our own world, Reagan said constantly from 1983 on that preventing an attack by the USSR was EXACTLY what he had proposed SDI to prevent -- as did ALL of SDI's other backers at the time. (Take a look, for instance, at "National Review's" seemingly endless string of cover stories on the subject.)

It wasn't until the Soviet Union collapsed that there started to be talk of a greatly scaled-down system to fend off missile attacks by smaller nuclear-armed nations -- and one of the biggest selling points being made by the advocates of such a system (including Dubya) is that, while it's universally recognized now that an anti-Soviet shield would have been virtually impossible, we may be able to make a far smaller and cheaper anti-Third World missile shield actually work. And indeed we might -- if it wasn't for the simple fact that in that case, any Third World country suicidally loony enough to attack us will simply smuggle their Bombs into the US instead, maybe (as George Will sardonically suggests) in "a bale of marijuana".

Posted by: Bruce Moomaw on January 18, 2007 at 1:28 AM | PERMALINK

re. the collapse of the USSR

Amalrik, Andrei. Will the Soviet Union Survive Until 1984? Harper & Row Publishers, New York 1970.

read it as a teenager in the late 70's. It had the stink of truth. Course, unlike rdw and his counterparts in the old Soviet Union, good party men all, I've never been a worshipper of men.

Posted by: snicker-snack on January 18, 2007 at 7:34 AM | PERMALINK

'Over the past five years, as gas prices have doubled, fuel consumption has continued climbing upward. In 2006, we spent $364 billion on gasoline, which was double what we spent in 2002, according to Tom Kloza, an analyst who monitors American gasoline-buying behavior for the Oil Price Information Service. (The difference amounts to as much as the entire federal budget for Medicaid in 2006. It’s hard to imagine that we would have swallowed a one-year tax increase of that proportion.)' - Lisa Margonelli - http://pipeline.blog.nytimes.com/

Posted by: MsNThrope on January 18, 2007 at 7:57 AM | PERMALINK

"Our economy is engaged in a very dangerous game of chicken," Senator Dorgan warned last summer when he and Senator Russ Feingold introduced the Balanced Trade Restoration Act. The US trade deficits--$800 billion a year and rising--are either setting up an epic financial crisis for the United States or a pit of deepening indebtedness that will produce falling living standards for most Americans. "I'm afraid that our mountain of trade debt could come crashing down on our heads and make the stock-market collapse seem like a blip on the radar," Dorgan said.
A Globalization Offensive by WILLIAM GREIDER/The Nation


Meanwhile, China's FX reserves have reached $1 Trillion - of which $700 Billion is in dollar denominated debt instruments - principally Treasuries and mortgage backed securities.

Posted by: MsNThrope on January 18, 2007 at 8:00 AM | PERMALINK

So who's living in them?
Posted by: rdw

Increasingly the answer will be no one.

Posted by: MsNThrope on January 18, 2007 at 8:25 AM | PERMALINK

rdw: Took good care of Saddam and his sons didn't we?

more americans died in iraq between the time saddam was captured and executed..

than..

in all his decades in power..

i guess it depends on what you mean by "took care of"

Posted by: mr. irony on January 18, 2007 at 8:27 AM | PERMALINK

Also, some suppliers are moving to euro pricing because as the dollar falls in value, the euro has been increasing. This will make our imported oil more expensive.

The shift to the euro is a good thing and will have nothing to do with the cost of oil which is set by supply and demand with short term distortions due to OPEC, distortions which are often detrimental to OPEC.

THIS ECONOMY is SCREAMING. Jobless claims were down 8K to a very low 290K with housing starts up 4.5% with 2006 inflation the best in 3 years at 2.5% and every economist predicting

It's got to be horrible for libs. The deficit is already down 25% this fiscal year on surging tax collections led by the screaming corporate sector which for 3 years has been reseting records for the portion of total taxes they pay.

This is happening during a depression in Autos and a major recession in Housing and a tripling of oil prices. Suppy-side ROCKS!!!!!

It's hard ot now but stock market futures are signalling ANOTHER RECORD HIGH!

Posted by: rdw on January 18, 2007 at 9:20 AM | PERMALINK

Meanwhile, China's FX reserves have reached $1 Trillion - of which $700 Billion is in dollar denominated debt instruments - principally Treasuries and mortgage backed securities.

Isn't that perfect! Think about it. China has ALL of it's wealth invested in America. Something bad happens to us they're F*CKED!. They want to make damn sure America continues to grow so robustly. Someone has to buy those toys

You twits will never undertand trade or globalization. Nor will you ever stop it. GWB has been the energizer bunny. While you morons are crying in your cereal because the French think we're 'cowboys' GWB is signing traded deals all over the globe. Exports are surging 13% per year. That's a stunning number.

The jobs data is signalling a severe labor shortage and the boomers are just now starting to retire. We need to export jobs desperately. We don't have workers. That why the many deals with India are so critical. That's why when you call 1-800 for tech support you talk to New Delhi.

You simple bastards! GWB has totally changed you world and you don't have a clue.

Posted by: rdw on January 18, 2007 at 9:29 AM | PERMALINK

i guess it depends on what you mean by "took care of"

I was referring to the hanging.

Posted by: rdw on January 18, 2007 at 9:30 AM | PERMALINK

Increasingly the answer will be no one.

Nope! They're filled. Today housing starts were up 4.5% and permits were up 5%. Jobless claims continue to fall dropping 8K to a very, very low 290k.

