Why does the general hate America?

What does the general hate stupid, incompetent, arrogant Presidents?

Always click the link . . . this time, maybe not.

Wikipedia says, McPeak was Chief of Staff of the United States Air Force when Clinton was President and supported John Kerry for President.

Link

Looks like another disgruntled Clintonista coming out of the woodwork.

Al

Bush is not just stupid.
He is malicious and stupid.

That's the worst possible confluence.

What can be worse than having a vindictive dummy in power?

Nothing.
Absolutely nothing.

The panel was unbalanced. No morons to represent the Administration point of view.

You know, no less than Al Gore rejects the stupid argument. Gore is right. (It's his cowardice that Gore really objects to; he's right there as well.) He's willfully ignorant - which is quite different from stupid. His willful ignorance - really, has there ever been a president who grew so little in offie? - springs directly from his overwhelming narcissism; it's a reflection of it. That's the point he's trying to make with it. "I don't have to know, I'm the decider."

It helps him that there are millions who will say 'I don't want to know, you decide'.

The Rolling Stone magazine is stuck in the "If It Feels Good, Do It" 60s, smoking dope and hanging out in Hollywood with Hanoi Jane. *snicker*

Rock. On. Tony.

I just stopped resenting the twelve hundred bucks I had to drop for Mess Dress and an evening gown a few years back.

Welp, that article was a cheery little scoop of heaven.

really, has there ever been a president who grew so little in offie? - springs directly from his overwhelming narcissism; it's a reflection of it.

I think it stems from his never having to do any real work in his life -- he was born with a silver spoon in his mouth and whenever he fucked up one of his "jobs," his dad's friends were always there to bail him out. He's a boy, not a man.

He's willfully ignorant - which is quite different from stupid.

Ignorance has no productive utility. Ignorance self-evidently has no productive utility. Therefore, willful ignorance is prima facie evidence of stupidity.

(Now, a fraudulent, cultivated illusion of ignorance might have utility, and might merely be dishonest and malign rather than stupid, but that's not the explanation offered.)

Wikipedia says, McPeak was Chief of Staff of the United States Air Force when Clinton was President and supported John Kerry for President.

Looks like another disgruntled Clintonista coming out of the woodwork.

Boy, that was a relief. Now, because a highly qualified Air Force officer can be dismissed as a "Clintonista", the whole panel and its conclusions are also dismissed. In fact, you don't even need to read the discussion. Life can be so easy.

I want to get the logic down, though, so I can parse everything: any military officer who served in a high-ranking position during the Clinton administration is clearly unreliable, biased and probably a filthy hippie. Is that about right?

Please stop feeding the trolls.

Please stop feeding the trolls.

Ack, sorry. Knee-jerk response.

Yo, wingnuts - Clintonista? You're barking fucking mad.

McPeak gained the rank that allowed him to take the Chief of Staff position under Republican presidents.

We can talk about the politics of the Air Force in the 80's if you want. I mean, I'm up for it.

You collect a bunch of people who think Bush and the war in Iraq suck, and wow, they spend an entire article declaring that it all sucks. Surprise.

And just because someone is a general doesn't mean his opinion is automatically sterling. If I looked hard enough, I could probably find a retired general who thinks we ought to invade Iran with nukes.

Tony McPeak, who has had an illustrious career, was nevertheless a Dean (then Kerry) supporter, and delivered radio addresses for the Democrats in 2004. Hardly a disinterested opinion.

Might have been interesting to get a few other generals in there for an opinion, like maybe Petraeus.

Please stop feeding the trolls.

Fine Old Hat, but do you have anything to say or do you simply take satisfaction in telling other people what to say?

I read somewhere that McPeak actually publicly endorsed Bush in 2000 and only turned against him after seeing his foreign policy, especially Iraq.

So I guess he was one of the engineers of the experiment.

There was a great feature piece in New York last month - it had a picture of Bush on the couch. There seems to be consistently broad agreement among clinicians that he is indeed a narcissistic personality disorder.

One of the debates my gang has had is about his high 600s scores on his GMATs. Some swear that he had someone take them for him, and it's true in the 70s some could get away with that (many got caught, it was fun watching the security measures go up). I think not for two reasons - it was too risky, Bush was too high profile back then; and I think his scores are an honest gage. Believe me, you don't get those scores by having an IQ of 100! He's really smart about baseball. I think this "dumb" thing is a cop-out, quite frankly, and feeds into his success.

