July 1, 2007
THE MODERN FACE OF TERRORISM, PART II....The dramatic events in Britain over the last couple of days are a stark reminder of a terrorist threat that is likely getting worse for the West, not better.
Fortunately, no innocent people suffered any serious injuries as a result of these attacks. What's more, the attackers do not appear to have been well trained:
Several experts and officials said the technology behind the London car bombs seemed amateurish. While the attackers apparently tried to detonate the bombs using cellphones, "they didn't go off because there were not top-grade people putting them together," one Western official said.
Do you ever get the sense the West is incredibly fortunate that recent would-be terrorists lack sophistication? I'm reminded of Kevin's post after the Fort Dix arrests.
Let me get this straight: these guys dropped off jihadi videos at a local store, talked to Philly cops about getting a map of Ft. Dix, were still trying to procure weapons after 17 months of planning, and practiced for the attack by playing paintball.
This reminds me of that guy who planned to bring down the Brooklyn Bridge with a blowtorch. Or those dudes who wanted to destroy the Sears Tower but couldn't even afford to buy boots and rental cars, let alone explosives. Or Jose Padilla, who, it turns out, was a deluded schmoe who didn't really have serious plans to do much of anything.
Is al-Qaeda recruiting these doofuses just to lull us into a false sense of security?
There have, of course, been far too many devastating acts of terrorism in the West (New York, London, Madrid, Oklahoma City), but there are times it seems we've been lucky that those willing to do the most harm have not been "top-grade people."
—Steve Benen 8:15 AM
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Fortunately, no innocent people suffered any serious injuries as a result of these attacks. What's more, the attackers do not appear to have been well trained
It's probably just as you say, amateur would-bes but what's sad is I look at the following:
・ the attacks occur just as a new PM who might pull UK forces out of Iraq is taking over
・ one of the attacks is in his native Scotland
・ there is little real damage (more smoke than fire) but big media impact
and I can't dismiss out of hand the possiblity that it's actually U.S. forces at work. I would have dismissed such thoughts with a wave of the hand ten years ago... And there is a cold fury within that I can't dismiss such thoughts now.
Posted by: snicker-snack on July 1, 2007 at 8:22 AM | PERMALINK
Unfortunately there are plenty more amateurs than skilled jihadis. Even half-assed attacks like the ones we saw in the UK this weekend serve the purpose: terrorizing. That's satisfactory to both the AQ bosses in Waziristan and the their counterparts at the National Observatory. Also self-motivated uncoordinated attacks by autonomous cells are much harder for the police to roll up.
If only we could get these religious fanatics off our case. How to do that? Get rid of our own.
Posted by: wren on July 1, 2007 at 8:34 AM | PERMALINK
Is there any evidence yet that these attacks/terrorists are Al Qaeda at all? I'm a little reluctant to tag everything as part of Bin Laden's evil genius.
Posted by: ckelly on July 1, 2007 at 8:39 AM | PERMALINK
the only thing that makes them doofus's is that the cell phone trigger failed...they were no stupider than the bunch of clowns that tried to rent a crop duster, then went to flight school and told the instructors they didn't need lessons on take-offs or landings...the big difference was that Janet Reno vetoed the FBI request to look at Moussaoui's computer that August.
Posted by: minion on July 1, 2007 at 9:07 AM | PERMALINK
Good point ckelly. These attacks carry the unmistakable mark of Emmanuel Goldstein.
The West will never be safe until Goldsteinism is eliminated completely. This requires destroying our freedoms in order to save them.
Posted by: Ministry of Truth on July 1, 2007 at 9:08 AM | PERMALINK
I don't think Al Qaeda's hand is in this directly. This looks to be a grassroots thing, where local islamists are putting on a show all by their lonesomes.
We keep catching the stupid ones, but the sheer number of stupid ones makes me wonder how many not so stupid ones are out there plotting. Statistically speaking they can't all be incompetent, and I'm thinking we are seeing the part of the jihadi iceberg that pokes above the water, so to speak. But, no terrorist attacks on our soil, so who knows.
Posted by: Heightened State of Redness on July 1, 2007 at 9:11 AM | PERMALINK
Let me recommend some good summer reading for our leftist contingent:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Paranoid_Style_in_American_Politics
Posted by: minion on July 1, 2007 at 9:11 AM | PERMALINK
Or, snicker-snack, it might be Mossad. Those people are behind everything, if you're a wingnut.
Posted by: y81 on July 1, 2007 at 9:11 AM | PERMALINK
You forgot about the shoe bomber who decided to light up in his seat instead of the lavatory and the children, donkeys, and dimwitted recruits they use in Iraq to deliver bombs/rockets. Children, idiots, and jackasses are easily manipulted. Of course that doesn't appear to be the case here, as "the brains" behind the operation don't appear to exist.
I generally just assume that all religious zealots have a few screws loose.
I think part of the reason they get stuck in that particular path is they can't think their way out of that wet paper bag of a religion that folks like OBL put out there. Low intelligence also has to contribute to general frustration with society and to individuals seeking out support and recognition from other fanatics.
A better example of scary terrorists are the intelligent folks who have suffered direct harm or humiliation at the hands of a state, think they have little left to lose, and have experience in the military or insurgency. Think Chechnya or Iraq.
