Editore"s Note
Tilting at Windmills

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July 2, 2007

ALMOST LAUGHABLE....There's been ample discussion about the recent attempted attacks in Britain, the sophistication of the would-be terrorists, and the connection they may or may not have had to al Qaeda.

Former Scotland Yard Detective John O'Connor's comments on CNN this morning addressed all of these points nicely. (TPM has posted the clip.)

"I think that rather than using the all-embracing term of 'al Qaeda,' I think that you should be using the term 'jihadists,' which I think makes more sense. Because, though they may share common purposes with al Qaeda, I don't think that al Qaeda has the control to operate something like this. They could operate a major terrorist outrage, but I think it would be more professionally run. I mean this was a hopeless, incompetent terrorist attack.

"When you see the ludicrous situation where none of the bombs were able to be detonated and these guys are trying to set fire to petrol, when all they did, they didn't get a detonation at the doors of the airport lounge; all they got was a bomb fire.

"They set fire to fuel. Well, that in its own way, is not going to detonate the gas cylinders and it's not going to cause an explosion. It was just a fire. I mean, that is so incompetent as to be almost laughable."

An Andrew Sullivan reader also adds a helpful perspective about the contrast between British officials commenting on the events in London and Glasgow and those of Bush administration officials addressing various plots.

You can't watch the response of UK police authorities in their public statements without being impressed with the careful balance they strike between exorting the public to vigilance and resistance to being stampeded into premature conclusions. And particularly their restraint in talking about those who were arrested. "Out of respect for proper process, we will avoid comment," they say. And indeed, that's exactly what responsible law enforcement in a democratic society should say. It couldn't contrast more sharply with the conduct of the Ashcroft and, still worse, Gonzales Justice Department which engages in hysterical rants, leveling charges that almost never pan out, and screaming "terrorists!" at the top of their lungs - on a manifestly partisan political message. Let's call it department of calm heads vs. department of headless chickens. In any event, our friends in Britain are providing a model on this.

Steve Benen 1:33 PM Permalink | Trackbacks | Comments (44)

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Comments

Everything's 'al Qaeda'. The insurgents, the leadership in Iran, Putin's mother-in-law. Everybody.

Posted by: Jenna's Bush on July 2, 2007 at 1:38 PM | PERMALINK

Stop referencing Andrew Sullivan. He's not a good person.

Posted by: dumm dumm on July 2, 2007 at 1:40 PM | PERMALINK

ALMOST LAUGHABLE

I'm not surprised the terrorists were so inept and incompetent. American and allied forces have been pounding Al-Qaeda so hard in Iraq, Al-Qaeda has had to send all of its best troops to Iraq just to stay afloat. This had made it impossible for them to send well-trained forces to launch terrorist attacks outside of Iraq, and, in particular, in Britain. That the terrorist attack in London was so inept and horribly executed was one of the results of how well we're doing in Iraq. Just another reason for Bush and America to keep troops in Iraq and continue with the Surge.

Posted by: Al on July 2, 2007 at 1:46 PM | PERMALINK

US criminal justice has become so politicized that none of it members can do anything but appeal to the base emotions of a hysterical electorate, regardless of political party affiliation.

Posted by: Brojo on July 2, 2007 at 1:52 PM | PERMALINK

Mentioning ethnicities...

So al Qaeda is now an ethnicity, mhr? Maybe they're all from "al Qaedia" like your "Germans" are from "Germany" and your "Japanese" are from "Japan."

Posted by: shnooky on July 2, 2007 at 1:55 PM | PERMALINK

I mean, that is so incompetent as to be almost laughable.

It's too bad they're not American, or they'd be perfectly qualified for a job with the Bush White House....

Posted by: Stefan on July 2, 2007 at 1:57 PM | PERMALINK

al-Qaeda is just a scary concept (i.e. a bogeyman) the Bushies have used to manipulate people into not caring about him and his cronies running up $600 billion in debt, while looting the U.S. Treasury for rich people and oil companies, in the form of unneeded tax cuts.

Anyone who has watched The Power of Nightmares knows al-Qaeda was never more than a loose association of ragtag killers who got damn lucky when they sucker punched us on 9-11-01. We could have finished them in December 2001 at Tora Bora had Bush not been totally incompetent and didn't have a raging hard-on to kill Saddam Hussein and his two sons.

Posted by: The Conservative Deflator on July 2, 2007 at 2:07 PM | PERMALINK

hopeless pedant >"...GWB: The only thing we have is fear."