But who knows? With this family, America's own version of the Marcos family, no matter how cynical I get, I just can't seem to keep up. And George W. is precisely the kind of progeny you would expect from George HW and Barbara.

I just rented "Shut Up and Sing" last night. Very powerful movie. The Dixie Chicks were way, way ahead of the rest of the nation on evaluating the Bush presidency.

Boy, that was a relief. Now, because a highly qualified Air Force officer can be dismissed as a "Clintonista", the whole panel and its conclusions are also dismissed. In fact, you don't even need to read the discussion. Life can be so easy.

You would instantly dismiss the opinion of the military leader currently conducting the war in Iraq as being just the opinion of a Bush flunky. What's your point?

Petraeus can not take part in such a panel and if you knew thing one about protocol you would know that.

Eaton, Zinni, Clark. The list is impressive, and again - these men advanced to flag rank under Republican administrations.

Petraeus can not take part in such a panel and if you knew thing one about protocol you would know that.

I'm well aware of that. I was making a point.

Out of all the retired generals in the military, it would not be difficult to raise a few who hate the war in Iraq. Why is their opinion worth more than those retired generals who support it?

A false premise is no platform from which to make a point.

Now - you feel free to go find those pro-war generals that you reference. Read what is written by and about them, and the anti war generals, and compare and contrast the two and form an opinion.

But do not challenge us to verify your assertions. It is incumbent on you to do so.

I go with the Bush is a coward theory.

Blue Girl, Red State has a good point. I'm sure we'd all like to hear from all those pro-war retired generals. If they are as common as elmendorf implies, why are they so silent? We here a lot of support from right wing think tankers with no military experience. Where are the generals?

Abe Lincoln showed that a poor man could be president.
FDR showed that a very rich man could be president.
Eisenhower showed that we didn't need a president.
Nixon showed we were better off without a president.
W shows we were better off with Nixon.

Tommy Franks, for one. I can look up others.

Now you can go into why his opinion is worthless, while the opinions of those who agree with you are not.

Iran, needless to say, has now become our savior. Can they save our ass or will the Israel/Iran standoff prevent this?

We are screwed.

If Tommy Franks has an answer to the question the panelists were discussing I’d like to hear it.

How bad will things get in Iraq -- and what price will the world ultimately pay for the president's decision to prolong the war?

Thats one, and he is pretty easy to eviscerate. do yourself a favor and find someone besides Franks or Boykin. At least make it challenging for us.

Meanwhile: Zinni conducted Desert Crossing. And thats the trump card.

He's willfully ignorant - which is quite different from stupid.

Personally, I think that it serves no purpose to try to split hairs over whether Bush is stupid or not. For all intents and purposes, Bush is stupid, since, in terms of running the government, he acts in the same way that a stupid person would act. You could think of Bush as an example of passing the Turing Test of stupidity. He says stupid things, he takes stupid actions, and has very little knowledge of what's going on. That he happens to have a keen grasp of baseball statistics is out of scope of the experiment.

Dear Kevin,

I'm confused by the message your post is sending. Should we shun reality in favor of happy talk? Is that why I should take some Prozac?

I've been warned before clicking, but what should I be afraid of? If the reality is that bad, shouldn't we know about it?

I guess I'm missing something here. No surprise; I miss a lot of things every day.

In case you missed Eaton on Bill Maher, here is a link.

And here is the money quote from the interview:

"We've got this thing that, you know so many military believe that Republican administrations are good for the military, that is rarely the case and we have got to get a message through to every soldier, every family member, every friend of soldier, that the Republican party, the Republican dominated congress has absolutely been the worst thing that has ever happened to the United States Army and the United States Marine Corps..."

"Mistakes were made." --Alberto Gonzales

"I think I might have made a small error in my withdrawal transaction and got a tad excited."

--Botched Bank Robbery suspect after murdering several bystanders.

"Impeach!" --Huge majority of Americans.

"Blindingly stupid people leading the blind"
--Republican "conservatives."

One must choose sides: one is either progressive, stupid, or evil in this day and age, and the last two conditions define this administration.

Might have been interesting to get a few other generals in there for an opinion,

In the same way I think it serves no purpose to have a creationist on a panel discussing evolutionary science, it would serve no purpose to convene a panel on Iraq with someone who supports the President's policies and thinks that things are going well there.

Please stop feeding the trolls.