Posted by: B on July 1, 2007 at 9:14 AM | PERMALINK
the only thing that makes them doofus's is that the cell phone trigger failed
No, what makes them doofuses is that they built a bomb that can't explode. In the absence of a proper oxidiser, the ingredients in those cars would make a nice fire but not much else. They're either (a) idiots, who can't even be bothered to look up proper bomb-making technique on the Internet; or (b) a false-flag operation designed to keep the population properly terrified and willing to hand even more power over to the national security state.
Right now, it's a toss-up.
Posted by: Mike on July 1, 2007 at 9:16 AM | PERMALINK
When my local paper did its stories on the JFK plot, it included a diagram of the airport detailing where the targeted fuel tanks are.
This prompted the usual spate of letters screaming: "How irresponsible! You're giving potential terorists ideas, and showing them where to go!"
My feeling is any "potential terrorist" who needs a newspaper to tell them airports have lots of fuel storage isn't very likely to be a danger to anyone else.
Posted by: Thlayli on July 1, 2007 at 9:24 AM | PERMALINK
minion: ..that Janet Reno vetoed the FBI request to look at Moussaoui's computer that August.
#1. the decision making never got to the attorney general..
The FBI determined at the time that there was insufficient evidence to petition FISA for a warrant.
A bipartisan Senate Judiciary Committee later concluded the FBI did have sufficient evidence, but had set too high a standard for establishing probable cause.
.
#2. john ashcroft was attorney general in august 2001..(confirmed in feb of that year)
.
#3. "There was nothing in that computer that we would have been able to use to link him to
terrorists, or to predict what happened on 9-11," one official said. "We just didn't have it."
Moussaoui Probe Pushed U.S. Limits - Washington Post - January 31, 2002
now you won't have to be so ill informed in the future...
Posted by: mr. irony on July 1, 2007 at 9:31 AM | PERMALINK
No, what makes them doofuses is that they built a bomb that can't explode.
I call bullshit. I just saw a movie where someone took out a helicopter with a police car. And I've seen many other movies where cars detonate on impact or a few seconds after. It's time that we ban all vehicles that have more than 15 gallons of gasoline and a battery wired to a source of sparks.
The british airport isn't the first time one of these things has caught on fire. I've personally seen several on highway 101.
Posted by: B on July 1, 2007 at 9:34 AM | PERMALINK
Look folks terrorism exists. Disgruntled outsiders exist. This has always been true. The question is how do you respond. Puerto Rican nationalists opened fire on Congress in the 1970s, William McKinley was shot by an anarchist. There have been attempts on the lives of FDR, Teddy Roosevelt, Ford and Jackson -- none of these things brought the country to its knees and created a police state in response. The world is scary. Other people want to kill people: separatists, anarchists, Islamists are all political movements. But by letting fear win, you eat at Liberty. And Liberty is how we ideologues. It's what we always have on our side. Or at least should. What seems to be the difference now is that we have let hysteria be our deciding response. Especially here in the U.S. where propaganda journalism is our new, widely distributed national medium.
Posted by: DC1974 on July 1, 2007 at 9:41 AM | PERMALINK
I've had the same thought abt the Bush administration. We can thank a benevolent God that they're all so inept and so intellectually blinkered. If they were competent and smart, we'd be in real trouble.
Unless of course the Republicans gave us 8 years of these cretins just to lull us onto a false sense of security.
Posted by: helmling on July 1, 2007 at 9:44 AM | PERMALINK
I've had the same thought abt the Bush administration. We can thank a benevolent God that they're all so inept and so intellectually blinkered. If they were competent and smart, we'd be in real trouble.
Unless of course the Republicans gave us 8 years of these cretins just to lull us onto a false sense of security.
Posted by: helmling on July 1, 2007 at 9:44 AM | PERMALINK
Or it might be Mossad.
Well there is this
at the other end of Picadilly...
"Mossad Spy" Found Dead
An Egyptian financier accused of spying for Israel has been found dead outside his London home in mysterious circumstances. Ashraf Marwan was alleged to have worked for Israeli intelligence agency Mossad during the 1973 Yom Kippur war with Egypt and Syria. He was accused of tipping Israel off about the war. Police said "He appears to have fallen from a balcony. The death is being treated as unexplained." The 62 year old son-in-law of former Egyptian president Gamal Abdel Nasser was found on Wednesday in St James's, Central London.
Posted by: snicker-snack on July 1, 2007 at 9:48 AM | PERMALINK
Nice post DC. Very nice.
Posted by: ckelly on July 1, 2007 at 9:50 AM | PERMALINK
More here.
Posted by: snicker-snack on July 1, 2007 at 9:54 AM | PERMALINK
"one Western official"
What a strange way to identify a source.
Posted by: KathyF on July 1, 2007 at 10:01 AM | PERMALINK
Ex-CIA Counterterrorism Expert, Larry Johnson, doesn't fully buy it either. "A non-fragmentation device, if it had detonated, the car itself would have exploded with a large BANG; and nothing else significant would have happened except maybe some "ear damage" to any passers-by within about 30-feet... basically, these "terrorists" could afford a Mercedes, but couldn't seem to put together an effective car bomb. They were just "yuppie terrorists" with a Benz, some propane tanks, gasoline, and some nails."