The housing numbers were the 3rd best December since 1950.

I guess those builders and real estate investors just aren't as smart as you are.

This has got to really piss of the French doesn't it? We keep on building these McMansions. They've been very clear we're so inconsiderate sucking up the worlds energy supplies in this egregious display of overwhelming wealth. And to make matters worse we keep telling them. "F*ckoff Assh*les!"

Posted by: rdw on January 18, 2007 at 9:36 AM | PERMALINK

Amalrik, Andrei. Will the Soviet Union Survive Until 1984?

I'm sure there's a point here but can't imagine what it is. So someone besides Reagan predicted the demise of the USSR. That's meaningful how? I'm rather sure a google search from 1984 would predict even more writers predicting the demise of the USA. IN fact on the left the ratio would undoubtedly be 10 - 1 with some level of certainty the USSR would outlast the USA.

We've been in decline for decades don't you know?

I know for a fact liberal economists are in agony this day. This economy is the 8th wonder of the world. The 03 supply-side tax cuts have been spectacular.

Snicker-snack, the rich keep on getting richer. Bill Gates has picked up over $10B the last few months. Exports are running up 13%. Tax receipts are surging led by the Corporate sector. Jobs creation is screaming. The USA has no choice but to create wholly owned subsidaries in India to take the pressure off labor markets. Which is of course what GE, IBM, Intel, HP, Merck, etc. have been doing.

Do you suppose Western Europe will EVER get unemployment under 10%.

We are doing this with autos in a depression and housing in a recession. This is just incredible.

Posted by: rdw on January 18, 2007 at 9:48 AM | PERMALINK

any Third World country suicidally loony enough to attack us will simply smuggle their Bombs into the US instead.

Well that explains NK and Iran spending so much on missle technology. It's funny, but one of the reasons Japan is changing it's constitution to spend more on defense and has already started to spend on, and install, Star Wars is because they saw a NK missle pass over Japanese airspace.

Gee, they could have saved a ton of money and a lot less angst if only they talked to you and George 1st.

RR wasn't worried about Gorbachev or any of the previous leaders launching an attack but was very worried about rogue elements within the military or the possibility of a revolution or the selling of Soviet hardware. As we know of all socialist systems they are notoriouly inept and corrupt.

Think about that. Fidel is either dead or soon will be because the vaunted cuban healthcare system has now botched 3 routine operations. The fear wasn't the USSR would intentionally attack but would not control their assets.

This has been a terrible few decades for libs. The USSR is gone. Arafat was proven to be a turd and now Palestinians are living in one of the world worst ghettos entirely the creation of liberals. Fidel is now known as a turd and his 'world class' medical team is literally killing him. Saddam just hung and Fidel can only hope for such a quick death.

Posted by: rdw on January 18, 2007 at 10:01 AM | PERMALINK

Poor little Witless...babbling to the walls again.

I do, however, agree with the assessment that the economy is 'incredible'...

incredible adj. unbelievable


“Lenin was right. There’s no subtler, no surer means of overturning the existing basis of society than to debauch the currency. The process engages all the hidden forces of economic law on the side of destruction, and does it in a manner which not one man in a million is able to diagnose.” - John Maynard Keynes

The Fed, in effect, has become a serial bubble blower.”
-- Stephen Roach, chief economist, Morgan Stanley

Posted by: MsNThrope on January 18, 2007 at 11:34 AM | PERMALINK

AP
Jobless Claims Fall to 11-Month Low
Thursday January 18, 8:38 am ET
Weekly Jobless Claims Fall to the Lowest Level in 11 Months


RDW - this had to drive a stake thru the heart of the folks at the AP.

LT Sweet Crude is down $2.04 to $50.20. Hugo can't be happy about this.

You can project out and see what this means for inflation, interest rates, stock markets, corporate profits, tax receipts??? GWB is going to be heading into 2009 on a major economic wave.

Posted by: rdw on January 18, 2007 at 11:35 AM | PERMALINK

rdw wrote: "By the end of 2007 he will be a Reagan Republican."

You mean he will be suffering from irreversible progressive senile dementia like you and Ronald Reagan?

Your comments on this thread definitely prove one thing: people with massive cognitive impairment from irreversible senile dementia should not use amphetamines.

Posted by: SecularAnimist on January 18, 2007 at 11:38 AM | PERMALINK

Yesterday rdw wrote: "He had a simple case of diverticulitis and they butchered 3 different operations each time making it worse. "

rdw wrote: "Fidel is either dead or soon will be because the vaunted cuban healthcare system has now botched 3 routine operations."

I am curious about this.

What is the source of your assertions that (1) Castro's illness was "a simple case of diverticulitis"; (2) that he has had three operations; that (3) those operations were "routine"; and that (4) the operations were "butchered" or "botched"?

Have you heard or read these claims somewhere, and if so, where?

Or are you simply making them up?

If you are making them up, are you deliberately lying, or is this yet another case where you are unable to distinguish between your hallucinations and reality?

Posted by: SecularAnimist on January 18, 2007 at 11:47 AM | PERMALINK

GWB is going to be heading into 2009 on a major economic wave.

2009? Rooting for an outright coup now, you dimwit?

Delusional as ever. Still got your copy of Dow 36,000 around somewhere?

Posted by: MsNThrope on January 18, 2007 at 1:26 PM | PERMALINK

2009? Rooting for an outright coup now

No, I'm not a groupie like you pathetic fools are for the Clintons. 8 years is fine.

