It's not a mutt; it's a Labrador Retriever.

To us cat people, they're all mutts.....

Yes, it's a Lab. A Lab will follow you anywhere, even up a killer mountain in the middle of winter if only you tell her she's a good dog.

That news story is 100% backwards. The dog didn't lay on the people to help them stay warm, the dog was trying to leach heat off them.

Well, I've said it before, and I'll say it again.

Cats are like autistic dogs.

That's the best I can say about them. And I'm a cat owner (though not of my own volition).

But let's face it: no cat, no matter how smart, would be electable; while many dogs have already become President.

-John Thomas;

If the mountaineers hadn't made it, would anyone say the dog didn't try hard enough? My dog has never once saved my life, and I still let him sleep on the sofa. "Heroism" is a poor metric for pet superiority.

I say, if it's licks don't hurt my hand, it's a good pet.

Velvet is not a Lab, it's a black mutt that *might* have some Lab. Judging from the photos, not much. According to the Portland Oregonian, the dog jumped into the owners' car a couple of years ago when they were down in the SW somewhere. The dog did what dogs do: loyally followed the stupid owner wherever he went (including falling off a cliff) and kept them warm because that's what dogs do, as well. Unfortunately, the dog (being a dog) didn't simply refuse to climb the damn mountain the middle of winter. Dogs just aren't wired that way.

Ah, labs. They're one of my favorite types of dogs despite being ridiculously stupid. Seriously, those dogs were bred to love. My parents have a lab, and I always joke that she is such a vicious guard dog that if you pet her she'll show you the valuables. They're good companions, though.

And then when the sunny day came, the cat would again have told them to relax, take a nap, and wait for ... some other kind of day. If it were up to cats, nobody would ever do anything. "Doing things is for suckers," says the cat. "Doing nothing is the way to live a fulfilling life."

"F that!" says the dog.

Dogs = awesome.

OT: companies are really beginning to make money off this war on terra thing. check these links. It's depressing.

one
two

To us cat people, they're all mutts...

This type of species bigotry is unacceptable!!!

/snark

To be honest, while I'm probably considered a "dog person" (we have three right now), I have no issues with cats. I've had both as pets, and both have their plusses and minuses.

Three things, however, should be noted:

1. Anyone who owns a pet (myself included) only does so due to lonliness, co-dependence, or because your kid convinced you he or she would take care of it. Sorry, but it's true. The one exception may be fish, who are pretty much there for looks (with the exception of an oscar I had in college that I'm convinced thought it was an aquatic cat ... but I digress.)

2. While cats are capable of showing "love," I simply haven't felt the same connection with any cat that I've had with most dogs. For example, after my first back surgery, one of our dogs didn't leave my side for three days. My wife had to make sure he ate and drank because he wanted to ensure I was okay.

3. As the parent of a toddler, I simply can't see any cat tolerating what my son has done to our dogs -- pulling tails, grabbing, etc. The Boy treats them nicely now, but if he had done that stuff to a cat, we'd have to re-name my son "One Eye McStubbyfinger." Granted, many dogs wouldn't put up with it either, but not a single cat I've ever had or met would have. Maybe someone with a toddler and cats can correct me on this ...

Don't get me wrong -- I'm not saying dogs as a whole are better than cats. Just sayin'.

Cats may be involved with us, but dogs are committed.

Which helps explain why there are no seeing-eye cats.

I can put up with these "dogs save lives" stories as long as the storyteller also finds time to mention that dogs kill a lot of people every year. I've never heard of a cat-mauling before.

Moses: Actually, on your point #3, I have a friend who's gone through this exact experience. The cat came through it fine. So did the kid. But I'll admit that the cat's forbearance always struck us as pretty amazing.

charlie don't surf: "... the dog was trying to leach heat off them."

Naturally. And if Velvet had been a cat (some kind of weird, mountain-climbing cat), this fact would've been obvious immediately. I mean, who ever heard of a heroic cat??

I am kind of concerned about this story, to go up a dangerous mountain in winter, with an animal, fall off a ledge because hey, its winter on a dangerous mountain!