Why in the world would you read these boards if not to "feed" the trolls, i.e., to laugh at the absurd lengths that wingnuts have to go to these days in order to defend the most incompetent president ever?

Why in the world would you read these boards if not to "feed" the trolls, i.e., to laugh at the absurd lengths that wingnuts have to go to these days in order to defend the most incompetent president ever?

The problem is that the trolls don't take the bait themselves. Only in the days of tbrosz, Joe Schmoe, and rdw could they be baited into acting like complete asses. AH and Al say something stupid and then disappear.

egbert, though, can be goaded on occasion.

You think Bush is dumb,Look at the trolls on this board,They think just like Bush,That's why they defend him so hard they think alike,Well I guess that covers the whole conservative party.OT.Does Haliburton change there name now to, oh, I don't know, Al-Burton.

Part of the thing I can't get over is the (still) free ride the MSN still gives this chump for his conduct on September 11, 2001. Unbelievable cowardice. Can any of us imagine any other president hiding like that? EVERY one of them - Kennedy, Reagan, Truman, Clinton, Ike, Carter, Nixon, Ford et al would have flown back to Washington immediately. They were all alpha males. And Bush certainly showed his cowardice during the Vietnam era. Gore notes that he's a coward and a bully; that all bullies are at heart cowards. And this has been one of Bush's defining characteristics.

AH and Al are the right wing learning how to use the internet and blogs. They've mastered tv news and talk radio but this blog thing smacked them hard. AH and Al and Darrell from Balloon Juice are using us to build up blog noisemaking skills. They're learning how to be disruptive and dismissive in this new medium and we're helping it along.

Why in the world would you read these boards if not to "feed" the trolls, i.e., to laugh at the absurd lengths that wingnuts have to go to these days in order to defend the most incompetent president ever?

Good point.

I just think it's pointless when the trolls post stuff like "Clinton was a big stupidhead!" or "Bush is a great president and the Iraq war is going great, stupid liberals!" and then the comments go off on a tangent. Sort of rather read what you all have to say and exchange links rather than read the troll vs. non-troll back and forth.

:Shrugs:

An honorable mention to the troll hall-of-fame has to be the Frosty troll on the DNC boards.

And the various "anonymous" posters at Military City. (That blog had to start utilizing community moderators too.)

Old Hat - I'm with you.

In some instances the trolls have to be refuted. An assertion unchallenged is an assertion accepted, and some things have to be put down for the lurkers.

I am more and more convinced Bush is a classic case of arrested development. You see him rolling his eyes when anyone else but him has the spotlight. You see him visibly impatient when a world leader is taking a question and he's not in the spotlight. He looks ready to throw "hissy fits" like a 3-yr-old who's told he can't have another ice cream cone when any Democrat (like Speaker Pelosi) dares to disagree with him. And remember how calculatedly rude he was to Webb? Just a spoiled, privileged brat who never had to look for a job or perform in one.

Good points, Violet. But that's also the narcissism.

I'm also fond of the Soviet plant theory - genetically program a child born in 1946, genetically programmed to rise to power and destroy our country.

The problem is that the trolls don't take the bait themselves.

There are two possible theories on this. One theory is that they're too stupid to realize that they're stupid. And so when someone responds, and the conversation strays outside of the outline provided by Limbaugh, etc., they're stymied, so they go run and hide and scratch their heads in confusion.

The other theory is that they're smart enough to know how stupid they are being, but not strong-willed enough to change their minds in the face of overwhelming evidence of Bush's monumental incompetence. So their attacks are just their way of acting out their self-loathing.

Either way, they're good for a laugh.

Babs does kind of remind me of the Angela Lansbury character in the original Manchurian Candidate

Bob - well put.

On that great James McMurtry Live in Ought-Three, between song patter, "You know what Nixon said about Barbara, don't you? When asked about George Herbert Walker Bush, Nixon said, 'Yeah, he's OK, he can do his job and all; he's just not very interesting. Now Barbara: She's interesting. She knows how to hate.' "

I am looking at a concert poster that Larry McMurtry signed for me when he played the Grand Emporium in KC on Nov. 7, 2002.

He's one hell of a beer salesman.

Oh, I'm jealous! Lucky girl. He never plays around here. i'm still waiting to see him.

So you know the quote - and what precedes it. And to riff off that, he wasn't raised to say nu ku lar - it's affect. "You know Jeb doesn't say nu ku lar. You good and danm well Barbara doesn't say nu ku lar."