Nice bumper sticker

"The whole aim of practical politics is to keep the populace alarmed (and hence clamorous to be led to safety) by menacing it with an endless series of hobgoblins, all of them imaginary." - H. L. Mencken

Posted by: daCascadian on July 2, 2007 at 2:08 PM | PERMALINK

Even Larry Johnson seems to say that some credit should go to Bush and Blair that these terror attacks were so weak.

Personally, I think the credit goes to Prince Bandar, who apparently has stopped paying Osama bin Laden to send his first-stringers to London.

Posted by: osama_been_forgotten on July 2, 2007 at 2:12 PM | PERMALINK

"Mentioning ethnicities used to be a sensible way of identifying people- no more."

Dear heart, the key difference, that you conveniently ignore, is that Roosevelt accurately labeled the people who were attacking us. But then, who ever accused trolls like you of being concerned about accuracy?

Posted by: PaulB on July 2, 2007 at 2:12 PM | PERMALINK

I think what mhr means is we should clearly identify the terrorists as Arabs from Arabia, or does he mean al Qaedians from al Qaedia, or maybe Muslims from Muslimania. I guess that's what he means, I really can't tell. Besides, it sounds like the terrorest were permenant residents of the U.K.

Posted by: fafner1 on July 2, 2007 at 2:13 PM | PERMALINK

Ah, Kevin.

The world changed on 911, Kevin. Even you must see that now.

The events of 911 showed that we can never take terror for granted. We must appear united, strong and sedulous.

Whether it be toppling of towers or burning rags in a car, the terrorists will stop at nothing to achieve their hideous ends of the establishment of their Third Caliphate and the destruction of Western Civilization.

It is a battel for the ages: a Mideval outlook versus a progressive, forward thinking one. THey cannot compete with us, so they try to hold us back.

The surge in Iraq is working. Violence down 80%. Al Anbar shieks joining forces with us. Sunni insurgents turning in their jihadi badges for US stripes.

All over things are getting better. But we must not succumb to the temptations of the Democratic Congress that pleads surrendur. As blogger Lal Radzovic says: "We must never surrendur!"

Posted by: egbert on July 2, 2007 at 2:17 PM | PERMALINK

So, which is it? Does Steve still consider the U.S. derelict for not warning Britain about "laughable" terrorism?

Proves the point I made on the earlier post.

Posted by: harry on July 2, 2007 at 2:21 PM | PERMALINK

Ah, egbert.

I see you still haven't figured out that Kevin is on vacation.

Posted by: DR on July 2, 2007 at 2:22 PM | PERMALINK

"They set fire to fuel. Well, that in its own way, is not going to detonate the gas cylinders and it's not going to cause an explosion. It was just a fire. I mean, that is so incompetent as to be almost laughable."

"You go to war with the jihad you have, not the jihad you want to have."

Even I believe this was al Qaeda tricking us, lulling us into thinking that they had fallen on hard times. Why not set up a group of patsies as a false flag type operation or whatever and create a sense of "incompetence" amongst those of us in the West who are standing watch on the ramparts of freedom?

If you ask me, the BIG ONE is coming. Perhaps in two days. Perhaps in September. I, for one, am stocking up on supplies and I shall be prepared. Will you?

Posted by: Norman Rogers on July 2, 2007 at 2:24 PM | PERMALINK

Egbert isn't a real person. Like most "Al" posts he's a sock puppet thrown up here so that liberal posters have something to argue with that doesn't present much of a challenge. The typos in particular are getting a bit too cute.

I suspect that most people capable of raising real arguments here left in disgust a long time ago.

Posted by: rnc on July 2, 2007 at 2:27 PM | PERMALINK

I suspect that most people capable of raising real arguments here left in disgust a long time ago.

Pardon me, dumbass--but I haven't gone anywhere and you better mind your p's and q's. The moderator was quite busy over the weekend.

What liberal dares challenge me? I have argued many of you into retirement and obscurity. I bang my shield and sword together and blink my eyes in the sunlight and the dust, waiting for a challenger.

Posted by: Norman Rogers on July 2, 2007 at 2:34 PM | PERMALINK

If you ask me, the BIG ONE is coming. . .
Posted by: Norman Rogers on July 2, 2007 at 2:24 PM | PERMALINK

Well, you better give the "big dummy" the keys to the crusher, or he'll never be able to take over and run the junkyard after you're gone, mister Sanford.

Posted by: osama_been_forgotten on July 2, 2007 at 2:41 PM | PERMALINK

all they got was a bomb fire

I suspect what he actually said was "all they got was a bonfire."