Posted by: rdw on January 18, 2007 at 1:41 PM | PERMALINK

I saw several clips. This was not one of them but it maks the point.


Tuesday, January 16, 2007

Fidel's End -- For Real? [Kathryn Jean Lopez]

AP:

In a report published on its Web site, El Pais said: "A grave infection in the large intestine, at least three failed operations and various complications have left the Cuban dictator, Fidel Castro, laid up with a very grave prognosis."

01/16 03:30 AM

Posted by: rdw on January 18, 2007 at 1:49 PM | PERMALINK

You mean he will be suffering from irreversible progressive senile dementia like you

Nah, liked most former libs he's getting mugged by reality. He works 70 hour a week and has the nerve to think it's his money he's earning. He doesn't realize libs made it all possible and he owes them.

To be honest I'm not the best influence in this regard. He's got a few freinds who are a bit on the lazy side and do almost everything under the table as bartenders or whatever. It drives him crazy to know they don't pay a dime in taxes when he'll pay over $20K this year. I almost hate myself for constantly reminding him.

Posted by: rdw on January 18, 2007 at 1:55 PM | PERMALINK

Nothing there about "a simple case of diverticulitis".

Nothing there about the operations being "routine".

Nothing there about the operations being "botched" or "butchered."

So you were just making it up.

Thanks for clarifying that.

I don't think you are actually "lying" in the normal sense of the word.

I think you are genuinely incapable of distinguishing between reality and the stuff you just make up.

Much like Ronald Reagan, who was known for telling audiences about his "war experiences", which were actually scenes from movies he had seen.

Yes, you are a true "Reagan conservative": senile and delusional.


Posted by: SecularAnimist on January 18, 2007 at 1:56 PM | PERMALINK

Just Wondering [John J. Miller]


If Cuba's health system is so spectacular — haven't we been hearing about this triumph of collectivism for a few decades now? — then why does the Castro regime have to import a surgeon from Spain?
**********************************8

The above is from NRO. How is it possible to think anything in Cuba works especially a health care system. They've been socialist for 45 years. Everything we know about socialism tells us it can only be a monstrously inept system. It's simply not possible for socialism to do anything well or even decently.

Posted by: rdw on January 18, 2007 at 2:02 PM | PERMALINK

SA,

We'll all find out in due time won't we? I hope he lingers on. He's the perfect example of the intellectual rot that pervades the left. He's going to be just as powerful an example as Arafat of the incredible stupidity of the left. You simple asses made him a billionaire and jet-setter for decades while he played you for fools every day. He joins a very long line of lefty butchers like Lenin, Stalin, Mao, Che, Arafat and so many others.

We can at least agree the security fence is working. Palestinians have gone back to killing each other rather than Jews. It's certainly been boffo for the Israeli economy. With the fence Israeli can concentrate along with the USA, India and Japan on improving our remote detection and targeting technology to constantly improve their security and the safety of the soldiers.

This is a clear case of good fences making good neighbors. There's no reason in the world for the jew and palestinains to interact. They can each go their own way. This process greatly benefits Israel with it's highly skilled highly educated economy.

Posted by: rdw on January 18, 2007 at 2:15 PM | PERMALINK

rdw: The above is from NRO.

It says nothing about "a simple case of diverticulitis", nothing about Castro's surgeries being "routine", and nothing about the surgeries being "botched" or "butchered."

Thanks for the additional evidence that you made up those baseless claims.

rdw: How is it possible to think anything in Cuba works especially a health care system.

By paying attention to actual facts about the actual world, instead of paying attention to your delusions about how things "must be" based on the scripted lies that are spoon-fed to ignorant, weak-minded, gullible fools such as yourself by the right-wing extremist propaganda machine.

I suppose in your mind, that any time anyone in the USA consults a medical specialist from another country, or any time that a US medical association invites a foreign medical specialist or researcher to lecture or present a paper at a conference, that proves that the entire US medical system is a complete failure.

You are quite a pitiful character, a delusional crank rapidly declining into gibbering incoherence. I'm sure it tests your hard-working son-in-law's patience to humor you.

Posted by: SecularAnimist on January 18, 2007 at 2:22 PM | PERMALINK

By paying attention to actual facts about the actual world

Socialism has always been a disaster. Over 60M were killed in China and Russia implementing disasterous policies. Cuba is a disaster. It has the lowest per capita income in the Americas. The life expectancy for males in Russia is 60. Socialism isn't an ideology it's a tradegy.

Posted by: rdw on January 18, 2007 at 2:38 PM | PERMALINK

SA,

Checking out the ecnomic reports? Oil is down near $50 on a terrific inventory report in the USA. Builds were huge for crude and gasoline and heating oil. Stocks for all groups are well above the average range. There's simply nothing to support these prices.

Also note jobless claims were their lowest in 11 months. Jobadds have been running well above expectations for 4 months and it looks as thought it'll be 5. We've also had much better than expected wage growth.

Between higher wages, robust jobadds and significantly lower energy costs we can expect very strong consumer spending.

Posted by: rdw on January 18, 2007 at 2:44 PM | PERMALINK

Checking out the ecnomic reports? Oil is down near $50 on a terrific inventory report in the USA.

I think you mean to say: George Bush's disastrous policies have pushed the price of oil up over 200% of what it was when he first took office.

Fortunately for the economy, global warming has helped push up oil inventories and lower the price of oil despite Bush's failures.

Sadly, the massive costs associated with climate change will offset any short term dip in the price of oil.