Endanger yourself, endanger the animal, and get rescuers up there to save your ass. I think those doofus's should be charged for the rescuers hours and the equipment useage, and PETA should hump them good for endangering the animal.

And why is Kevin dog blogging. Separation of church and state, please!!!! Church=cat, dog=state. Or is that vise versa?

This reminds me of a thought problem my brother once presented to me:

Imagine you could be shrunk down to a 3 inch tall person. Then you told your dog, "sit". Your dog would likely sit...your cat, on the other hand, would slap you around the living room for an hour before he devoured you.

One of the many reasons I am a cat person.

... I have a friend who's gone through [the toddler with a cat] experience. The cat came through it fine. So did the kid. But I'll admit that the cat's forbearance always struck us as pretty amazing.

I'm convinced it would take one amazing cat to tolerate the stuff our kid used to do to our dogs.

Although there is the chance our dogs just aren't that bright ...

And why is Kevin dog blogging. Separation of church and state, please!!!! Church=cat, dog=state.

Yeah, we'll see just how good Kevin is at pulling off his famous "objectivity" and "balance".

The rescued should be punished severly with expensive fines for risking their dog's life and the lives of their rescuers.

Um - most warm blooded animals huddle for warmth in severely cold environments. It's a mutual survival kind of thing. Nothing selfless about it.

[quote]Velvet is not a Lab, it's a black mutt that *might* have some Lab [/quote]

Yeah, looks like it has some husky or chow in it.

[quote]Ah, labs. They're one of my favorite types of dogs despite being ridiculously stupid. Seriously, those dogs were bred to love. [/quote]

My black lab would probably have the same to say about you.

I think your confusing labs (who were bred to pull ropes in frigid waters for Portuguese galleons and fishermen, and subsequently used for hunting and helping handicapped people) for Golden Retrievers (who were bred to make ugly families more photogenic.)

It is very dangerous to anthropomorphize dogs and project morality (or any ethos other than loyalty and desire to eat for that matter) on them, but that said, my black lab is smarter than 75% of the National Review readers and 100% of its staff.

Last time I went to the beach, my girlfriend took a video of my lab swimming out past the shorebreak to pull me by my trunks back to land. Being a former lifeguard, I was impressed with his technique and determination.

Don't get me wrong, I love cats, and have had many, but, well, the only selfless act any cat has ever done that I've witnessed involves leaving dead animals at the door. Cats are kinda like Republicans in that regard.

The rescued should be punished severly with expensive fines for risking their dog's life and the lives of their rescuers.

They should just clip off a couple of their toes.

Tell them they were frostbitten.

Labs are great dogs, but dumb as rocks. Mine gets pushed around by the mutt half his size and the cat who is like a tenth his size and going on 16. That being said he is loyal, waits (drooling) until you tell him he can eat, will sit for hours when you pet him, loves to snuggle and does not leach heat because he has a body temperature some 7 or so degrees higher than mine. He is a pack animal and believes that my wife, the other dog, the cat and I are all members of his pack. Strangely the other dog does not feel that way preferring to go on walk abouts whenever she gets the chance. he would certainly follow me up a mountain in winter, but if I did not throw something for him to fetch he would whine and cry constantly about the idiocy of being out in such perilous conditions without a good reason, like playing fetch.

Fuck you, cat person.

I can put up with these "dogs save lives" stories as long as the storyteller also finds time to mention that dogs kill a lot of people every year. I've never heard of a cat-mauling before.

You, my friend have never spent time with my girlfriends cat.

Having said that, you do have a point about pit bulls. I'd append onto your appendage that the storyteller has to mention the fact that some dogs kill people because those some dogs are pit bulls with irresponsible owners.

My pug is somewhat of a princess, there is no way she would go up a mountain in winter. She doesn't do bad weather. That being said, she is great at keeping me warm when the temperature dips.

My cat was a great little snuggler, too. We all have our favorites.

If you want to see what a dog can really do in a crisis, read the short story 'Heart of a Champion' by T. C. Boyle. One of his many great stories.

