Only a fool or a fraud sentimentalizes the merciless reality of war

So which one is Bush?

Only a fool and/or a fraud sentimentalizes the merciless reality of war

there, fixed it

"There will be more wars."

The nice thing is that fucking no one -- not even "above it all" Obama -- will call him out on his hypocrisy.

Bomb bomb bomb, bomb bomb Iran.

I seem to remember a Republican candidate in 2000 who spoke of the need for "humility" in our foreign policy. How's that workin' out?

Chicago Tribune headline this a.m. "McCain Tacks to Center."

They never disappoint.

Words are cheap, Senator McCain.

Kevin, you should also mention that this speech is a total retread of a 2001 McCain column.

"Only a fool or a fraud sentimentalizes the merciless reality of war" John McCain 2008

"We will win this conflict. We will win it easily" John McCain Jan 22, 2003

don't believe a word of it. The man is a bigger warmongerer than Bush.

That "major foreign policy speech" McCain gave yesterday, where he was trying to drum up support for a war that a grand total of nine clinically insane people believe is a worthwhile venture? Yeah. It is a reprise of a speech he gave in 2001 to pump up support for the "war on terror." If it is 2008 and you are running 1996's campaign; cribbing from a 2001 speech is actually progress. Isn't it?

Ok, I'm-a gonna do it:

"Straight Talk!!"

But remember, HRC loooves McCain and seems to trust him and his lifetime of experience.

Kevin, get with the program.

The aerial naval nihilist has been looking at some domestic polls. More war and more defaults is not resonating.

Well, I'm convinced.

Gee, I don't know how I couldn't have seen it before. This guy is a peacenik!

Happened to listen to Rush Limbaugh yesterday. He agrees with Kevin that the speech was quite liberal. However, Rush thinks it's McCain's actual views, not pandering. Of course, Rush didn't like those views, which he compared to Kerry's so-called "global test."

Only a fool or a fraud sentimentalizes the merciless reality of war ...

--John McCain, March 2008

Really?

I must say, I'm a little envious. If I were slightly younger and not employed here, I think it would be a fantastic experience to be on the front lines of helping this young democracy succeed. It must be exciting for you ... in some ways romantic, in some ways, you know, confronting danger.

-- George Bush, March 2008

But yet ... McCain loves him some Bush.

Too bad the media will never call him out on his mass stupidity and speech recycling.

McCain deserves a big box of chocolates for being such a sweety.

*just kidding*

Happened to listen to Rush Limbaugh yesterday.

Did you? How about that?

I always feel uncomfortable listening to ex-liberal on the topic of war, what with his many deferments to get out of going to Vietnam and all.

two remarkable things in john mc cain's speech that are getting very little notice

he sees "a transcendental threat" (greater than anything: health insurance, education, economy, energy, global warming, transportation infrastructure, competence of federal government, etc)

he wants to form a new organization - a new coalition of the "willing" - to go around the un -to deal with the threat - sort of like the marvel comic book league of justice

talk about "politics of fear" - he seems to want to supercharge the bush/rove use of fear

does the lack of attention mean that you and the press don't take what he says seriously?

by the way, pennsylvania primary is coming soon and coincidentaly homeland security has decided to "randomly" put armed guards on railroad platforms as a public safety measure

as i boarded the train yesterday i saw two huge heavily armed guys standing on the platform scanning the crowd

guess they were assessing the threat

Swan, you're an hour late for your meds. Chop chop, or no Candyland and Chutes and Ladders for you this afternoon.

How will MC, HRC and the big O be able to compete on this basis since Mc seems to be appealing to only democrats. I don't think any slobbering right wingers will be able to stomach Mc's retoric.

Kevin is a very interesting and honest commentator, but I think from his privileged life he might reconsider mocking and doubting the sincerity of a guy tortured and held as a prisoner of war for five years, when McCain speaks of the evils of war. Kevin is normally much better than that.

Kevin is a very interesting and honest commentator, but I think from his privileged life he might reconsider mocking and doubting the sincerity of a guy tortured and held as a prisoner of war for five years,

McCain was never tortured. He was merely aggressively interrogated....

Well...there is that little matter of the 'Missle Defense System', but otherwise he's obviously everyone's cuddly old Uncle Johnny!!!

a guy

You left out obedient bomber of people.

"but I think from his privileged life he might reconsider mocking and doubting the sincerity of a guy tortured and held as a prisoner of war for five years, when McCain speaks of the evils of war."