Posted by: trex on January 18, 2007 at 4:53 PM | PERMALINK

There you go again, spouting your senescient nonsense just like Raygun.

Socialism has always been a disaster. rightist dim wit at 2:38 PM
You need to learn the difference between Communism which you itemized if your comment and socialism. I recommend this book on economics.
...we can expect very strong consumer spending. rightist dim wit at 2:44 PM
There is no indication that consumer spending is trending up more than the inflation rate outside of your own fantasy world.
... There's no reason in the world for the jew and palestinains to interact... rightist dim wit at 2:15 PM
Since Israel is land stolen from the Palestinians, there is very good reason for interaction. Also, without American support the Israeli economy would tank. It's a classic failed state.
...How is it possible to think anything in Cuba works especially a health care system... rightist dim wit at 2:02 PM

We know the health care system works because they have a lower infant mortality rate than the capitalistic US. Calling in specialists is no big deal unless you're a desperate Republican Lickspittle.

I almost hate myself for constantly reminding him. rightist dim wit at 1:55 PM

It's too bad that in Bushworld, it pays to cheat on taxes.
for the Clintons. 8 years is fine rightist dim wit
at 1:41 PM

Eight years of the longest sustained economic growth in American history, 17 million new jobs created, a record. What's Raygun's record:? Recession, depression, debt and deficit.
...Palestinians are living in one of the world worst ghettos entirely the creation of liberals.... rightist dim wit at 10:01 AM |

The Gaza Ghetto is a creation of Zionists, and Republicans managed to make Saddam into a martyr. Nice going. In the meantime, Bush has lost Aznar, Berluscolli, about to lose his friends in Canada and Britain. It's not good to be a FOB. Not at all.
... Bill Gates has picked up over $10B the last few months. Exports are running up 13%. ... Jobs creation is screaming. ...rightist dim wit at 9:48 AM

I'll let you in on a little secret, every time someone curses a Microsoft product, Bill Gates makes $10. Exports are up but not as much as imports. The jobless rate fails to take into account the number of people who have left the workforce because of the lack of jobs. The Europeans unemployment rate is more honest than the American. Job creation sucks. Bush's numbers are pathetic compared to Clinton's. Tax receipt are up because of an amnesty program to bring in offshore accounts.
The housing numbers were the 3rd best December since 1950. rightist dim wit at 9:36 AM |

You just make stuff up, don't you? The housing market is down 22%, foreclosures are up 13%. Buy now, chum, buy big.

Posted by: Mike on January 18, 2007 at 5:57 PM | PERMALINK
You simple bastards! GWB has totally changed you world and you don't have a clue. rightist dim wit at 9:29 AM
Certainly, there is no one who has done more to aid the cause of bin Laden and create more political instability then your witless Dear Leader. Under his watch, terrorism is up, oil has doubled, South America is moving socialist, China is signing oil deals under our nose, and respect for American has reached record low numbers. His is the worst presidential record in history, especially if you include the massive defitis he has created. 3 trillion in 6 years. Awesome. Bush's job record shows that he has rarely created enough jobs in any month to serve those new workers entering the work force and that most of the jobs created have been in the low paying service industry or in government since he is increasing the size of government drastically.
I was referring to the hanging. rightist dim wit at 9:30 AM
Yup, a show trial and a farcical hanging. Your buddy Stalin couldn't have done it better. Posted by: Mike on January 18, 2007 at 6:09 PM | PERMALINK

Mike wrote to rdw: "You just make stuff up, don't you?"

The thing about rdw is not merely that he makes stuff up, but that he is apparently genuinely unable to distinguish between the stuff that he just makes up and reality. He appears to be really, truly delusional.

Posted by: SecularAnimist on January 18, 2007 at 6:34 PM | PERMALINK

The Gaza Ghetto is a creation of Zionists

Actually it's a creation of the Palestinians with help from the Oslo accords and the EU. The Palestinians are entering a period similar to that of Cuba in 1989 when Russia could no longer support them. Old Europe won't be supporting them much longer. Of course Cuba was once capitalist and had some wealth. Palestine has always been a Ghetto.

Posted by: rdw on January 18, 2007 at 7:17 PM | PERMALINK

Sadly, the massive costs associated with climate change will offset any short term dip in the price of oil.

The USA is already well ahead of that curve. Our homes are so friggin large we have our own micro-climates.

Posted by: rdw on January 18, 2007 at 7:19 PM | PERMALINK

You need to learn the difference between Communism which you itemized if your comment and socialism.

In the real world it's a difference without a distinction. Let's just note it as the lack of a private sector and keep it simple.

Posted by: rdw on January 18, 2007 at 7:21 PM | PERMALINK

There is no indication that consumer spending is trending up more than the inflation rate outside of your own fantasy world.

We had very strong consumer spending in December as well as business investment. The stats I was citing are leading indicators of spending. The lower fuel costs won't result in an increase in spending but a shift in spending.

Posted by: rdw on January 18, 2007 at 7:23 PM | PERMALINK

The jobless rate fails to take into account the number of people who have left the workforce because of the lack of jobs

Not it doesn't fail. It intentionlly excludes them from the rate but it does track them. If your a sad sack too pathetic to get off your ass to look for job you are not unemployed. You are worthless.

Posted by: rdw on January 18, 2007 at 7:25 PM | PERMALINK

no one who has done more to aid the cause of bin Laden

And I'm sure he's been counting his blessing in whatever cave he's been hiding. So too are the Taliban. They really didn't want a country of their own. They wanted to give up Afghanistan all along.