Posted by: snicker-snack on July 1, 2007 at 10:02 AM | PERMALINK
On each Devils Night in Detroit during the 80's and 90's literally dozens of buildings were burned to the ground by hooligans. No one one squealed about terrorists or cried that we needed to attack other countries.
Kooks exist.Message to WATB Republicans:
Grow.up.
Posted by: trex on July 1, 2007 at 10:06 AM | PERMALINK
Minion is lecturing people about paranoia.
Posted by: Alanis Morisette on July 1, 2007 at 10:10 AM | PERMALINK
These terra-ists are idiots. Our highschool kids are better at killing lots of people than they are. As for making bombs that work, it isn't THAT difficult (again, exposing the quality of the slap-dash terra-ists). A little experience with the old Estes rockets provides a good clue on how to set off a device. Estes engine or bomb. No different except in the nature of the explosive charge (rate of burn upon ignition).
Posted by: Finklestein Shitkid on July 1, 2007 at 10:11 AM | PERMALINK
Terrorists like bombs. Not just Islamic ones, this has been true throughout history. Good thing, too. If terrorists switched to firearms, they could kill dozens of Americans at will, AND put society into political paralysis.
Posted by: JMG on July 1, 2007 at 10:14 AM | PERMALINK
Why is this getting so much attention when domestic terrorism is barely covered? Domestic terrorism that is most common is Women's Clinic bombings or even just threats against them (and those that seek their aid). There is NO difference, terrorism is terrorism is terrorism, but only angry brown people of the "wrong" religious bent are labeled terrorists and covered to an extent beyond reason. When are we going to have equal coverage for the white xtian terrorists that make up most of the South?
Posted by: Praedor Atrebates on July 1, 2007 at 10:15 AM | PERMALINK
In France, the Islamics burn about 50 cars a day. Maybe we should help them train better before we start a program to train London Islamics.
Posted by: Matt on July 1, 2007 at 10:33 AM | PERMALINK
Matt's an idiot. Cars get burned in France by poor fucks of every religion. We might note France's West African and Caribbean and Vietnamese colonial adventures, which have left a bit of blowback.
Onto a more intelligent assessment of high-stakes terrorism in general: yes, jihadist al-Qu'aida wannabees (it's a brand, not an organization, anymore) are just that inept. In The Looming Tower we're confronted by Khalid Sheik Mohammad who has this spiffy plan to fly planes into shit, only he's surrounded by losers from the Arab lands, the ones whose own countries wouldn't take them back, and Afghani rural tribesmen. If Atta and his erudite, Western-trained and -acclimated four hadn't stopped by, which was taken as a gift from God, this visit, 11 September would have been just another sunny day in New York and Arlington.
It's a pretty solid argument that the Horror was, as John Robb would term it, a "black swan" about which we freaked out. Thus, we need to be vigilant, but not Guiliani-styled pants-wetting sphincter-loosened paranoid, even though, thanks to the Explosives University of Occupied Iraq, they will learn.
Posted by: Brian C.B. on July 1, 2007 at 10:47 AM | PERMALINK
"Is there any evidence yet that these attacks/terrorists are Al Qaeda at all? I'm a little reluctant to tag everything as part of Bin Laden's evil genius."
It's most likely the work of the CIA or Karl Rove.
Posted by: Freedom Fighter on July 1, 2007 at 11:05 AM | PERMALINK
"Of course that doesn't appear to be the case here, as "the brains" behind the operation don't appear to exist."
Islam doesn't exactly encourage its followers to be thinkers...
Posted by: Freedom Fighter on July 1, 2007 at 11:08 AM | PERMALINK
"Matt's an idiot. Cars get burned in France by poor fucks of every religion."
Brian CB is right, the car burnings in France is a multicultural effort. In fact Moslems make up only about 0.5% of the car burners, the vast majority were Buddhists, Jews, and Hindus.
Posted by: Freedom Fighter on July 1, 2007 at 11:11 AM | PERMALINK
In France, the Islamics burn about 50 cars a day. Maybe we should help them train better before we start a program to train London Islamics.
Brian is correct, it's not "Islamics" you moron, it's the impoverished:
It takes over two hours to reach Clichy-sous-Bois from central Paris. When you arrive, you begin to understand the alienation and exclusion of the youth.
The edge of the suburb is dominated by gritty high-rise projects. There are few shops and mall businesses are boarded up. The supermarket sells only the most basic food and materials. The population is almost exclusively of Turkish, African and Arab descent.
This is the other France, and economically it is a world away from the Champs-Elysée. Here, unemployment is at 19 percent, almost double the national average, and the foreign population is close to 42 percent of the inhabitants.
In a dirty Turkish café in the town, the reception is not positive and the scene is grim. Unemployed young men, sitting around and chain smoking contraband cigarettes make violent gestures to indicate they are not interested in talking to reporters.
"Get out. We don't want to speak to you, we don't care about your article, your editor or your opinion. You judge us and we judge you – go back to Paris!"
Rashid, however, thinks this reporter is in the market for drugs, but then proudly begins to speak of how and why he took part in the riots against Sarkozy, both after the election and in 2005. He claims to have personally set 10 cars on fire.
"We decided, me and my gang, to make a stand. Sarkozy is a fascist. He ran the police, and when he did, they became more racist, more violent than ever and they did not give us respect. The police attack people. In 2005 we rioted because they killed two of our brothers. The CRS (French riot police) – are SS."