When those pronouncements are in direct contradiction with McCain's other pronouncements, are recycled from a seven-year-old op-ed, are in direct contradiction with McCain's views on Iraq and Iran, are in direct contradiction with McCain's voting record, then both mockery and doubt are fully justified.

Apparently the pandering for the independent vote has now started in earnest.

Absolutely, and I thought the Clintons were the master triangulators, and Romney was such a flip-flopper. Wow, McCain takes the cake. He's got the worst integrity and is the least trustworthy of any of the candidates that have been running for the past year.

"does the lack of attention mean that you and the press don't take what he says seriously?"

That's pretty much correct, I think. And it goes back to Kevin's prior post on McCain's "cred". He gets away with contradictory drivel like this and his other pronouncements because the press a) give him "foreign policy cred" and b) assume that he doesn't really mean it so they don't bother reporting it.

For decades in the greater Middle East, we had a strategy of relying on autocrats to provide order and stability....

What does this fool mean "had"? We continue to have such a policy -- or has he never heard of, say, Egypt, Kuwait or Saudi Arabia?

Isn't pandering illegal?

Happened to listen to Rush Limbaugh yesterday. He agrees with Kevin that the speech was quite liberal. However, Rush thinks it's McCain's actual views, not pandering. Of course, Rush didn't like those views, which he compared to Kerry's so-called "global test."

Saying "ditto" is not making a point. It's a reflex, not a thought process. It's the idiot's way of saying, "If I were capable of coming up with an idea of my own, I'd like it to be that one."

Let's remember this in November: This was the guy who claims that Democrats want the U.S. to surrender to al Qaeda. McCain is the perfect Roveian cameleon. He will say whatever lies help him get into the White House.

When my boy Kucinich says stuff like that, everybody looks at him like he's got three heads or something.

When my boy Kucinich says stuff like that, everybody looks at him like he's got three heads or something.

Well yes -- when a Democrat says it, it's a sign that he or she is a dangerous hippie unconnnected to reality, who wants to braid flowers into our enemies' hair. When a Republican says it, it's a welcome sign of bipartisan moderation and a sign that he's a mature adult willing to reach across the aisle and compromise. Hey, I didn't make these rules, but they're the ones we live by.

I'm surprised no one here has broke in with the latest sign that "the Surge™ is working!" The official spokesman for the Baghdad Security Plan was kidnapped today. His bodyguards were killed and his house was burned. Pardon the blogwhoring, but the few details I have located are here.

"I will establish the goal of eradicating malaria on the continent....We do not need all the weapons currently in our arsenal. The United States should lead a global effort at nuclear disarmament....Our goal must be to win the "hearts and minds" of the vast majority of moderate Muslims....scholarships will be far more important than smart bombs...."

...and buy the world a Coke®!

McCain has irreparable physical damage to his body due to the torture he endured for 5 years -

Torture? No, no, it was merely "abuse" and, perhaps, if we're feeling hysterical, "enhanced interrogation techniques".....

Anon: Isn't pandering illegal?
Only if there's sex involved. Bombing and war, we're cool with.

McCain was never tortured. He was merely aggressively interrogated....

Hey! I thought it was essentially sophomoric, frat boy hijinx... that's what the rightards have been telling me.

You aren't seriously comparing water-boarding to what the Vietcong did to McCain are you?

Okay, I'll bite. These practices are *exactly* the same, in so far as they're both banned by the Geneva Conventions. If you want to pretend that there's a difference in degree, rather than in kind, then let's talk about the degree to which a CIA officer tortured Manadel al-Jamadi:

(al-Jamadi's) head had been covered with a plastic bag, and he was shackled in a crucifixion-like pose that inhibited his ability to breathe; according to forensic pathologists who have examined the case, he asphyxiated.

And there are about a half-dozen more examples of "interrogation"-related deaths of detainees while in CIA custody in Afghanistan & Iraq. So, yes, the comparison is perfectly appropriate. The Vietcong wanted information out of McCain, and they put the screws to him to get it. There is absolutely no difference between what they did to him and what we've been doing with high-value detainees since 9/11 -- except that the Vietcong wouldn't have any problem calling it what it is.

Now you may commence with your doublethink and explain to us all why it's good & necessary when we do it, but it's horribly evil when it's done to us.

Pants on fire, Mac!

ex-liberal on March 27, 2008 at 1:35 PM:

Happened to listen to Rush Limbaugh yesterday.