"Wikipedia says, McPeak was Chief of Staff of the United States Air Force when Clinton was President and supported John Kerry for President.

Link

Looks like another disgruntled Clintonista coming out of the woodwork.

Al"

Proving once that the essence of being a wingnut is to ignore facts. From the very same link:

"During the presidential election of 2000 General McPeak, along with several other high-ranking military retirees, broke with a long-standing tradition of public political neutrality to endorse George W. Bush. As the military and foreign policy of the Bush administration coalesced, however, McPeak expressed strong objections, especially with regard to the 2003 invasion of Iraq. McPeak later openly campaigned for Howard Dean's nomination, and when Dean withdrew, acted as an adviser for the John Kerry campaign. He was also one of twenty-seven signatories to the statement of the "Committee of Diplomats & Commanders for Change" calling the Bush Administration a failure at "preserving national security" and calling for Bush not to be re-elected.""

Disgruntled, yes. Clintonista, no.

I kinda took a break for a couple of years when my husband retired from the USAF and went to work at the Handy-winning GE. Then the bar was sold, turned into a nightclub, and we all went our separate ways and Roger spends more time on his Blues Cruise and with his family.

I was in charge of the feeding and watering and lodging for the artists. Marcia Ball stayed at the Fairmont on the Plaza. The Red Elvises stayed at the Best Western.

My daughter's first roommate out of our house and out of the dorm was Jimmy Thackery's nephew.

You should see my CD collection.

RGST - You should see mine, too. And I've been in with among the finest tapers since the early 80s. I'm fairly obsessed there as well. I'm also one of those kings of obsolete formats (vinyl is not obsolete so doesn't count); master concert tape cassettes and DAT's, and made the SACD plunge last year (sigh, it really is much better than CD).

Sounds cool. Great stuff.

compared to Mark Steyn, they have a rather optimistic take on Europe. I think they are too pessimistic about the Middle East, too pessimistic about the US, and too optimistic about the EU.

They also do not seem to address how much of the Islamist surge is independent of U.S. action: Sudan, Nigeria, Thailand, Malaysia, Indonesia, Western China, Chechnya, India, Pakistan, have seen Islamist patriots/terrorists/jihadists/militants/insurgentsattempt (and sometimes succeed) in expanding Islamist influence and Sharia Law.

It was a good read, and the quote is excellent. A very good line.

Cool. I appreciate the club bands. You ever heard of Bill Perry? If you like McMurtry you will like him.

I am so glad you drew attention to this article. The RollingStone Magazine came to my home and I was pleased to review remarks of such a prestigious panel, and am pleased as well to hear Mr. Gonzales stutter and stammer as attorney general in big time trouble on my tv.

Bush never gets 'elected' without Cheney around to supposedly provide gravitas. All he provided was criminal,imperial ambition and limitless greed for the MIC. The rest of the administration was composed of loyal, but incompetent yespersons. Cheney has been the architect of America's dismay.

Awesome quote. Quote of the year, if you ask me. So, so true.

I would like to publicly thank Consider Wisely for sending me the link to this article a couple of days ago.

I am looking at a concert poster that Larry McMurtry signed for me when he played the Grand Emporium in KC on Nov. 7, 2002.

It was James, wasn't it? Or does his dad sing too?

Oops. I just had to suffer through Buffalo Gals over the weekend. I read James and typed Larry. Now I have to listen to Journey as penance.

And I get an html ticket.

Damn.

Thanks BGRS--I am honored to call you friend.

That sentiment is returned in kind.

Funny thing is, I was catching up on my reading and had just opened that link and was getting ready to read it when I drove by and saw Kevin's post.

These are great days for citizen journalists

elmendorf: You collect a bunch of people who think Bush and the war in Iraq suck, and wow, they spend an entire article declaring that it all sucks. Surprise.

Oh, sure: anti-Bush bias and all that, and some of their predictions contradict other predictions. It's still worth reading. And remembering.

And Gen. Petraeus has had his say. Now he is working to bring aabout what he said he could bring about. If he's right, we'll know; if he's wrong, we'll know that as well.

Thanks for the recommendation, BGRS. 3,500 vinyl, tapes, DATs, CDs etc. A lot of Dead, a lot. The first show I taped was the Talking Heads, a lot of great reggae of the early 80s. The family (I have young boys) groove out a lot on the twin Mark Knopfler/Emmylou Harris CDs; 50s jazz, new Lucinda, Bromberg.