Rashid introduces some of his friends, who proceed to boast and list the targets they have attacked. They claim to have taken part in an attack on a synagogue. However, talking to these youths, one gets the distinct impression that these are not the people that keep appearing in the international media. Neither do they seem particularly influenced by Islamism, nor deeply moved by a political agenda. They are not revolutionaries. They are defined by what they dislike and not what they want.
"How can I get a job? If I apply and I have my foreign name, my shitty address nobody is going to employ me! That's why we deal drugs. It's easy money," Rashid explains.
Posted by: trex on July 1, 2007 at 11:14 AM | PERMALINK
Why is this getting so much attention when domestic terrorism is barely covered?
Because Domestic Terrorism can't be used to justify military adventures overseas. Next Question.
Posted by: thersites on July 1, 2007 at 11:19 AM | PERMALINK
fact Moslems make up only about 0.5% of the car burners, the vast majority were Buddhists, Jews, and Hindus.
And all the major school shootings in America are done by middle class white kids. When do we attack the suburbs? Please spew some prejudice towards them for good measure.
Islam doesn't exactly encourage its followers to be thinkers...
Then why don't Sunnis and Shi'ites and Muslims and Druze and Sufis share the same beliefs? Why don't Lebanese Sunnis and Saudi Arabian Sunnis share the same beliefs? Why are there various associations of Muslim scholars who disagree with one another on interpretations of the Q'uran?
You are an ignorant, uneducated buffoon.
Posted by: trex on July 1, 2007 at 11:24 AM | PERMALINK
One thing that strikes me about the public reaction to these incidents is how little it seems to have benefited Bush and the Republicans.
Point is, nobody trusts them anymore to deal with terrorism. This means that even fearmongering is a card they can no longer play; they've been found out. Their trump card is now a joker.
Truly, what do they have left?
Posted by: frankly0 on July 1, 2007 at 11:40 AM | PERMALINK
Get real.
Internet based terrorism will be heavy on Travis Bickle maladjusted loser types and short on trained professionals. It will be heavy on Squeaky Frome type wannabe assasins who didn't understand that to chamber the first round in an automatic pistol you have to pull back the slide.
Posted by: Charles Warren on July 1, 2007 at 11:47 AM | PERMALINK
Doofuses will always be a vast majority of humanity. They have the advantage of numbers, and eventually some of them will succeed despite themselves.
Posted by: charlie don't surf on July 1, 2007 at 11:57 AM | PERMALINK
It's most likely the work of ... Karl Rove.
I tend to agree with you FF. Rove may be behind this latest tactic to label everything bad in the World as "Al Qaeda" (insurgents in Iraq, moron Benz bombers in London). It's a lot easier to muster support for the whacked White House agenda and you don't have to worry about who our real enemies are.
I sure wish the "Al Qaeda" would stop making it rain and flood here.
Posted by: ckelly on July 1, 2007 at 11:59 AM | PERMALINK
Yes, we have been lucky. But that's hardly guaranteed to last for long. A lot of radical Jihadis are looking at the abject failures of this, shaking their heads going "f***ing idiots". Nobody likes humiliating failures. They like big, splashy successes.
These people can and will learn from mistakes. We should learn faster than they do, even when they pull screw-ups like this.
Posted by: Stephen Daugherty on July 1, 2007 at 12:05 PM | PERMALINK
Half the people on Earth are below average. . .
--George Carlin
Posted by: cld on July 1, 2007 at 12:06 PM | PERMALINK
Whiskey Fire rightly mocks the screams wingers thusly:
The terrorists have scored major victories. All England is aflame. Scotland is laid waste. Heathrow is destroyed; goodbye Piccadilly, farewell Leicester Square. They lie in ash!
Posted by: RJB on July 1, 2007 at 12:06 PM | PERMALINK
"dramatic events in Britain over the last couple of days are a stark reminder of a terrorist threat that is likely getting worse for the West, not better."
Yes, if you define "getting worse" as the odds of getting killed in a terrorist attack as increasing from 1 in 10,000,000 to 1 in 9,999,995, then that statement might be true.
Exaggerating the threat, even by us liberals, when trying to appear hard-nosed and "serious-minded" about terrorism, or in an attempt to point out how the actions of the Bush administration have made things worse, is still "exaggerating the threat".
Thus increasing the odds that our ignorant populace will support the next over-reaction by our government and military. We gotta stop that.
Posted by: luci on July 1, 2007 at 12:37 PM | PERMALINK
the only thing that makes them doofus's is that the cell phone trigger failed… minion at 9:07 AM
Instead of trying to smear Reno with discredited lies, you should remember that it was
your man, President Dodo, who ignored all warnings and did nothing to prevent 9-11. It was
your man, President Dodo, who decided to politicize 9-11 and attack Iraq instead of going after bin Laden. It is
your man, President Dodo, and his neo-Con allies who invented and perfected paranoid politics with tales of black helicopters, UN forces in the US, claiming that some third world dictator was a threat.
In France, the Islamics burn about 50 cars a day…. Matt at 10:33 AM
Not true, but it is true that about 5 car bombs explode daily in Baghdad thanks to the policies of President Dodo.
Islam doesn't exactly encourage its followers to be thinkers... Freedom Fighter at 11:08 AM
Christian Conservativism doesn't encourage its followers to be Christian.