I can put up with these "dogs save lives" stories as long as the storyteller also finds time to mention that dogs kill a lot of people every year. I've never heard of a cat-mauling before.

I guess we'll have to stop reporting stories about white/black/korean/inuit people until they start reporting about all the bad things they do.

There are places where I won't take my lab, like on trails in national parks where they aren't allowed, but in general, having an animal that's going to be 100% more in tune with nature than you anytime you're in the outdoors is always a good idea. In this case, it was just a big heater--other times they are good bear alarms, avalanche predictors and routefinders.

My pug on the other hand? He'd agree with Kevin's cat's analysis.

Memo to Libby:

How to get public's minds off of Halliburton graft:

Pay Britney 100 thou to shave her noggin.

On the fourth hand, cat people have serious mental health issues.

My cocker spaniel earns his keep. His job is to chase cats out of our yard. And a damned fine job he does of it, too. Scares the shit out of those mangy furballs.

My cockatiel is smarter than ten cats put together. And her droppings don't stink and she doesn't need a litter box.

Nothing reeks worse than cat shit. Nothing.

Slate had an interesting article about pet devotion a few weeks ago:

...Archer suggests, "consider the possibility that pets are, in evolutionary terms, manipulating human responses, that they are the equivalent of social parasites." Social parasites inject themselves into the social systems of other species and thrive there. Dogs are masters at that. They show a range of emotions love, anxiety, curiosity and thus trick us into thinking they possess the full range of human feelings.
...
"It appears that dogs have evolved specialized skills for reading human social and communicative behavior," Hare concludes, which is why dogs live so much better than moles.

As for all of this posting about the lab in Velvet, the Oregonian says that she also has a mix of shepherd and cattle dog, to boot. So, who out there now wants to besmirch the intelligence of shepherds and cattle dogs?

For everyone of these heroes, there's a bunch (herd, gaggle, pride -- um shame?) like this:

http://www.post-trib.com/news/253479,Pooed.article

Pet Ranking:
1) Pugs
2) Puggles
3) Beagles
4) other dogs

8) Cats

I can only hope that the Friday dog will be an adorable puggle.

P.S. Cats are adorable - but they are less affectionate than I expect from an animal I feed and care for in return for . . . affection.

Also: "Want boxes of shit in your house? Buy a cat!"

A fucking cat would still be sitting in some corner somewhere, doing nothing, Kev.

"Welcome to my lab, ha ha ha ha (evil laugh). Welcome to my labratory..."

--Plankton

Can't we all just get along? Cats are great. Dogs are great. I grew up in a home where we frequently had both. I remember Fred, an adorable but stupid dog, who came to us as a puppy when we had two established cats. He always thought he was a cat and broke his leg one day trying to follow his friends along the narrow edge of a wall cats could negotiate and he couldn't.
I have two dogs now, and want cats, but many of my wife's friends and relatives are allergic. Sounds like a feature rather than a bug to me, but I haven't been able to persuade my wife yet.

Balto.'nuff said

theThirdPaul: "As for all of this posting about the lab in Velvet, the Oregonian says that she also has a mix of shepherd and cattle dog, to boot. So, who out there now wants to besmirch the intelligence of shepherds and cattle dogs?"

Like I said: mutt. The article also says the people met Velvet when she jumped into their car. Which is to say, they have absolutely no real idea what dogs went into the mix of her ancestry. Guesses, yeah, but it's not as if Velvet was carrying papers when she made that leap of faith.

"So, who out there now wants to besmirch the intelligence of shepherds and cattle dogs?"

Seen on bumper sticker: "My border collie is smarter than your honor student"

My cairn terrior keeps the squirrels away from the bird feeder, mostly. My cat is an excellent mouser. Both snuggle at our feet on a cold winter night. Both are good.

pets are, in evolutionary terms, manipulating human responses

That is my thought for all domesticated animals. Humans' one unique quality may be hubris, which explains why most people cannot fathom that animals are sapient and manipulate them for survival. There is probably an exchange and a mutual exploitation, but which species dominates the benefit is a question that cannot be answered.

For my money, best I can tell is that cat owners tend to have a chip on their shoulders or an insecurity complex about dog owners that doesn't go the other way.