Yes, one of the best quotes of the year.

Damned tree-hugging ultra-peacenik..um... decorated vietnam veteran... um... General...

elmendorf----- Of course it all sucks. Think of the opportunity costs of this war, of these policies. Surely you took economics classes?

Now he is working to bring aabout what he said he could bring about.

Dave is screwed. This is Bush's wet-dream, and if you read Petraeus' thesis, this clusterfuck is nowhere close to what his research pointed toward.

Damn! Another html offense. I am quite the recidivist.

Ignorance has no productive utility.

Of course it does. There are whole circuits in the brain devoted to culling out and reworking painful memories.

We're humans, not computers.

Blue Girl, Red State (aka Global Citizen) on March 13, 2007 at 8:41 PM

People are never perfectly consistent. Gen Petraeus pretty much told the Senate that he would make the surge work. Success doesn't depend on how many American soldiers there are, but on how effective the 300,000 Iraqi soldiers become, and on how much cooperation they get from the locals in all the areas where they work.

When I clicked the link- I immediately noticed a Tequila advertisement, and thought, how clever. After reading the article- I thought the tequila ad was genius, pure genius.

Seriously though, about the article- isn't this really just common knowledge at this point- not necessarily about Bush being stupid, but about possible outcomes in Iraq? It will take a miracle to pull out anything that will resemble success in Iraq. This administration is not getting out of Iraq before January 2009- as long as they have US troops they can say there is hope/improvement/to say otherwise is treasonous- the fact remains that we have broken the country and it cannot be fixed.

Good night of politics on Countdown with Keith Olbermann> This white house is literally working to cut off all branches of government, as it represents republican government--which acted in the past with no oversight at all. Now the democrats offer oversight,and as John Dean says--the administration is really pushing and politicizing to blame the Justice Department. Dean assesses Gonzales as "over his head" in Washington--which is not a good place for "on the job training." And Gonzales is a yes man, sent there to protect the white house. Much more will come out on this, and the attorney general may be in jeopardy. Regarding accountability of this white house--the subpoena power of the congress.
And the issue of Peter Pace refusing to apologize for his anti-gay views...and Duncan Hunter, running for president, popping in with the issue of the catholic church-- his morality lesson--bad guess, troops who served said they were comfortable serving with those who are gay.
Is this administration drowning in scandals, or what???

Blue Girl:

There's an HTML preview function here that has saved my ass many times. Let those of us who have not screwed up our code cast the first stone.

Not to blow sunshine up Kevin's a**, but he did predict this- scandals that is. Does anyone have the link to the George Will article?

Which George Will article?

Yes, Kevin did call this back in '04. Very prescient. He's earned a pat on the back. And criminy - just looking through the new Newsweek - look how far this has come. Not to "cross thread" but I think the Gonzales 8 scandal may have more legs than we think. Congrats again to Josh. Maybe impeachment isn't so far-fetched, if only to stop the damage. Given the ever-perfect storms, week after week . . . what will next week bring?

Abe Lincoln showed that a poor man could be president.
FDR showed that a very rich man could be president.
Eisenhower showed that we didn't need a president.
Nixon showed we were better off without a president.
W shows we were better off with Nixon.

Posted by: ggersten on March 13, 2007 at 7:00 PM | PERMALINK

ROTFLMAO! Just perfect.

General McPeak a "Clintonista," as the wingnuts here claim? He was appointed Chief of Staff in September 1990, shortly before Desert Shield became Desert Storm, when Bush the elder was president, and no one other than Dick Cheney was SecDef (and McPeak of course had several key promotions and appointments before that under the Reagan administration). The 1990 appointment was a surprise because his predecessor, Gen Dugan, was fired with most of his term yet to go, for too bluntly speaking the truth on what the air war would look like.

Of course the fact that McPeak had an instrumental role in waging war against Saddam does not ensure the opinions he expressed in the Rolling Stone article are correct, any more than the assertion (had it been accurate) that he is linked to the Clinton administration somehow would show said opinions are wrong; but if "Al" and his cohort are trying to "argue" a point by smearing an opponent, rather than addressing the substance of his argument, at least get your facts right!

Oh, paleez. Not taking anything away from Kevin, but that's not a prediction -- that's a certainty.