A bonfire, in case it's not a word used in America, is a fire deliberately set for entertainment at a social function, or for privately disposing of flammable trash like leaves. As distinct from the sort of accidental fire that would cause you to call the fire brigade.

Calling the terrorists' attempts a bit of party fun or a domestic chore is pretty demeaning to them, and I expect Mr. O'Connor said it that way on purpose.

Posted by: derek on July 2, 2007 at 2:52 PM | PERMALINK

I suspect that most people capable of raising real arguments here left in disgust a long time ago.

Assertion not in evidence: That there exist people who can "raise real arguments" defending the mendacity, incompetence and corruption of the modern Republican Party.

"rnc" may have unintentionally (of course) hit close to the truth -- honest conservatives did indeed leave the defense of the Bush Administration and the neocons to dishonest cretins like rnc a long time ago.

I'd welcome an honest debate, but you argue with the trolls you have, not the trolls you wish you had.

Posted by: Gregory on July 2, 2007 at 2:59 PM | PERMALINK

See? Poor Gregory runs away from me again. Fare thee well, poor little scared liberal. You are hungry, wet and cold because you spent all of your time frolicking and playing while I was busy building a safe, warm home full of food and supplies. I will take pity on you--you may go about your business, and leave me to nibble at acorns and enjoy my leisure time.

Posted by: Norman Rogers on July 2, 2007 at 3:03 PM | PERMALINK

On the other hand, if Martians really did invade England the US media would probably not cover it at all on the grounds that it might cause panic.

They understand their audience as hysterical infants who have to be taken care of, or told stories.

Posted by: cld on July 2, 2007 at 3:07 PM | PERMALINK

A bonfire, in case it's not a word used in America

It's a common word here in the Midwestern US.

I suspect the problem is that Brits can't speak proper English....

(*ducking*)

Posted by: Disputo on July 2, 2007 at 3:30 PM | PERMALINK

Disputo
Not only can't the Brits speak proper english they also can't spell..you know like.favour, labour, neighbour .....

The Canadians are even worse. What with all that out and about in a boat.

Posted by: optical weenie on July 2, 2007 at 3:53 PM | PERMALINK

Normie!

You got acorns in your dojo?

Woooo hooooo

Posted by: optical weenie on July 2, 2007 at 3:55 PM | PERMALINK
….I bang my shield and sword together…. Norman Rogers at 2:34 PM
Your daddy must have taken you to a lot of gladiator movies.
…in your dojo? optical weenie at 3:55 PM
The hottest new thing: Disco Dojo: "where ninja meets funk, tae kwon do meets salsa, and kickboxing meets jazz." Posted by: Mike on July 2, 2007 at 4:11 PM | PERMALINK

LOL. So Hitchens is a leftie now?

Sufficiently amused.

Posted by: Disputo on July 2, 2007 at 4:22 PM | PERMALINK

Fare thee well, poor little scared liberal. You are hungry, wet and cold because you spent all of your time frolicking and playing while I was busy building a safe, warm home full of food and supplies. I will take pity on you--you may go about your business, and leave me to nibble at acorns and enjoy my leisure time.

Posted by: Norman Rogers

i always thought you were a fucking squirrel, norm.

your pal,
blake

Posted by: blake on July 2, 2007 at 4:24 PM | PERMALINK

The incompetence of the terror attack just demonstrates the failures of socialist medicine.

An Iraqi junior doctor and a brilliant (??) neurologist working for the NHS are among the suspects being quizzed over the series of bomb attacks across Britain, it emerged today...He is one of three NHS doctors arrested by police hunting the car bombers.
Posted by: RSM on July 2, 2007 at 4:29 PM | PERMALINK

I suspect that most people capable of raising real arguments here left in disgust a long time ago.

And because you had no such capacity they left you behind to mewl incoherently in their place???

Posted by: trex on July 2, 2007 at 4:31 PM | PERMALINK

I.m with Normy on this.Oh and don't buy the Iphone,Hooks into the FBI, they can find you anywhere.

Posted by: john john on July 2, 2007 at 4:34 PM | PERMALINK

Harry: Does Steve still consider the U.S. derelict for not warning Britain about "laughable" terrorism?

I can't speak for Steve, but peronally I would want to be warned about someone intending to attack me, even if they turned out to be incompetent, even laughably so. Wouldn't you?

Posted by: thersites on July 2, 2007 at 4:35 PM | PERMALINK

It's too bad they're not American, or they'd be perfectly qualified for a job with the Bush White House....
Posted by: Stefan

I think they were working as Dem campaign managers for the last two Prez elections.

