You may now let your imaginations run wild.

Okay...
Imagine 2008 and beyond.
Imagine no Bushies no Clintonistas...
No Roves. No Cheneys.
No Ickes. No Penns.
No blowjobs and no snowjobs.

Imagine a country clear of the shit that is Bush/Clinton/Clinton/Bush/Bush.

I think he said that he would like to get together with Lisa DePaulo and Hillary Clinton in a threesome.

Can we all agree not to call Karl Rove "the architect" of Bush's victories during this discussion. As a real architect, I am sickened by how people have damaged this noble profession by attaching that term to Karl Rove's sorry name.

Look, this is not a big secret, not as many years as we are into an era when the business of the permanent campaign has come to dominate the business of government. The truth is that most campaign professionals think of themselves, on some level, as "policy geeks."

The closer they are to the candidate, the more this is liable to be true. It is by being able to pose as a "policy geek" that a campaign professional is able to stake a claim to have an office in the White House after the election (and big paydays via the media that covers campaigns after that -- see, for example, Carville, Begala, and Stephanopoulus from the last administration). Rove is exceptional in degree -- he was closer to Bush than most campaign aides are, Bush was more preoccupied by campaign mechanics and less interested in policy than most Presidents are, and so forth -- but not in kind.

Here's what Karl said:

Yes, I respect Hillary more than Obama and Hillary would make a tougher candidate than Obama if she were elected. In fact, Republicans are looking forward to a campaign against Barack Hussein Obama (don't you like how I used his full name for effect (laughter)). In fact, we liked our odds against Obama even before the whole Wright issue. The Wright stuff is just a gold mine!!!!

Obama doesn't have the experience to be President and Republicans will exploit this lack of experience and other issues if he's the Democratic nominee. It'll be lots of fun, (laughter).....

Actually, Stephanopoulos DID serve in the Clinton White House, and then went on to his fame(?) and fortune. Carville and Begala, on the other hand DID NOT serve in the White House (or on any public payroll). They actually made a conscious decision about this, recognizing who and what they were about themselves. Love 'em or hate 'em, they deserve credit for not going on the "public dole," unlike Rove.

Rove said, "I'm an evil little maggot, a smear on humankind. The festering pussball where my heart should be has only hate for good people like Clinton and Obama, so none but the cursed should listen to a single fucking word that spews out of my putrid maw."

Obviously.

Karl Rove, comedian.

Rove, Yoo and the rest of the Cheney/Bush team--The Torture R Us Crowd-- need to get their wings clipped, come down to earth and ask for forgiveness.

Not interested in reading this interview...The only thing I'm interested in hearing from Rove is an admission of guilt in a court of law.

Please don't go off the record.

Off the record... [Yeah, it's good. Sorry.]

That's some pathetic journalism on the part of Lisa DePaulo and GQ. Going off the record is supposed to be a matter of mutual agreement between the journalist and the source. She clearly did not give her consent (quite the opposite in fact). Therefore, Rove's comments should be considered on the record and GQ should publish them.

Um... he likes to dress up like Hillary when he's alone? And he's wearing nylon hose right now?

I agree with Crust. What's with this "Please don't go off the record." crap?

Shorter Karl Rove (I hate these cutesy locutions but all y'all bloggers do it): "I'm a smash and destroy libruls geek. I like to do everything from a maim and harm other people perspective. I'll lie, I'll produce false documents, I'll use government only to help Republicans and hurt democrats. Whatever it takes."

Whatever KKKarl Rove said, believe the opposite. He is a purely political animal, and nothing permeates his being more than running a campaign. If he says he respects HRC more than Obama it means he's scared to death of Barack.

Off the record, he questioned why anybody would care about his judgement, since he thought Bush might be a competent President.

You may now let your imaginations run wild.

I'm trying to imagine why anybody gives two shits what Karl Rove has to say about anything -- particularly about Democratic (or democratic, for that matter) politics.

"Being able to dig in deeply and, you know, learn about something, ask questions, listen to smart people, and form a judgment about something that was from a policy perspective."

This is eerily similar to how Bush describes about how he likes to talk about going about the business of making tough decisions, with all those general phrases about doing hard work and listening to people and relying on sound science, etc...

And he never actually says anything specific or useful, most likely because Bush is half-asleep during policy meetings. I doubt Rove could even be bothered to attend those meetings.

Please don't go off the record.
Off the record...I'm a stupid-face.

So if you're an unknown policy geek and you call Hillary a monster then journalistic ethics demand you can't go off the record in the middle of an interview. But if you're a slimeball like Karl Rove, journalistic ethics are whatever he demands.

Remind the judge of that next time you guys are in court and some judge wants to know your source.

I don't care who Karl Rove respects.

My imagination has much better things to do.

It can't be off the record since she just finished explicitly telling him not to go off the record. Oh well, that's journalamalism for ya.

Off the record, he told GQ that he's a consultant to the Clinton campaign.

I thought it was obvious.

That's a good doggy! Here's a treat.

Crap. Brautigan beat me to the punch.

And I'm in philosophy for the money.