MaxGowan- next week brings the prostitutes out. Not kidding, article in LATimes (I think) Woman ran a call girl ring in DC- shocking that there is prostitution in the nation's capital - selling her "little black book" to some news organization. Supposedly 10,000 names and numbers.

The Myans are saying that George w Bush's visit to the ruins in Guatamala requires cleansing, and the restoring of peace and tranquility. They will burn incense, where he walked, to change the energy: a spiritual cleansing is in order. 2009 days since 2001--can you believe it....
Bush is so not bonded with the locals, so not excelling with language.......how about Newt Gingrich, the most hypocritical of all republicans, back in the news. I must say Keith Olbermann was a great show tonight

I have no need of Prozac, no do I have any need of reading prognostications from a collection of whiners, losers, depressives and woe-is-me Eyores.

I have alot to be grateful for, Kevin. I just got back from my tax man and learned I earned $8,000 more than last year. News reports show unemployment is down to 4.5%. The sky outside is blue and birds are singing. I love my family. My refrigerator is full. Halfway around the world, American troops are fighting for America, for which I am profoundly grateful.

But why enjoy life when you can be msierable, right Kevin Drum?

Well, prostitutes are about the only thing lacking at this sorry point. Of course, as the late Ralph Gleason once noted, nobody got laid in the Watergate scandal. So we'll see.

Back to the subject of trolls - mostly younger white guys, right? A few older one - tbroz seemed older. But mostly a young white male phenom. And chickenhawks, almost all of 'em.

Frequency Kenneth--sounds pretty selfish. Your world view, I mean.

Ain't nothin' but a happy, prozac-free, clear-eyed Tigger here, folks. A middle aged, proud dad, great wife, work I love . . .

From Kevin's article: General Tony McPeak (retired)--BEST CASE SCENARIO: You have to hope that Iraq devolves into a federal state with three strong regional governments. But that has its downsides: The Turks would go bezerk. They would see Kurdistan as a base for the Kurdish insurgency inside Turkey, which has bedeviled them like the IRA in Ireland or the Basques in Spain. And if Iraq devolves into 3 separate "stans," then it's going to be pretty tough for Sunnistan not to provide a retirement home for Al Quaeda agents. It's got warts all over it--but among the "don't call my baby ugly" possibilities in this world, that looks the prettiest

MOST LIKELY SCENARIO: Stability and lowering the bloodshed is the range of outcomes and expectations we ought to be talking about now, not looking for Switzerland on the Tigris or anything remotely resembling a liberal democracy. A Shia Saddam--without nearly as much brutality, but still a strong man--is actually one of the best hopes.
Iran's influence will have been increased geometrically. We're already the losers in this, and now we become the big time losers.

THE WORST CASE? Iraq's Sunnis begin to be backed into a corner, then the Sunni governments--Jordan, Saudi Arabia--jump in. Israel sees that it's threatened by these developments, then everybody piles on. And you've got nuclear events going off in the Middle East. That would be as bad as it gets.
This is a dark chapter in our history. Whatever happens. our country's international stanidng has been frittered away by people who don't have the foggiest understanding of how the hell the world works. American has been conducting an experiment for the past six years, trying to validate the proposition that it really doesn't make any difference who you elect president. NOW WE KNOW THE RESULT OF THAT EXPERIMENT (laughs). IF A GUY IS STUPID, IT MAKES A BIG DIFFERENCE."

mhr--your post is the epitome of the irrelevant.
Stop being an apologist for the administration and be truthful about the facts. Thank you

Saudi Arabia has already jumped in.

Israel was already threatened by Iraq - that's why we're there, fighting their war for them in the first place.

Nuclear events? What about the thousands of tons of Depleted Uranium we've salted Iraq with? Never mind the destruction of Brewster Jennings, the softshoe on AQ Khan's proliferation network, etc.

Back in 2000 - righties were telling me that it didn't matter if Bush was a retard, he surrounded himself with such brilliant experts. I think that's been proven wrong pretty decisively.

American Squawk is funny. Where is your criticism of Peter Pace? He was giving personal opinions while in uniform. If you knew anything, you'd know that is a big no-no.

Ah, Kevin.

You guys disgust me. If I didn't feel duty bound to post here to educate all your saps, I would never come to this anti-American cite.

Fucked-up Kenneth: I have no need of Prozac, no do I have any need of reading prognostications from a collection of whiners, losers, depressives and woe-is-me Eyores.