Posted by: rdw on January 18, 2007 at 7:27 PM | PERMALINK

Yup, a show trial and a farcical hanging.

Saddam didn't think it was a farce.

Posted by: rdw on January 18, 2007 at 7:29 PM | PERMALINK

rdw wrote: "Of course Cuba was once capitalist and had some wealth."

Of course, Cuba was once a US-backed military dictatorship where all the weath was owned and controlled by Batista, or the Mafia. Just the way you want the US to be.

rdw wrote: "In the real world it's a difference without a distinction."

Sure, in the "real world" of right-wing extremist bullshit, there is no distinction between a socialist country like Sweden and Stalin's USSR.

Or Red Communist China, where Communism is such a total failure that major US corporations are falling over themselves to make deals with China's Communist dictatorship to move their factories there.

You may be slow, but you're stupid.

Posted by: SecularAnimist on January 18, 2007 at 7:29 PM | PERMALINK

to move their factories there.


Actually they're not. They're building all over Asia and are even more interested in India. Companies building in China only do so to sell to the Chinese market. Intel is building a plant in China to sell chip to the Chinese market while plants in Vietnam and India are for the rest of Asia.

The least covered but possibly most far reaching moves by GWB have been with India with whom we have a great deal in common. Also uncovered have been multiple deals between Israel and India, Japan and India, Australia and India regarding trade and the sharing of military R&D. It seems GWB has banded together a very important coalition of mature democracies with common anti-terror and trade interests.

One of the cooler things about globalization is so few people really have any idea what's happening. A great deal can be accomplished under the noses of a press ignorant of basic economics.

Just consider the value of India. They have a huge very well educated middle class. The USA is litterally out of Skilled labor. Call 1-8000 for any tech question and you'l be taking to New Delhi. This is just getting started. It's becoming common for major US firms to have major staff in India that in a short time will represent the majority of their staff. Israel is having the same problem as is Japan.

This is the perfect coalition. The USA, Japan and Australia have no use for a European workforce underworked, over-regulated and over paid. Each of these nations is booming and facing critical labor shortages. India has a surplus of labor.

Intels sales to Europe dropped from 20% TO 19.5% last Qtr and are likely to drop 1/2% each Qtr. That's 10% in 5 years. By 2017 Intel won't get 10% of it's sales from Europe but will get over 70% from Asia.

That's about the ratio of importance, 7 to 1.

Posted by: rdw on January 18, 2007 at 7:45 PM | PERMALINK
...The USA is litterally out of Skilled labor. Call 1-8000 for any tech question and you'l be taking to New Delhi...rightist dim wit at 7:45 PM
The reason for that is while there is a surplus of labor in America, it's cheaper to use Indian workers and it increases the profits of multinational capitalists corporations who don't give a damn about American workers. Fortunately, the Europeans are smarter and insist their people be treated like humans, not like dogs.
Saddam didn't think it was a farce. rightist dim wit at 7:29 PM
The world did and was outraged at the undignified way it was carried out. That's why he has become a martyr, fool.
ting his blessing in whatever cave he's been hiding. So too are the Taliban. They rightist dim wit at 7:27 PM
bin Laden is living in comfort secure in the knowledge that Bush won't ever come after him. The Taliban is resurgent in Afghanistan because Bush is too incompetent to increase troops levels there.
Not it doesn't fail. It intentionlly excludes them from the rate but it does track them. ....rightist dim witat 7:25 PM
Actually, the workforce participation rate has fallen for most of the years of the Bush presidency because there has no been enough jobs created. Look at Clinton's numbers: 17 million to which Bush can offer around 4 million. A pathetic record for Bush. Even Raygun did better than Bush.
We had very strong consumer spending in December....rightist dim wit at 7:23 PM
Actually, most companies were disappointed by December sales. You need to read more and theorize out of your butt less.
In the real world it's a difference without a distinction...rightist dim wit at 7:21 PM
I can understand why you want to keep it simple, but the distinction is real and important. There is a private sector in socialists systems.
Actually it's a creation of the Palestinians with help from the Oslo accords rightist dim wit at 7:17 PM
Actually, it's a creation of the foundation of Israel in 1948 and predates the Oslo Accords, but thanks for showing your ignorance once again.
The USA is already well ahead of that curve. Our homes are so friggin large we have our own micro-climates.rdw at 7:19 PM
The US is well behind the curve in reducing carbon emmissions and large houses are hugely inefficient energy users. Posted by: Mike on January 18, 2007 at 8:12 PM | PERMALINK

The world did

90% of the world doesn't care at all and Europe doesn't count.

Posted by: rdw on January 18, 2007 at 8:15 PM | PERMALINK

rdw wrote: "The USA is litterally out of Skilled labor."

That's a lie. There is plenty of skilled labor in the USA. The big US corporations don't want to pay Americans an American salary with American benefits. That's why they export the jobs to low-wage countries like India.

I work in the computer field, and I have called software vendors' 800 numbers to their call centers in New Delhi. The people I talk to there don't know anything. They read me articles from the vendor's tech support web site, which I am perfectly capable of reading for myself, and have already read before I called them. And most of the time they read them to me in an incomprehensible accent.

If you want to talk to support techs who know something, you have to pay a lot of money for a support contract that lets you call a different 800 number which connects you to their senior support engineers in the US.

rdw wrote: "The USA, Japan and Australia have no use for a European workforce underworked, over-regulated and over paid."