I'm a dog man through and through...but I could care less about whether you own cats, like cats, think cats are better, etc.

I really could.

You see cat owners all the time casting aspersions at dogs and dog owners. The inferiority complex is bizzare and kinda funny really, especially considering that I rarely see dog owners doing the same sort of condescending nose-peering-down activity toward cats and cat owners.

Does this finally answer the timeless question mother's have asked for years?!

If Johnny jumped off a Cliff would you do it too?"

Couldn't care less, I should say. Duh.

The last dog I had -- a sheltie -- was always so excited to see me (or anyone, for that matter) that she's spin in circles and bark repeatedly and then pee while she was still spinning.

No, I really don't miss having a dog.

As someone who's owned countless cats and only three dogs, it seems silly (and unfounded) to claim one is smarter than the other. Dogs' "intelligence" is, often, just a result of having been domesticated for so many generations that they've learned to pick up on our cues.

And the majority of my cats have been affectionate to the point of... excessive. It's endearing, actually, to have a cat be so happy to see me come home that he asks to be picked up and carried on my hip like he's a baby.

And it's wonderful to have a dog happy to see me every time I return home with the same level of enthusiasm, regardless of whether I was gone all day at work or simply ran an errand and returned 20 minutes later.

My dog is half German shepherd, half keeshond (Dutch furball), and believe me, she's smart. More important, she's sweet, obedient, and gentle. When people actually ask me, "Can you bring Bailey over when you visit this weekend? We'd love to see her!" I know she's a good dog. I'd never camp without her.

My dog, Pepper, has protected me from untold kitten attacks, for which I am grateful.

Prejudice against cats is widespread. Cats often defy authority and do what they think is in their best interests, which stimulates resentment. This type of behavior is also used for justification to start wars. I have not counted the times I have heard Iran has defied the US or the UN on MSM news programs the last year, but it has been as frequently heard as cats are too aloof.

My recently deceased kitty was the most affectionate animal I have ever known. But I love dogs, too.

President Clinton had a cat. Both W. Bush and LBJ had dogs. Perhaps that explains our wars of aggression: The Manchurian Fido.

I rarely see dog owners doing the same sort of condescending nose-peering-down activity toward cats and cat owners

Don't know about that. Last week, a morning DJ on a major Boston "oldies" station went through a five-minute rant, the theme of which was that men who like cats must be gay. And it was clear from the context that he was not neutral on the subject of gayness.

Sometimes I read these cat-vs-dog arguments and I think "they must be kidding" and then realize that a few people are getting truly hot under the collar. What's wrong with these people?

What's wrong with these people?

A cat or an Iranian defied them.

You see cat owners all the time casting aspersions at dogs and dog owners. The inferiority complex is bizzare and kinda funny really, especially considering that I rarely see dog owners doing the same sort of condescending nose-peering-down activity toward cats and cat owners.

You obviously didn't read the post Kevin linked to, nor many of the posts in this thread.

I adore dogs and cats, OK? So it's not like I'm slamming one or the other OK?

Here goes:

Dogs are pack animals. They love and need a pack. They will defend that pack to the death. They have evolved to be that way.

Cats are not pack animals. They have no evolutionary development of finding their createst fulfillment as part of a larger whole, nor as sacrificing themselves for that larger whole. it's simply not part of their wiring.

Cats do, however, have the potential to develop a *pride* psychology - to enjoy and be affectionate within a loose confederation of housemates - and even to behave protectively towards other members of their prides.

Most housecats who are loved exhibit pride behavior. But it's not a given at all.

With a dog, pack behavior is a given. I've heard of dogs who were so badly abused by their humans it breaks your heart, yet still - still! -crawled to them for comfort, were still loyal to them, etc. That is not saintliness. It's hardwiring.

A cat or an Iranian defied them.

Worse yet, a Persian cat.

We've had really smart and really stupid cats, so to generalize about animal intelligence is pointless.

Although when people boasted that their dog was "smart" because it could be "trained" to do "tricks," I swear our Comrade used to chuckle....