Posted by: RSM on July 2, 2007 at 4:36 PM | PERMALINK

Unlike you Dumasses,Norm,Al,Mhr and I know they are comming to get us,You libs are making us weak,The Four of us know AQ will use the Iphone to find us and kill us.Pray to Jesus oh Lord.

Posted by: john john on July 2, 2007 at 4:38 PM | PERMALINK

The incompetence of the terror attack just demonstrates the failures of socialist medicine.

US doctors, of course, thriving in a system of corporate control of healthcare delivery, are generally quite accomplished terrorists.

Doesn't it ever bother you being so fucking stupid?

Posted by: Disputo on July 2, 2007 at 4:45 PM | PERMALINK

Doesn't it ever bother you being so fucking stupid?
Posted by: Disputo

This, from someone who wrote "I suspect the problem is that Brits can't speak proper English..."

Posted by: RSM on July 2, 2007 at 4:50 PM | PERMALINK
… read Christopher Hitchen's piece ….moronichypocriterepublican at 4:08 PM
Those are words for idiots, full of sound and fury, signifying drunkenness and the pandering of a whore who will kiss any toad as he begs for Republican noise machine bucks.
….Dem campaign managers for the last two Prez elections RSM at 4:36 PM
Most Americans are aware how the Supreme Court and the Bush DoJ is guaranteeing Republican election victories. 2006 was a fluke. The electorate simply didn't believe the bushshit for once.


Posted by: Mike on July 2, 2007 at 5:18 PM | PERMALINK

rnc wrote: "I suspect that most people capable of raising real arguments here left in disgust a long time ago."

Dear little Normy, in an indignant huff, wrote: "Pardon me, dumbass--but I haven't gone anywhere."

Q.E.D.

Posted by: PaulB on July 2, 2007 at 5:46 PM | PERMALINK

Most Americans are aware how the Supreme Court and the Bush DoJ is guaranteeing Republican election victories. 2006 was a fluke. The electorate simply didn't believe the bushshit for once.
Posted by: Mike

The front page of this Washington Monthly website had an article about how Bob Schrum (sp?) lost the last two Presidential elections for the dems. I guess they're not as smart as the rest of the Americans.

Posted by: RSM on July 2, 2007 at 6:01 PM | PERMALINK

Egbert and Rogers remind me of the cowardice so prevalent in the Republican party and circles of conservatives:

1. The first goal of terrorism is to cause maximum disruption to the lives of its targets for a minimum investment of time, money and lives. Al Quaeda has been wildly successful at this goal in large part to the blind, pants wetting fear exhibited by people like Rogers and Egbert. These are the cowards who pretend to show strength and courage in the face of omniscient and omnipotent enemy. But lets face it, Al Quaeda was a small time operation that had one significant success. That success should have been its end. It had turned the entire world against it because of the brutality of its 9/11 attack. Even the muslim world was shocked. A full out attack on Afghanistan and Al Quaeda would have finished the orgainizatio. However, the guttless fear of those who saw enemies where there were none caused the withdrawl of our forces before the job was done.

2. The second goal of terrorism is to cause the enemy to over react and swell its ranks. The US attack on Iraq, its advocacy of extra-legal interrogation methods and other such misdeeds have grown the enemy.

3. The third goal of terrorism is to destroy the quality of life of its victims by causing the victim to give up liberty for tyrrany in the name of being safe. Patriot Act ect.

Posted by: JMOHR on July 2, 2007 at 6:09 PM | PERMALINK

This article, by Christopher Hitchens, is absolutely excellent.

Posted by: cld on July 2, 2007 at 6:23 PM | PERMALINK

rnc wrote: "I suspect that most people capable of raising real arguments here left in disgust a long time ago."

Dear little Normy, in an indignant huff, wrote: "Pardon me, dumbass--but I haven't gone anywhere."

Q.E.D.

Thanks. You saved me the trouble of saying it.

Posted by: rnc on July 2, 2007 at 6:58 PM | PERMALINK

This article, by Christopher Hitchens, is absolutely excellent.

Nothing new there. Hitchie's SOP is to try to drive a wedge between various disenfranchised groups by pretending to side with one while bashing the other. The man is a sexist, racist pig.

Posted by: Disputo on July 2, 2007 at 10:12 PM | PERMALINK

rsm: I guess they're not as smart as the rest of the Americans.


Newsweek
Updated: 10:46 a.m. ET Jan 27, 2007

...more than half the country (58 percent) say they wish the Bush presidency were simply over.

of course its higher now...

who is the "smart" one again?

Posted by: mr. irony on July 3, 2007 at 4:15 PM | PERMALINK
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