The US corporations have no use for an American workforce. There is no "critical labor shortage". There is domination of the US economy by greedy corporations that don't want to pay Americans an American salary. They want to export jobs to slave economies like China.

Your contempt for your fellow Americans -- those who work for a living and are not ultra-rich -- is appalling, but typical of right-wing assholes like you.

After a while your appalling ignorance and your arrogant stupidity and your shameless making up bullshit and your sneering contempt for Americans who are not ultra-rich ceases to be comical and becomes boring.

I pity your poor son-in-law who has to listen to your ignorant drivel. I am sure he will be glad when you finally degenerate to the point where you just sit quietly and drool. It can't be very far off.

Posted by: SecularAnimist on January 18, 2007 at 8:17 PM | PERMALINK

The reason for that is while there is a surplus of labor in America

Nope, there are shortages in virtually all industries and with the surge of retirements to come it could become quite the problem. Fortunately GWB has been paying attention and our trade deals with India and others set up Corporate America for the rapid expansion to come. It's been estimated for every job created in the USA by American business at least one is created in Asia.

You can't walk in a retail store and miss the help wanted signs.

Posted by: rdw on January 18, 2007 at 8:19 PM | PERMALINK
90% of the world doesn't care at all and Europe doesn't count.rightist dim wit at 8:15 PM
That is racist and stupid. The EU has a larger population and GDP than the US in addition to having a better medical system, better transportation system, and higher living standards. Posted by: Mike on January 18, 2007 at 8:21 PM | PERMALINK

The Taliban is resurgent in Afghanistan

The taliban is present in Pakistan and getting slaughtered whenever they enter Afghanistan. They're also getting slaughterd in Pakistan. The kill ratio in Afghanistan of 50-1 is the highest ever recorded between combantants. Better yet it's a true 21st century war with the latest in high tech imaging, targeting and weaponry. Most of the 50 taliban getting killed get kiled without ever seeing their prey. They are spotted by a drone and killed by the drone or another USAF platform.

Posted by: rdw on January 18, 2007 at 8:22 PM | PERMALINK

The US corporations have no use for an American workforce.

The american workforce is doing splendidly. We are by far the wealthiest nation in the history of creation.

Posted by: rdw on January 18, 2007 at 8:23 PM | PERMALINK
Nope, there are shortages in virtually all industries rightist dim wit at 8:19 PM
You can repeat your wild assertions ad infinitum, but empirical facts are facts: there is no labor shortage in the US. There are people looking for work. That is the definition of a jobs shortage. Posted by: Mike on January 18, 2007 at 8:24 PM | PERMALINK
The american workforce is doing splendidly rightist dim wit at 8:23 PM
Saying its so doesn't make it so. The wealth in the US is highly concentrated in the upper 10% and even more in the upper 1%.. Debt is not wealth.
he taliban is present in Pakistan and getting slaughtered whenever they enter Afghanistan. ....rightist dim wit at 8:22 PM
The Taliban is in control of some parts of Afghanistan and the opium crop there is at an all time high. [pun intended]. That opium is funding the Taliban. They can lose more; they live there; they have more people. Posted by: Mike on January 18, 2007 at 8:28 PM | PERMALINK

The EU has a larger population and GDP than the US in addition to having a better medical system, better transportation system, and higher living standards

You got the higher population correct but GDP is smaller and getting smaller every day. Per capita GDP is 67% USA levels and by 2025 will be less than 50% USA levels.

Unlike Europeans Americans have cars, several of them and they're quite large. Europe can have their transportation system. Their medical systems and living standards are well behind the USA and lagging further all the time.

Old Europe is in dire straits. They cannot possibly sustain their welfare states with the demographic collapse. The rise of Asia as an economic and diplomatic force is coming directly out of the share held by Europe as the USA is maintaining it's share of Global GDP and remains the lone super-power.

Posted by: rdw on January 18, 2007 at 8:29 PM | PERMALINK

but empirical facts are facts: there is no labor shortage in the US

Yes they are. 4.5% unemployment is below full employment. You can't walk into a store without seeing a help wanted sign. Allow me to explain. That means they do not have enough workers. They are short workers.

The shortage is across virtually all industries except for autos.

Posted by: rdw on January 18, 2007 at 8:33 PM | PERMALINK
...I pity your poor son-in-law .... SecularAnimist at 8:17 PM
I'm sure he is used to humoring this fool. I pity his daughter. Doubtless, he's been an embarrassment to her all her life. Posted by: Mike on January 18, 2007 at 8:36 PM | PERMALINK

Mike to rdw: That is racist and stupid.

rdw is racist and stupid. What do you expect from an ignorant, stupid racist except ignorant, racist stupidity?

Haven't you noticed that rdw's entire discourse revolves around his hatred for others? Whether it is "Europeans" or "liberals", rdw loves to hate. He has to hate someone to have a sense of self-worth. All right-wing assholes are like that, and he is no exception.

The only difference between rdw and the Nazi brownshirts is that they were usually young "tough guys" who liked to beat up the people they hated, and rdw is a drooling, gibbering senile old fool who merely rants about them in a blog. But, like them, he is absolutely dependent on hatred for his emotional existence.

Arguing with him will get you nowhere. He has no concept of the truth or of reality, nor does he care about it. All that matters to him is slavishly regurgitating right-wing propaganda. When you point out that he is lying, he will just repeat his lies with ever growing agitation.

He is genuinely cracked.