I have two cats (who look identical to Kevin's cats) and a dog. All are very, very affectionate, especially my male cat Pinto. He cannot stand not being in physical contact with me 24/7. And considering he's put on a fair amount of weight it isn't always pleasant to have him sitting on me for long periods of time. But I still love them all.

If you are gonna be out there in the wildnerness having a good sized dog with you is, well, a doggone good idea.......

Doubt a cat would be of much use, though. They might bring you mice to eat...thats about it.

Two alternative headlines.

1) Heroic dog saves lives of fallen climbers by keeping them warm all night.

2) Climbers found dead after cat draws all the warmth and oxygen from their bodies.

Fortunately, these climbers had a dog.

The dog keeps you warm,The cat will give you at least one meal. ha ha. Dog lover two shelties.

Kevin.....I'm not pleased with your dismissive dog comments! I have three wondeful companions - a comic Bostern Terrier, a Beagle who dances like Garfield's pal Odie and a 18 y.o. little terrier mutt who thinks she royalty. They are endless sources of amusement and comfort. Lets have some dogblogging........

Hi, Kevin-- If you tire easily of heroic dog stories, for the love of god get Animal Planet Channel blocked from your local cable/satellite provider. That's the essence of APC's business plan.

bn

Lo and behold the cat v. dog piefight/blogswarm.

My take: Dogs probably are more heroic, but cats have more personality (sometimes too much). Dogs are all pretty much one note all the time, if you like that (and I do), then you're probably gonna love dogs. But I bet if any dog person spent enough time with a cat to get on the cat's good side they'd (while not diminishing their love of dogs) become cat people. It happened to me, with my girlfriends Egyptian Mau. Of course, the Mau is a very doglike breed, but still, I never thought I'd like a cat this much.

Actually Nied...I did. That's kinda the point.

I have had many cats & dogs. The best cat thought it was a dog.

OK, but seriously. I just spent three days at my sister's house. Her daughter owns a Husky mix who's just adorable. Always there, under your feet. That's the problem! Has no brain, to speak of. Got home to my 3.5 cats. They'll dote on you, kill mice for you, sleep on you, crap all over the kitchen floor for you, (oh wait, that's a bug from the 17 YO cat)...

I really like dogs, but they're too damn much work. The dog on Mt. Hood, by any standard, is not heroic. It did what dogs do. Found a warm place to sleep.

A cat would have been smart enough to tell its owner to go to hell...

Brojo:That is my thought for all domesticated animals. Humans' one unique quality may be hubris, which explains why most people cannot fathom that animals are sapient and manipulate them for survival. There is probably an exchange and a mutual exploitation, but which species dominates the benefit is a question that cannot be answered.

Actually, in my mind there's no doubt. Cats win every time.

CaseyL: Pretty good description of the differences in behavior between cats and dogs. There was an interesting program on tv some years back (Nova?) in which farm cats were filmed by hidden cameras (since we all know that cats are sneaky and cannot be directly observed; they cheat). At any rate, the cats were surprisingly social with one another and would go out of their way to make physical contact with other cats. To the casual observer, it appeared that they just wandered past each other on their strolls, but the camera demonstrated that they actually rubbed up against each other as they passed.

No recorded behavior of one cat hiding behind the door to pounce on an unsuspecting cat and scare the shit out of it, as they are wont to do with humans.

Have had cats and have had a dog. It's just, well, different.

"Every man should have a dog to make him think he's God and a cat to remind him he's not."

I agree with Kevin. And, yes, I am all atingle with excitement about Friday. Hope I can stand it. However, in the meantime, I will take a nap with my cats.

I would like to add that I have found that most men like dogs because dogs are subservient. The men who like cats are exceptional and too few. Cats are just too independent for most men.

Dogs always chewed my favorite shoes and tore into the garbage.
Cats, however, seemed to wait for my return home, snuggling up and purring.
Unconditional love.
No contest.