I have alot to be grateful for, Kevin. I just got back from my tax man and learned I earned $8,000 more than last year. News reports show unemployment is down to 4.5%. The sky outside is blue and birds are singing. I love my family. My refrigerator is full. Halfway around the world, American troops are fighting for America, for which I am profoundly grateful.

And here I thought Pollyana was a fictional character. Your experience may, and most assuredly does, differ from millions of people around the world. Let's not project, huh?

Given the ever-perfect storms, week after week . . . what will next week bring?

AP story posted 46 minutes ago on MSNBC about the "D.C." madam's phone records:

WASHINGTON - The former owner of an escort business said she has reached a deal to share her records of up to 15,000 client phone numbers with a media organization....

Extradite Rumsfield--you must be insane thinking there are brillant experts in this cabal

egbert--are you back? It makes me feel kind of queasy that people ignore the truth of the current situation. Maybe you should read more.
Study. Don't just study the republican talking points. Really.

The scariest comments were those of Nir Rosen, a reporter of enormous testicular fortitude who has gone to places in Iraq no other Western reporters dare go. Rosen says this:

You'll soon see Sunni militias destabilizing countries like Jordan and Syria -- where the Sunni Muslim Brotherhood is very strong. It took about ten years for the Palestinians to become politicized and militarized when they were first expelled from Palestine. You're likely to see something like that occurring in the huge Iraqi refugee populations in Syria and Jordan. King Abdullah of Jordan is resented for being an American stooge and an accomplice with Israel. I'm convinced that the monarchy in Jordan will fall as a result of this, and Israel will be confronted with a frontline state on its longest border with an Arab country.

Rosen, alone of the analysts on the panel--astutely predicts the impact of the vast---Sunni, in the main--Iraqi refugee population. Anyone who wonders where the next generation of al-Qaeda terrorists will come from need only to look to Jordan and Syria.

I see Out on Bond beat me to the punch, MaxGowan.

TPMMucker posted on Mar. 1: "The madam, Jean Palfrey, soon caught attention by telling a reporter from the Smoking Gun that they must be going after her as part of a larger investigation into 'some Duke Cunningham-type bigwig client that got caught up in something[.]' "

"If I didn't feel duty bound to post here to educate all your saps, I would never come to this anti-American cite."

The word is 'site', moron.

Extradite Rumsfield--you always have good posts. I admire your writings.

"The word is 'site', moron."

Look out for the grammer police! Attention! Attetion!

Obviously you can't stand on the issues so you have to revert to ad homs.

No, we don't have to resort to ad hominem attacks, but it sure is fun to rag on how stupid you Bushistas are.

egbert: Obviously you can't stand on the issues so you have to revert to ad homs.

So that's what you are up to, eh? Can't stand on the issues so you write ad hominem attacks like this...

egbert: You guys disgust me. If I didn't feel duty bound to post here to educate all your saps, I would never come to this anti-American [site].

Project much, egbert? Poor thing. Or as is said down here in the South... "Bless your heart" ...which is sometimes a sincere remark but often times...not.

which is sometimes a sincere remark but often times...not.

You will appreciate this, Apollo - an Airman from Georgia, used to look at people he was feeling consternation toward and say "You're all right." only it was usually "You're all right, Sarge." Meant it the same way.

I think the answer for Iraq is to let Bush be the president of Iraq after his second term is over here. He will fuck things up so royally over there that all of the terrorists leave within eight years....

I've actually heard that one, Globe. Took me some time to break the South's code, its predilection for mixed messages. I'll have to admit, the South is a great training ground to hone one's bullshit meter.

If any of the righties want to say that the majority of the RS panel come from the pessimistic side of the prognosis for the last 4 years, I have to say I would agree with them.

On the other hand the pessimists have been consistently closer to the truth, and the optimists have been consistently wrong.

And trust egbert to confuse honest appraisal and trying to postulate realistic outcomes with being anti-USA. No wonder the repugnuts have problems with honesty and reality; it conflicts with their world-domination outlook.

Oh, and Bush? SOCIOPATH is what he is.

There was money for bailouts when trouble arose,
And enough silver spoons for his mouth and his nose.
So Arbusto went bust! "What me worry?" he joked.
"I make money on failure, 'cos I know the right folks."

from The Touching Ballad of Bush and the Billionaires by Theodora Van Plentibucks

Damn nonsense. Well, half-nonsense really. Of course the situation is terrible, but the discussion doesn't include any points of view generated by the people in Iraq or its neighbouring countries. All this is basically from a US point of view.

enine-pv think that it's time to over the war! too much people are died

we trapped too longer in there, bushes win the oil when we goal nothing

Iraq and Bush reflect the American character in decline: dumbass, brutal, and beligerent.