Posted by: SecularAnimist on January 18, 2007 at 8:42 PM | PERMALINK
Yes they are. 4.5% unemployment is below full employment.... rightist dim wit at 8:33 PM
You are being silly again. Remember the unemployment numbers were lower during the Clinton administration when under 3% was considered full employment. 4.5 is high, and if the workforce participation rate is taken into account, it's higher. Believe me, if retail would pay more, they would have more workers. Those with signs are bottom feeders looking to exploit, not employ.
but GDP is smaller and getting smaller every day.rightist dim wit at 8:29 PM
You are talking out of your butt again. The EU GDP is over 12 trillion, the US around 11. 12 is bigger than 11. Using per capita numbers doesn't take into account the more equitable income distribution in Europe as opposed to the US with its hundreds of billionaires and millions of lower middle class and working poor. Posted by: Mike on January 18, 2007 at 8:42 PM | PERMALINK

Mike wrote: I'm sure he is used to humoring this fool. I pity his daughter. Doubtless, he's been an embarrassment to her all her life.

rdw thinks he is converting his hard-working union carpenter son-in-law into a Bush-bootlicking "Reagan conservative". In reality, the poor kid probably waits until rdw is gone to say to his wife, "Don't you think your dad would be better off in a nursing home, or something?"

I must admit that I alternate between feeling pity for rdw, and feeling disgust with his ignorant, arrogant viciousness.

Posted by: SecularAnimist on January 18, 2007 at 8:46 PM | PERMALINK
He is genuinely cracked.
Yes, it's obvious, he's insane. I've seen people like him on NYC streets carrying signs and passing out leaflets. Here in CA, his type are endlessly writing illegible scribbles in notebooks Posted by: Mike on January 18, 2007 at 8:47 PM | PERMALINK
feeling disgust with his ignorant, arrogant viciousness.
True, time to move to another thread, n'est pas? Posted by: Mike on January 18, 2007 at 8:56 PM | PERMALINK

rdw: We are by far the wealthiest nation in the history of creation.

Wrong again. We're not even the wealthiest nation right now. That would be Luxembourg.

And using the more reflective GNI to measure wealth the United States is actually 6th in the world.

You bozo.

Posted by: trex on January 19, 2007 at 12:24 AM | PERMALINK

That would be Luxembourg.

it's not a nation. It's a suburb

Posted by: rdw on January 19, 2007 at 8:51 AM | PERMALINK

In reality, the poor kid probably waits until rdw is gone

He's not poor. Their combined income from reported earninps will be over $150K but because they are maxing out deferred savings plans, on my instructions, they'll report less than $130k and with two investment properties plus their own heavily mortgages home they max out teir tax deductions.

By putting away 16% of their combined income in tax deferred and then maxing out Roth Ira's they will retire by age 50 with at least two homes fully paid for.

The lad, a hard working high school grad has learned he's not just a real estate investor. I explained how many investors made a fortune on Home Depot when they recognized what a great idea it was. He's keeping his eye out for good companies in his industry.

We're all stock market investors now. It wasn't until he realized his pension and savings were going into stocks that he learned he's an investor whether he likes it or not. He also learned the guys in the shop are just as interested in stock market tips as anyone else.

This isn't your daddy's work. Your working class hero now reads the stock tablers.

Posted by: rdw on January 19, 2007 at 8:59 AM | PERMALINK

?And using the more reflective GNI to measure wealth

All of the income measures are deeply flawed with each missing large categories of income. The best indicator is to watch consumption. You cannot drive 3 miles without passing 5 developments filled with large beautiful homes that are filled with the best of everything. Even better is to drive through any coastal resort and witness the incredible building boom of 2nd homes.

This is not the top 1% of the population owning 60% of the housing stock. Along with this amazing surge we have record home ownership.

You just can't beat capitalism in the supply-side age.

You think we're disgusting Americans now wait another 20 years. The biggest problem young parents have is finding room for all of the toys and closet space for the clothes.
These kids will have cable TV/DVD by the time they're 3 and cell phones by 10.

Under GWB the USA had relevered it's investments away from Old Europe to fast frowing Asia. Out share of global GDP will be st eady or higher while Asia's growing share will come directly from Old Europe.

Posted by: rdw on January 19, 2007 at 9:12 AM | PERMALINK
...Under GWB the USA had relevered it's investments away from Old Europe to fast frowing Asia... rightist dim wit at 9:12 AM
As every one knows, the reason for investment in China is for cheap, near slave wages. That is a merre reflection of capitalist greed.

The Clinton-Gore record of accomplishments
Closing the Book on A Generation of Deficits -- in 1992, the deficit was $290 billion, a record dollar high. In 1999, we had a budget surplus of $124 billion -- the largest dollar surplus on record (even after adjusting for inflation) and the largest as a share of our economy since 1951. With the President's plan, we are now on track to eliminate the nation's publicly held debt by 2015.
More than 20 Million New Jobs -- more than 92 percent (18.5 million) of the new jobs have been created in the private sector, the highest percentage in 50 years. This is the most jobs ever created under a single Administration -- and more new jobs than Presidents Reagan and Bush created during their three terms. Under President Clinton, the economy has added an average of 244,000 jobs per month, the highest of any President on record. This compares to 52,000 per month under President Bush and 167,000 per month under President Reagan.
Fastest and Longest Real Wage Growth in Two Decades -- Since 1993, real wages have grown 6.5 percent -- compared to declining 4.3 percent during the previous two administrations. In 1998, real wages were up 2.7 percent -- that's the fastest annual real wage growth in over 20 years.
Unemployment Is the Lowest in 29 Years -- down from 7.5 percent in 1992 to 4.1 percent today -- staying below 5 percent for 29 months in a row.
Highest Homeownership Rate in History -- In the third quarter 1999, the homeownership rate was 67.0 -- the highest ever recorded.