OK, I said this over in Eschaton's comments, and I'll say it again here - the real reason these guys were rescued was because they took gear with them that allowed them to easily by located and rescued during a storm. Specifically, a cell phone, GPS device, and a rescue beacon. If they hadn't had those things with them, chances are the dog would not have been able to keep them alive long enough to be rescued. The headlin on MSNBC right now is actually: "Dog helped climbers survive storm". It should say "Rescue equipment helped climbers be rescued."

Couple points. I had a cat who rescued my entire household by LOUDLY raising the alarm about a housefire. If he had wanted to he could have got out easily by himself & left us all to burn. Instead he went around from bedroom to bedroom yowling like he'd gone insane, thus awakening & alerting us to the fire. This is not an isolated icident & many instances of cats-behaving-like-Lassie have been reported worldwide.

2nd, regarding the person that said "you want a
box of shit in your house get a cat." Uh...do you really want to go there, doglover? Yeah, cats bury their shit, even if they are locked inside & their only "dirt" is a sandbox. You lock a dog inside you think it's gonna use a sandbox? Think again. In fact most dogs regard shit-filled sandboxes as buffet lunches. A dog being "housetrained" means it will shit all over your yard if you open the door, all over inside if you don't & if you walk it you have to collect their turds because dogs have no desire to bury them. In fact, dogs have a very disturbing relationship with their own & other animals shit. Cats by contrast are scrupulously clean, bury their shit/piss & can very easily be trained to use a human toilet. My new cat not only uses the toilet, she flushes. Haven't heard of any dogs mastering the sandbox, let alone a human toilet...

Why do police departments, airport security, search and rescue teams, sheep herders, and the military use dogs? Dogs are clearly superior for utilitarian purposes, and because of their pack mentality, their companionship is superior too. Because of a dog's extra sensitive sense of smell and hearing, and their ability to be trained, in addition to other uses, as every dog owner knows, they provide an a useful early warning system. I've trained my dog to obey 20 different commands. How many can you train your cat to do? There are two explanation regarding cats - one, they consider themselves to be so above you that they refuse to obey your commands, or two, they're just plain dumber than dogs. Occam's razor tells us the simple answer is the correct one: cats are just plain dumb.

Angela's right on the money. apples and oranges and all the rest. we have both, and love them dearly. but...

i will share my own bit of dog heroism: shortly after the birth of our first human child, we had a 4:00am visitor in the form of a neighborhood racoon. it had come into the house through the basement cat door, up the stairs, into the kitchen through another cat door, and found in the opposite room the cat's food on top of the washer. we awoke to an absolutely vicious sounding fracas of growling and snarling from our 90 lb. lab/shep defender in the kitchen. as i ran half-awake, panicked, into the kitchen, i saw the racoon retreat back down the cat door into the basement, vanquished by our aformentioned defender, who then immediately raced into the nursury and sat directly beneath our sleeping baby's bassinet. guarding our two week old child.

case closed.

Dan - the box of shit thing is a joke (it's true, but it's a joke). testy.

Seriously - the one downside to dogs is that you have to walk them, which is sometimes annoying. As for picking up the occassional poop - tragedy.

Also, my dog is, if anything, TOO obsessed with not going in the house. If we leave for the weekend (3 days) and leave him with food, he will somehow manage to hold it for the entire 3 days. That can't be healthy for him, but he just won't go in the house. When we get home, he gets really excited, sniffs and barks for about 3 minutes, and then he's outside like lightening.

He also can predict a falling candy bar before it happens. I'm serious. We were once on the 2nd floor, and he suddenly bolted upright and went sprinting down the stairs, into the kitchen, just in time to leap and catch the minisnickers my sister had dropped moments earlier. He KNOWS.

oh yeah, and has anyone else noticed, chocolate apparently doesn't kill dogs.

my dog fang was raised by my cat bootsie. he was convinced he was a cat.

and my dog Lady would use a cat box if left in the house for too long. She also liked stealing the kittens and nursing them.

My cat sits on command, catches food, and will balance a kibble on his nose until you say OK.

Well, the latter only works when he's full.

Somewhere I remember a story where a man was saved from a fire by a cat who clawed his face until he awoke. I'm guessing the cat enjoyed it.