The Republicans under Bush/Rove have been the most incredible parade of incompetence & corruption & brute force this country has ever seen.

After I saw that the Republicans are leading in the presidental poll I started seriously considering leaving. It's really American values that make me want to throw up and pull my family out of this hole.

"Project much, egbert? Poor thing. Or as is said down here in the South... "Bless your heart" ...which is sometimes a sincere remark but often times...not."

Amen.

If Al Qaeda sympathizers like McPeak are so optimistic about the terrorists' chances, think how over-confident Osama himself must be. It's only a matter of time before Al Qaeda makes a fatal blunder and we can destroy them and bring democracy to the Middle East.

well, who's the next korea?

What we need to do is STOP MEDDLING NOW and allow the regional players to engage in talks and ACCEPT the agreements that they make in order to prevent a regional war. Syria and Israel were talking recently and we butted in and messed that up. Iran and Saudi Arabia have been talking recently.. and I'm sure we are stirring that pot as well. If we would just knock it off and let the ME peoples make their own agreements everyone would be better off. Hello.. they are they ones who LIVE next to each other.. I think they know the facts on the ground a lot better than we do. And even if we've got the facts straight.. we are probably spinning the whole process to some idiotic goal that will be in the end counterproductive to our interests.

"The word is 'site', moron." eggbutt at 10:31 PM

What we need to do is …allow the regional players to engage in talks and ACCEPT the agreements … Doc at the Radar Station at 1:04 AM

"Now we know it makes a difference."

Amen!

Clicked the link, & what do I find? There is no GOOD case scenario. I agree that partitioning Iraq into 3 autonomous regions (or nations) is the best case scenario. But is still a damn lousy scenario.

McPeak! I remember that guy. He was in the chain of command i had to remember in USAF basic training. Left soon after I got in.

If I remember correctly, he orchestrated air operations in the last successful war the US fought in the middle east.

You're right, total Clinton guy.

"In the lead-up to the Iraq war and its later conduct, I saw, at a minimum, true dereliction, negligence, and irresponsibility; at worst, lying, incompetence, and corruption," Retired Marine Gen. Anthony C. Zinni

"It is our patriotic duty to speak out when egregiously flawed policies and strategies needlessly cost American lives."
-William A. Whitlow - Retired major general in the Marine Corps & former director of the expeditionary warfare division in the office of the deputy chief of naval operations.

General William Odom on Iraq: "It is the greatest strategic disaster in US history."

McPeak was a loose cannon in the Air Force, among other things wanting to design an entirely new uniform and coming up with wild ideas that the people actually running things had to ignore to get things done. My brother-in-law was a Navy guy at the Pentagon when McPeak was holding forth. He is another Wes Clark. Odom was wrong about the Soviet Union until it collapsed. I have his book on the collapse of the Soviet Army. He was astonished and that's tough for the head of NSA. These are all the disgruntled Clinton generals.

Zinni is the best of the bunch. He was a "realist" who thjought there was no chance we could get an Arab state that could rule itself without a tyrant. Maybe he was right but these other guys are just disgruntled. While they hold forth on why all is lost, Iran is collapsing in front of our eyes. And the Russians, who have been building their nuclear facilities, are quitting for nonpayment of bills. Iran is broke. They stopped exporting oil a couple of years ago and now have to import food they can't pay for. Left wing foreign policy is an oxymoron.

I've actually heard that one, Globe. Took me some time to break the South's code, its predilection for mixed messages. I'll have to admit, the South is a great training ground to hone one's bullshit meter.

Or, as someone once said to me regarding Southern women's ability to camouflage their venom: "they put a lot of gravy on those biscuits"....

Bush is our version of Czar Nicholas II. One can only hope he meets a similar fate.

…Iran is broke. They stopped exporting oil a couple of years ago and now have to import food they can't pay for… Mike K at 10:25 AM

Granted their economy is not great, but since you are so concerned for the Iranian people to the extent of believing they have no oil revenues, why not support lifting sanctions?

By the way, MEMRI is an Israeli group largely staffed with Mossad and Shin Bet types. If you plan to rely on their data, expect another, bigger fiasco like your Iraq war.