Those were heady days, eh rightist dim wit? That's when the American economy was the 1st wonder of the world. Now you brag that it's the 8th, a sorry decline.
Under Bush, workforce participation down, poverty up by over 3 million people, mostly children. Tsk! Tsk!!

Posted by: Mike on January 19, 2007 at 11:54 AM | PERMALINK
...It's a suburb rightist dim wit at 8:51 AM
It's a nation by those stubborn, irreducible facts you hate so much.
because they are maxing out deferred savings plans, on my instructions,...rightist dim witat 8:59 AM
Anyone foolish enough to even listen to you deserves what they get.

Check the real employment rate
...The unemployment rate in the U.S. is misleading. It only shows people looking for work, not people who have given up looking or are off unemployment benefits. Include these people in the unemployment rate!

The real unemployment rate is 23%

The federal government claims the unemployment rate for 2004 was 5.5% But the government’s “unemployment rate” statistic is a propaganda device. It does not count as “unemployed” people who are “not in the labor force.” According to economist Richard DuBoff, participation in the labor force by working-age males has been *drifting downward for more than 40 years. Therefore, the government’s official “unemployment rate” is an increasingly misleading statistic.
*According to the government’s own 2004 statistics, the civilian non-institutional population of United States males, age 16 and over, was 107.7 million people. Of those 107.7 million males, 14.7 million were estimated to be age 65 or over. Therefore, the number of men between 16 and 64, which traditionally constitutes this nation’s workforce, was 93 million.
Of those 93 million men, the government admits that 4.4 million of them are unemployed. And when I say unemployed, I mean utterly and completely inactive. The government considers someone “employed” if they work as little as one hour a week. People who do not even work one hour a week are still considered “employed” if they are “temporarily absent” from work.
But in addition to the 4.4 million men who are officially “unemployed” the government admits that 28.7 million men over 16 are “not in the labor force.” Subtracting from this 28.7 million the estimated 11.9 million men 65 and over belonging to that group, results in 16.8 million men between the ages of 16 and 64 who are “not in the labor force.”
Adding the 4.4 million officially unemployed to the 16.8 million who are factually unemployed yields a total of 21.2 million unemployed men between the ages of 16 and 64.
These 21.2 million unemployed men of working age represent almost 23% of the 93 million working age men in the United States.d

Posted by: Mike on January 19, 2007 at 11:59 AM | PERMALINK
You just can't beat capitalism in the supply-side age.rightist dim wit at 9:12 AM
Supplyside economics is a sad joke on Americans. It leads to high deficits, heavy borrowing and slower economic growth. Here is a book on economics that should help you Posted by: Mike on January 19, 2007 at 12:04 PM | PERMALINK

As every one knows, the reason for investment in China is for cheap, near slave wages. That is a merre reflection of capitalist greed.

You s/b worried for your Old Europe pals. A higher portion of their investment is going into China than for the USA. American multi-nationals are very well disbursed generally avoiding places like Russia and China where the rule of law is so thin.

Chinese lifestyles are improving quite rapidly despite nasty distortions between urban and rural populations. There are many, many problems in China but it's much better than under pure socialism.

Posted by: rdw on January 19, 2007 at 3:12 PM | PERMALINK

The real unemployment rate is 23%

That's funny. I know a lot of people. I have 4 kids with 3 in their 20's. They have a lot of friends at an age when they're looking for employment.

I don't know a single unemployed person. Yet you say one in four are unemployed.

You are so far from reality. We are just entering a massive labor shortage. we are not far form the day the USA will be creating as many jobs in India as in the USA.

Posted by: rdw on January 19, 2007 at 3:16 PM | PERMALINK

Mike, rdw is wasting your time.

He has nothing to offer but incoherent drivel, and repetitiously incoherent drivel at that.

He's a ignorant, weak-minded, delusional crank and an irrelevant member of an irrelevant lunatic fringe.

Don't let him waste any more of your time. You have better things to do.

Posted by: SecularAnimist on January 19, 2007 at 3:19 PM | PERMALINK

rdw wrote: "I don't know a single unemployed person."

Wow, then there must not be any unemployed people in the whole USA.

Idiot.

Posted by: SecularAnimist on January 19, 2007 at 3:22 PM | PERMALINK
...I don't know a single unemployed person. Yet you say one in four are unemployed. ... rightist dim wit at 3:16 PM
That is stupid even by your standards. Personal data, even if you are telling the truth which is always dubious in your case, is not valid beyond the personal.
...like Russia and China where the rule of law is so thin.... rightist dim wit at 3:12 PM |
You need to worry about the lack of a rule of law in America, chum; where the Cheney/Bush regime thinks it is above the law. It's too bad for Americans that they don't share the European values system: 4 week vacation, more equitable income levels, national health insurance, responsive, socialistic governments.

SecularAnimist:

So do we all, but it's amusing to bait him and call him on his every off-topic comment. Why should he be given a pass? All he does is take some slow thread, place dozens of whack comments on it and think he's smart.

Posted by: Mike on January 19, 2007 at 5:50 PM | PERMALINK




 

 

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