If liberals are cheered by the misteps of terrorists… moronichypocriterepublican at 12:37 PM
Everyone knows that Republicans love terrorism. It's the fuel for Republican fear-mongering and McCarthyism as you illustrate so well.
Posted by: Mike on July 1, 2007 at 1:03 PM | PERMALINK
America has been dealing with terrorism for a LONG time. The only thing that changed in the last six years was just how incredibly bad we have "fought" this war.
The failures at the top that lead to 911 were magnified a thousand fold in the response to 911 - specifically invading Iraq and the slash burning of our own civil liberties.
Rule number one against terrorism is don't do what the terrorist want - maybe someday someone can explain this SIMPLE CONCEPT to our President.
Posted by: Glen on July 1, 2007 at 1:27 PM | PERMALINK
Why is this getting so much attention when domestic terrorism is barely covered? Domestic terrorism that is most common is Women's Clinic bombings or even just threats against them (and those that seek their aid). There is NO difference, terrorism is terrorism is terrorism, but only angry brown people of the "wrong" religious bent are labeled terrorists and covered to an extent beyond reason. When are we going to have equal coverage for the white xtian terrorists that make up most of the South?...Posted by: Praedor Atrebates on July 1, 2007 at 10:15 AM | PERMALINK
It isn't just the province of southerners. From today's Des Moines Register:
DAVENPORT -- A Detroit man was sentenced to five years in prison Friday for trying to burn down a women's health clinic that he mistakenly thought performed abortions.
David McMenemy, 46, pleaded guilty in January to arson against a business affecting interstate commerce. He could have been sentenced up to 20 years in prison.
Posted by: Blue Girl, Red State (aka G.C.) on July 1, 2007 at 1:33 PM | PERMALINK
Get a grip people. These attacks failed and failed miserably. This is just another example of how the media can be stampeded into handing a victory to Bin Laden and his gang.
Posted by: corpus juris on July 1, 2007 at 1:35 PM | PERMALINK
Damn! I lost the last paragraph of the article in an html incident apparently:
The Edgerton clinic provides prenatal care and medical services to low-income and underprivileged women. It does not perform abortions, nor does it make abortion referrals, clinic officials said.
Posted by: Blue Girl, Red State (aka G.C.) on July 1, 2007 at 1:35 PM | PERMALINK
now you won't have to be so ill informed in the future...
Right. Idiots like minion still blame Clinton for Ruby Ridge. Reality is just too difficult for some people to get their brains around. Ideological incoherence is so much easier.
Posted by: Disputo on July 1, 2007 at 1:42 PM | PERMALINK
It does not perform abortions, nor does it make abortion referrals, clinic officials said.
Yeah, but if they provide contraception of any type they are evil and must be destroyed, with the blessings of the GOP.
Posted by: Disputo on July 1, 2007 at 1:45 PM | PERMALINK
Snicker Snack,
My thoughts exactly.
The first thing that came to mind was Brown's appointment of several anti-war folks to his government so somebody had to remind him just what the fuck this is all about.
These reek of a false flag black op.
Posted by: angryspittle on July 1, 2007 at 1:48 PM | PERMALINK
It's amazing how freaked out and scared everyone here across the pond are. On local Chicago news they reported that the "Taste of Chicago" beefed up their security due to the keystone terrorists in Britain.
Posted by: Disputo on July 1, 2007 at 1:48 PM | PERMALINK
It was a women's clinic, and our xianists are no less fanatic about "putting women in their place" than the islamist whack-jobs are.
Posted by: Blue Girl, Red State (aka G.C.) on July 1, 2007 at 1:50 PM | PERMALINK
Rule number one against terrorism is don't do what the terrorist want - maybe someday someone can explain this SIMPLE CONCEPT to our President.
GWB has only continued what Reagan started by trading arms for hostages.
The GOP -- the Party of Appeasement.
Posted by: Disputo on July 1, 2007 at 1:54 PM | PERMALINK
Hell, Disputo - last night on our local Faux affiliate they warned us to look out for "erratic driving" and rental trucks. If erratic driving is the mark of a terrorist, every fucking body in Kansas City is a terrorist, because not a soul in this town can drive a lick.
Now - the rental trucks - that comment is going to get a lot of people hassled by drip-lip rednecks. Consider this - it's freaking July. Medical residencies start and end in July, so there are a lot of brown people who have either finished med school or residencies and are going to be traversing the country in rented moving vans.
Watch the blurbs in the metro section of your local paper. People are going to get the cops called on them for the crime of checking into a motel. That should only be a crime if the motel is in Lordsburg, NM.
Posted by: Blue Girl, Red State (aka G.C.) on July 1, 2007 at 2:01 PM | PERMALINK
An Egyptian financier accused of spying for Israel has been found dead outside his London home in mysterious circumstances. Ashraf Marwan was alleged to have worked for Israeli intelligence agency Mossad during the 1973 Yom Kippur war with Egypt and Syria.
Is Ashraf Marwan related to Habib Marwan?
Posted by: Disputo on July 1, 2007 at 2:15 PM | PERMALINK
mhr: If liberals are cheered by the missteps of terrorists, their brains are more loosely wired than I thought
Okay, we're supposed to be cheered when they don't screw up?