Of course there is the french woman who got her face chewed off by a dog after an intentional overdose. I'm sure all the problems she had before trying to commit suicide were quickly forgotten. Poor dog.

Much as I appreciate dogs...
Cats are Democrats/Dog are Republicans
http://www.kirktoons.com/october_2004/images/Catsanddogs.jpg

And really Kevin..."HEROIC DOGS, PART ONE MILLION AND ONE"...don't you do the same thing but with cats?
...maybe, for political correctness, you should have Monday Dog Blogging, you cat-bigot you.

The best thing about dogs is that they eat cats.

Delia's comment was much to the point. Of course, a lab _would_ go up Mount Hood in winter if you told it "goood boy!" I would like to think my airedale would have better sense. Note, by the way, that Velvet-the-heroic-Lab sacked out atop the humans? The dog may have kept 'em warm, but I'll be they kept the dog warmer. So, maybe not such a gullible pup after all. I may have to rethink my view of Labs....

If you are gonna be out there in the wildnerness having a good sized dog with you is, well, a doggone good idea....

Unless you run into a bear. the dog will piss a bear off and then run back to you for protection. That's one reason they arent allowed in national parks.

"consider the possibility that pets are, in evolutionary terms, manipulating human responses, that they are the equivalent of social parasites." ,

In evolutionary terms, we are all parasites, programmed to pursue behavior helpful in the spread of our genes. Kin and reciprocal 'altruism' are not really altruism in the self-satisfying sense we so loftily promote. Of course, that sense of self-satisfaction is also, no doubt, a positive adaption to encourage the 'altruism'. We are all deluded servants of the master, DNA.

Kevin,

The police have arrested an orange tabby cat for murdering and then eating its owner's house guest. After the murder, the tabby, to throw the cops off the trail, on a murder induced rage proceeded to ransack the owner's house.

Let this be a warning to you.

Man Returns From Visit, Trips on Corpse

SAN FRANCISCO (AP) -- A Haight-Ashbury man returning home from an extended vacation tripped and fell on a corpse in his bedroom after finding his apartment had been ransacked, police said.

...

The resident's orange-and-white tabby cat seen prowling the investigation scene was taken away by animal control officials....

"If man could be crossed with a cat it would improve man, but it would deteriorate the cat."

-Mark Twain

OK, that's it. I've tolerated it for years but no more. Now first, a qualifier...I like cats. Cats are A-OK, but that's it. They are OK only. Particularly OK for girls. Superduper OK by the hundreds for lonely, single, aging women. But I gotta say...if you are a guy, it's dogs people. Only dogs. You are not a true guy if you prefer girly cats to manly dogs (Girls with dogs are way hotter than girls with friggin cats). Now not just ANY dog will do. No froo-froo sissyboy dogs that are almost cats: yorkies, lapsaopsas (or however you spell it) are NOT guy dogs. They are good dogs for little old ladies and gay guys. Period. Otherwise you aren't serious and cannot be taken seriously.

DOGS rule. Cats are merely OK but DOGS rule.

My dogs crap bigger than all ya'lls friggin furniture-spraying cats. Cats are mainly for lazyassed people who can't even deal with the commitment required to keep fish.

Since the thread still appears live, here's a local news story (from Eugene) on the dubious notion of lugging your dog up the mountain.
http://www.registerguard.com/news/2007/02/21/a1.dogfolo.0221.p1.php?section=cityregion

We still don't know how Velvet negotiated the sections with ropes and ice picks.

Now not just ANY dog will do. No froo-froo sissyboy dogs that are almost cats: yorkies, lapsaopsas (or however you spell it) are NOT guy dogs.

I have a Golden Retriever now(85 lbs). I used to have a pom-dox mix at about 8 lbs. That little dog would attack buffalo(if not stopped), run into the surf chasing a ball, stand on the very edge of high cliffs looking down, fetch a ball until your arm cramped up. A buddy with a white German Shepard came to love that little black dog to the point that 10 years after Poco's death, he would bring her up. I came home for Christmas one year, didnt bring the dog, and my ma, who doesnt like animals, damn near threw me out. Size doesnt always matter in dogs.