Well, there's a shocker.

Drum: Apparently the pandering for the independent vote has now started in earnest.

Yet another shocker. Apparently McCain, after locking in the Hagee, Podoretz, and Limbaugh votes, figured out that he can't win the general election without pulling moderate voters as well as some of the voters on the 'looney left'...

I mean, all of the folks who swore not to vote for the eventual Dem candidate if their Dem candidate didn't win the nomination gotta go somewhere, right?

All independents don't get weepy over Obama's teleprompter reading, so a lot is in play.

Don't expect most moderates to vote for Obama, though. Between his big mouth wife and his big mouth preacher, he is already in the hole and the standard Repub attacks and dirty tricks haven't even started yet.

Between his big mouth wife and his big mouth preacher, he is already in the hole ...

Um ... no, he's not.

But thanks for trying.

Hey! I thought it was essentially sophomoric, frat boy hijinx... that's what the rightards have been telling me.

Exactly. Exactly my point! This is no different than what happens at the Skull and Bones initiation and we're going to ruin people's lives over it and we're going to hamper North Vietnam's military effort, and then we are going to really hammer them because they had a good time? You know, these people were being fired at every day by American bombers. I'm talking about people having a good time, these people, you ever heard of emotional release? You ever heard of need to blow some steam off?

http://mediamatters.org/items/200405050003

And there are about a half-dozen more examples of "interrogation"-related deaths of detainees while in CIA custody in Afghanistan & Iraq.

Actually, according to Defense Department records there are at least 150 such cases of prisoners who have been tortur...excuse me, aggressively interrogated to death in American custody.

Dood on March 27, 2008 at 3:37 PM:

..the standard Repub attacks and dirty tricks haven't even started yet.

They haven't? I guess I imagined that whole 'Obama-is-a-Muslim' stuff.

TOTAL.MAVERICK!

Actually, according to Defense Department records there are at least 150 such cases of prisoners who have been tortur...excuse me, aggressively interrogated to death in American custody.

You aren't seriously comparing a few bad apples to what the Vietcong did to McCain are you?

ex-liberal: ...happened to listen to Rush Limbaugh...

This reminds of the Simpsons episode where the following occurs:

Bart: OK, but on my way, I'm going to be doing this: [windmills arms]
If you get hit, it's your own fault.
Lisa: OK, then I'm going to start kicking air like this. [kicks] And
if any part of you should fill that air, [kicks] it's _your_ own
fault.
[they walk towards each other, then start fighting]
Marge: Oh, I better go check that out. Now Homer, don't you eat this
pie!
Homer: OK...[Marge leaves] All right, pie, I'm just going to do this.
[chomps air] And if you get eaten, it's your own fault!
[walks towards pie, chomping air, and hits head on range head]
Ow! Oh, my -- aw, to hell with this. [grabs pie, eats it]

Just "happened" to listen to Rush Limbaugh, huh? Wouldn't it have been easier to just go ahead and jam pencils in your ears?

You aren't seriously comparing a few bad apples to what the Vietcong did to McCain are you?

Of course not. Nobody murdered McCain.

If John McCain thought the torture he suffered was so terrible, he wouldn't be endorsing it now. Clearly he believes it was character-building for him and just a way for those stressed-out VCs to have a good time, let off a little steam. Everybody has to get their ya-yas out every now and then. No hard feelings!

Of course not. Nobody murdered McCain.

Just his soul.

This is a very minor pedantic note, but whatever was done to McCain wasn't done by the Viet Cong, who were down south fighting. The North Vietnamese Army was a separate organization at the time.

This is a very minor pedantic note...

Pedantry welcome here.

McCain was never tortured. Enhanced interrogatation techniques may have been used by the North Vietnamese Army. What's the matter with that?

shortstop: just a way for those stressed-out VCs to have a good time

Now I'm really confused. I thought Venture Capitalists liked Republicans.

I would go to cash or gold b/4 the elections. all of these people scare me.

Guess my message got thru--sorry.

I defy anyone to point to one stinkin' vote McCain has made in his long illustrious straight-talkin' career that supports even one of the positions he just espoused in this speech.

LIIIIIIIIAAAAAAARRRRRRRRRRR.

Does McPain still believe we can win Vietnam?

who says there are only three choices?

a fourth is

get the hell out of there!

when?

tomorrow (my preference)

next month

next year

next decade

next time the economy tanks,

uh oh.