Posted by: thersites on July 1, 2007 at 2:17 PM | PERMALINK
Nah - we are just supposed to be afeared no matter what. Sorry. I don't do panic, especially the irrational sort. I'm an American, and in possession of my spine.
Posted by: Blue Girl, Red State (aka G.C.) on July 1, 2007 at 2:20 PM | PERMALINK
It was a women's clinic, and our xianists are no less fanatic about "putting women in their place" than the islamist whack-jobs are.
Posted by: Blue Girl, Red State (aka G.C.)
Really? X-tians are advocating female circumcision? Can't drive a car? Can't go out in public without a father or brother accompanying? Supporting honor killings? Have to cover their head?
Geez, I know you hate Bush and christians, but stop carrying the water for the Islamists.
Posted by: RSM on July 1, 2007 at 2:23 PM | PERMALINK
The thing that the Bush supporters just don't get is that terrorist attacks will not send the American public to scurry back behind the boots of Steely-Eyed Rocket Man Bush.
And the reason for that is Katrina.
Most people are reluctant to deem a politician an evil fascist--but they'll believe in incompetence any day of the week.
Katrina could have been a sterling example of how the American Government would respond to a terrorist attack--showing how, if some Al-Qaeda terrorist wiith a dreaded suitcase nuke had blown the levees, how the government would be there within hours, with thousands of choppers landing everywhere and W, sleeves rolled up, handing out bottled watter with the Nationsl Guard.
Instead we got a disastrous, humiliating fuck-up with dead bodies floating in the streets of New Orleans, overseen by a clueless political crony--and countless Republicans screaming like a drunk teenager at the scene of a car crash whining that it was not not my fault, man!
That's when most American realized that the Bush Administration had been gaming them. That all the stuff they had just assumed that W & Co. would be doing, they hadn't done. And they wouldn't evden come clean.
That's why future terrorist attacks won't help the Bushies. Because no matter what the deadly danger is, you don't trust a fuck-up.
Posted by: pbg on July 1, 2007 at 2:39 PM | PERMALINK
I don't hate christians, Mike. I fear christianists. And the only thing stopping some of the wackier ones from proclaiming their fanatic beliefs about womans place is the fact that we live in an ostensibly free society. But you know that, you just like to - how did you put it in the past? - sport argue. I'm feeling obstreperous enough to play along today. Unfortunately I have things to do. Back later.
Posted by: Blue Girl, Red State (aka G.C.) on July 1, 2007 at 2:46 PM | PERMALINK
I see that RSM doesn't understand the difference between the phrases "no less fanatic" and "the same in every detail".
Wingnuts truly are the dumbest fuckers on the planet.
Truly. The. Dumbest. Fuckers.
Posted by: Disputo on July 1, 2007 at 2:47 PM | PERMALINK
Ah, I see. RSM doesn't understand the difference between Christians and Christianists. Well, since he doesn't understand the difference between Muslims and Islamists, at least his ignorance is ecumenical.
Posted by: Disputo on July 1, 2007 at 2:50 PM | PERMALINK
That's why future terrorist attacks won't help the Bushies. Because no matter what the deadly danger is, you don't trust a fuck-up.
If only that were true.
Posted by: Disputo on July 1, 2007 at 2:53 PM | PERMALINK
Disputo, I think it is--not for everybody, of course. But I think Katrina is why Bush is staying at 30% no matter what he tries.
Posted by: pbg on July 1, 2007 at 3:08 PM | PERMALINK
"Then why don't Sunnis and Shi'ites and Muslims and Druze and Sufis share the same beliefs?"
It seesm they all share the same beliefs in killing of infidels: Jews, Christians, Buddhists, Hindus, atheists, and other Moslems etc...
Posted by: Freedom Fighter on July 1, 2007 at 3:30 PM | PERMALINK
I don't hate christians, Mike. I fear christianists. And the only thing stopping some of the wackier ones from proclaiming their fanatic beliefs about womans place is the fact that we live in an ostensibly free society.
OK, I"ll go with xtianist. But first, they have about as much chance of turning the US of A into their dominion as the Pittsburgh Pirates do of having a winning season. Ain't going to happen. The islamists, on the other hand, have a far, far better chance of creating an islamic republican, something that ought to classify as a woman's nightmare. If you cared about women outside the US.
Second, I am unfamiliar with just what particular restrictions on women's rights the xtianists are advocating beyond restricting abortion. Will xtianists be able to get a divorce just by deciding they want to? Etc.? This is from the Koran and dirves Sharia, which is the law Islamists want to live by and have...
“Men have authority over women because God has made the one superior to the other, and because men spend their wealth to maintain them. Good women are obedient. They guard their unseen parts because God has guarded them. As for those among you who fear disobedience, admonish them and send them to beds apart and beat them.” Sura 4:34
Or how about when the Saudi Religious Police were "beating young girls to prevent them from leaving the school because they were not wearing the abaya". The school was on fire and they burned to death.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/middle_east/1874471.stm
You of all people seem least likely to accept that, much less carry water for it.
Posted by: RSM on July 1, 2007 at 4:09 PM | PERMALINK
I wrote
islamic republican
Unleash the snark hounds...
Posted by: RSM on July 1, 2007 at 4:12 PM | PERMALINK
If only Bush wasn’t so weak on terrorism, we would have almost nothing to worry about now. Of course this bumbling coward:
1) Was warned of terrorist attacks using airplanes in the summer of 2001 and did absolutely nothing, nada, zilch to try to prevent them.
2) When the Twin Towers were attacked on 9-11-01, flew off to Nebraska to hide like a little girl in a cornfield.
3) Allowed Usama bin Laden and Zayman al-Zawahiri to escape at Tora Bora when we had them cornered.
This gutless fuckwad instead attacks a Muslim country that had nothing to do with 9-11, as petty revenge for a failed assassination attempt on his father.
Some people, like this author believe al-Qaeda was never much of a threat to begin with. I agree with him. Instead, due to our invasion of Iraq and our treatment of prisoners at Gitmo and elsewhere like dogs and worse, we have every Muslim in the world pissed at us and willing to drive their flaming SUVs into airport terminals.
That is why Dick Cheney and George W. Bush need to spend the rest of their pathetic lives in a federal penitentiary.
Posted by: The Conservative Deflator on July 1, 2007 at 4:17 PM | PERMALINK
islamic republican
Makes sense to me. Every Arab I've ever met was nuts for Republicans, swallowed them hook, line and sinker. Until recently.
Posted by: cld on July 1, 2007 at 4:44 PM | PERMALINK
"You know, the same way you guys cheer for the "insurgents" in Iraq."
Who did that, Freedom F***er? Got any cites?
Posted by: sj on July 1, 2007 at 4:57 PM | PERMALINK
"You know, the same way you guys cheer for the "insurgents" in Iraq."
Who did that, Freedom F***er? Got any cites?
Posted by: sj on July 1, 2007 at 4:58 PM | PERMALINK
Who did that, Freedom F***er? Got any cites?
Silly rabbit. FF doesn't ever have cites. Just unsubstantiated claptrap.
Posted by: ckelly on July 1, 2007 at 5:00 PM | PERMALINK
…you guys cheer for the "insurgents" in Iraq. Freedom Fighter at 3:20 PM
Pathetic McCarthyitism. To Republicans, when the lies no longer work use smear&lie. Are you going to say the same about Hagel, Lugar and others as they also abandon Bush's failure?
It seesm they all share the same beliefs in killing of infidels:
Freedom Fighter at 3:30 PM
What you ascribe to religious belief is simple nationalism in response to discrimination, invasion, and oppression: discrimination in India, invasion in Palestine and Iraq, oppression by American foreign policy elsewhere. Our support for totalitarian regimes and overthrowing governments only goes unnoticed in the US.
….Ain't going to happen…RSMat 4:09 PM
Bush, Rove, the Republican Party, and Republican candidates are doing their best. They are all kowtowing to extremist 'christian' groups and have appointed a one-church majority to the Supreme Court. Rational people are fighting this every day, but power is on the side of the christianists.
As for the treatment of women elsewhere in the world, there has be no attempt from the Bush government to increase women's rights. Your policies are to deny birth control information, support the status quo in Africa, South America, Asia and the Middle East. Like terrorism, Bush political actions have only served to worsen the rights of women, not ameliorate them.
No Republican has ever shown any concern except, as yourself, in offering talking points that imply only false choices exist.
Posted by: Mike on July 1, 2007 at 5:08 PM | PERMALINK
[deleted content]
Posted by: comrade on July 1, 2007 at 5:25 PM | PERMALINK
The Christianists have their own secret army, Blackwater, who are more than capable of just about anything, and who would know?
Isn't that the whole point of Blackwater?
Posted by: cld on July 1, 2007 at 6:01 PM | PERMALINK
There has been a fair amount of press lately on the new Al Qaeda, which is split into small independent cells and is feared to be more robust to detection and capture. This may all be true, but from the looks of it the small independent cells seem to have a really hard tapping into Al Qaeda’s central expertise on things terrorist. The result has been a serious of amateurish attacks.
Posted by: fafner1 on July 1, 2007 at 6:09 PM | PERMALINK
Your policies are to blah, blah, blah...
No, what you wish my policies to be are blah, blah, blah. Unlike you, I guess, I maintain an independence of opinion. But to continue...
Bush's policies are to deny birth control information, support the status quo in Africa, South America, Asia and the Middle East.
Yes, that is what separates modernitiy and equal rights from the medievalness of Islam and tribalism for women everywhere, America's inability to get the word out on birth control. Yea, right. Give me a break.
Posted by: RSM on July 1, 2007 at 7:57 PM | PERMALINK
Getting a grip on reality. Terrorist can only exist if they can create terror in large number of people. Fact: a kid kills 30+ students. He is described as sick. Nation mourns, life goes on. If same kid is identified has having links to al Qaeda, world goes into panic terror attack. Same event, body count, one terrorizes the world one and causes the world to mourn american gun culture. It is what we tell ourselves about the event that creates the terror on the one hand or the genuine grief and sadness on the other. We need, as people, as leaders, as a nation, a world, to learn to think better, learn about probability, work to become rational, use reason, logic. A great place to begin to defeat terror is TO NOT BE TERRORIZED IN THE FIRST PLACE. Then the people that are sick, psychotic and want to kill people are just criminals. We need to prevent them from killing people as best we can. But like the NASA employee that killed his coworkers or the senior citizen that plows his car into people waiting at a bus, or the psycho that drives an suv into airport lobby, lets remember to keep a grip. They (some in gov't, al Qaeda, etc) want us to be terrorized, overwhelmed by irrational fear. Just say no.
Regards,
Mickster
Posted by: mickster on July 1, 2007 at 9:31 PM | PERMALINK
Getting a grip on reality. Terrorist can only exist if they can create terror in large number of people. Fact: a kid kills 30+ students. He is described as sick. Nation mourns, life goes on. If same kid is identified has having links to al Qaeda, world goes into panic terror attack. Same event, body count, one terrorizes the world one and causes the world to mourn american gun culture. It is what we tell ourselves about the event that creates the terror on the one hand or the genuine grief and sadness on the other. We need, as people, as leaders, as a nation, a world, to learn to think better, learn about probability, work to become rational, use reason, logic. A great place to begin to defeat terror is TO NOT BE TERRORIZED IN THE FIRST PLACE. Then the people that are sick, psychotic and want to kill people are just criminals. We need to prevent them from killing people as best we can. But like the NASA employee that killed his coworkers or the senior citizen that plows his car into people waiting at a bus, or the psycho that drives an suv into airport lobby, lets remember to keep a grip. They (some in gov't, al Qaeda, etc) want us to be terrorized, overwhelmed by irrational fear. Just say no.
Regards,
Mickster
Posted by: mickster on July 1, 2007 at 9:31 PM | PERMALINK
To Steve Benen: Would you mind considering toning down some of the rhetorical heat e.g. "...stark reminder of a terrorist threat that is likely getting worse for the West" and "...been far too many devastating acts of terrorism in the West". Compare the last couple days of failed bombings that the Brits have experienced to real Terrorism. If you consider the Nazi Blitz of the city of London that killed some 16000 the failed attack of 2 car bombs and a flaming SUV provide differerent perspective than that I read in your post. I have the impression that much of blogging, popular TV, cable TV, radio are aiding and abetting the Bush case for the mythical Global War on Terror and the "be afraid, be very afraid" red flag waving. I would hope that you would not join in that aiding and abetting We could all develop an better understanding of what a real "stark reminder of terrorists threat" and/or "far too many acts of terrorism" by going to live with an average Iragi family in Sadr City for a couple of days. Now that would be truly terrifying.
RSVP if you have a chance,
Mickster
Regards,
Mickster
Posted by: mickster on July 2, 2007 at 2:04 AM | PERMALINK
I am amazed that Bush and the various open borders groups are holding the border open for as many as 13,000 illegal aliens per day entering the United States, and al-Queda hasn't accepted the invitation.!
Leaves many of us wondering why.
Posted by: Luther on July 2, 2007 at 2:34 AM | PERMALINK
If you consider the Nazi Blitz of the city of London that killed some 16000 the failed attack of 2 car bombs and a flaming SUV provide differerent perspective
Similarly, I look out the window of my office now at a city where 72,489 people were incinerated on two days in March 1945, an event still recent enough to have been within the lifetime of over 20% of the city. As Wikipedia writes "After 2 hours of bombardment, Tokyo was engulfed in a firestorm. The fires were so hot they would ignite the clothing on individuals as they were fleeing. Many women were wearing what were called 'air-raid turbans' around their heads and the heat would ignite those turbans like a wick on a candle" Now that's terror.
Posted by: snicker-snack on July 2, 2007 at 3:53 AM | PERMALINK
To Steve Benen: Would you mind considering toning down some of the rhetorical heat e.g. "...stark reminder of a terrorist threat that is likely getting worse for the West" and "...been far too many devastating acts of terrorism in the West".
Amen. It is also a stark reminder that the Islamists aren't very good terrorists. Amateur hour.
Posted by: RSM on July 2, 2007 at 9:12 AM | PERMALINK
Half the people on Earth are below average. . .
--George Carlin
Sometimes it's hard to believe only half the people are stupider than average
--Ron Thomason, Dry Branch Fire Squad
Posted by: just sayin on July 2, 2007 at 10:15 AM | PERMALINK
B: I call bullshit. I just saw a movie where someone took out a helicopter with a police car. And I've seen many other movies where cars detonate on impact or a few seconds after.
You bet. And torture works for Jack Bauer!
JMG: Terrorists like bombs. Not just Islamic ones, this has been true throughout history. Good thing, too. If terrorists switched to firearms, they could kill dozens of Americans at will, AND put society into political paralysis.
Indeed. Imagine how much trouble four, well-financed teams of terrorist snipers with one gun each could cause.
Beltway Sniper Attacks
Luther: I am amazed that Bush and the various open borders groups are holding the border open for as many as 13,000 illegal aliens per day entering the United States, and al-Queda hasn't accepted the invitation!
Leaves many of us wondering why.
And of course many of us are wondering whether some terrorists have discreetly accepted the invitation, and are taking their time with creating effective terrorist plots. But preventing illegal immigration with good (but expensive) law enforcement isn't as glamorous and exciting as overthrowing Saddam. Nope, dressing up in a Border Guard uniform wouldn't be as cool as dressing up in a flight suit.
Posted by: cowalker on July 2, 2007 at 11:47 AM | PERMALINK
Disputo: The GOP -- the Party of Appeasement.
Pat Buchannon calls the gop: the war party
being a card-carrying member...i guess he would know..
Posted by: mr. irony on July 2, 2007 at 2:36 PM | PERMALINK