There is a very warm corner of Hell waiting for Karl Rove.

So she's looking at an asshole and is surprised when a turd comes out?

He admires Hillary because she is ruthless in pursuit of her political goal. Just like him. Fair play, truth, even the law all not relevant. As long as you win.

He said: "I shed a little tear of pride when Hillary demonstrates how much she has learned from me about the politics of mud-slinging, and how quickly the voters forget it when you lie about something that has nothing to do with sex. I think of her campaign as my political legacy, since obviously Bush's presidency is going stink up the pages of history books as though its narrative were printed on pieces of used toilet paper."

Off the record: "I never tell the truth when I'm on the record, why would you believe me off the record."

"I'm trying to imagine why anybody gives two shits what Karl Rove has to say about anything -- particularly about Democratic (or democratic, for that matter) politics." - junebug

Actually any democrat who want to win the GE should give two shits about what Rove has to say.
He gave a lot of clues in this interview about what either dem candidate will have to look out for.

You need to read his remarks dispationately - as if you were studying the opposing teams playbook.

I'm just relieved Karl had time before leaving the White House to oversee the successful rebuilding of New Orleans. Oh ... uh ... nevermind.

The Smearchitect

Hansen, this has something to do with the documented dishonesty and disingenuousness of the Bush administration. Reap what you sow.

I'm fine with the juicy off-the-record stuff being off the record for now, and as long as it's closely held.

What I object to is when a good chunk of the Washington press corps knows important things, but keeps them a secret from the rest of the country.

So when reporters who don't know Lisa DePaulo know what Rove said to her, I'd say it's time to let the public in on the secret.

John Hansen on April 2, 2008 at 4:53 PM

One of the most irritating things...is the inability to believe the sincerity of people they disagree with.

Oh, I believe you are sincere when you say that, John. Now can I disagree with you?

I have no problem thinking that Karl's preferred policy to politics.

Well, there's a shocker.

He probably is just not the cookie cut devil you people think him to be.

Mmmm...Cookies...

Anyway, Rove's got too much bad history to take him at his word; his past has been a good indicator of his present and future performance.

Learning to respectfully talk with your opponents is a big step toward wisdom.

So is knowing that respect is earned, not assumed, John Hansen.

Gee Hansen, which face would that be? I never met a conservative with fewer than two.

Apparently the moderator has tired of banality and conservative whining. Hansen's plea to call a wahmbulance has vanished into the ether.

I think Karl's enjoying the Obama campaign much more. Obama's "New Hope" thingy has the whole "Who would you rather have a beer with?" element.

Tina Brown's Mar. 17th Newsweek story put it all in perspective with culturally youthful pronouns: "Hillary exudes a painful mix of.. embarrasing mom and annoying high school over-achiever."

In my day, it would have been ".. a mix of mom and high school over-achiever." But I can't write.

And I'm not cool.

Actually any democrat who want to win the GE should give two shits about what Rove has to say.

Or not. His last task of any significance when he was in the White House was overseeing strategy for the 2006 elections -- which he managed to flush down the toilet.

He gave a lot of clues in this interview about what either dem candidate will have to look out for.

And the Democrat who's reading men's fashion magazines for insight into how to win in November is a hopeless case. Rove's message is simple -- appeal to the reptilian brain by scaring the shit out of the electorate & turning out the party faithful. If the interview reveals anything, it's that he's graduated to an attempt to portray Democrats as elitists. Novel, that. If he's capable of strategic electoral thought beyond those issues anymore, he certainly isn't going to be sharing it with the readership of GQ.

Ok, first I was intrigued,...then I remembered he's just a slimy little punk who will even lie about the vote on the Iraq war, saying Democrats rushed it and St. George wanted to wait.

So screw him. He probably thinks trashing Obama's wife and preacher is the biggest giggle in the world. Whatever he says is calculated to the nth degree.

..and if he said he respected Obama, I'd might start to worry about something I missed. So..

What I've most enjoyed about my job was the substantive policy discussions.

Yeah, that's a load of crap. But according the Ron Suskind's Esquire article ("Why are these men laughing?"), since Rove knew the difference between Medicare and Medicaid, he qualified as a super genius on policy issues in the Bush White House.

Just curious why my comment at
John Hansen on April 2, 2008 at 4:53 PM
was cut.

"Look, I'm a policy geek. What I've most enjoyed about my job was the substantive policy discussions. Being able to dig in deeply and, you know, learn about something, ask questions, listen to smart people, and form a judgment about something that was from a policy perspective."

The only thing "substantive" in that bureaucratese is the word, "substantive." So far, all the Republicans I have worked for in my 30-year Fed Govt career just put buzz words with no substance whatsoever. That is an empty sentence from a very empty suit. This man should be tarred and featherd and run out of town.

Mazurka -

It really pains me that such a partisan person has been in the Fed Govt for 30 years. Do you really mean you can not understand the Republican position? This says more about you than it does your opponents.

Do you really mean you can not understand the Republican position?

Non-Republican postion == partisan.

Did Jeralyn at TalkLeft quote Rove on this too?

I'm hoping Siegelman is the snare that finally traps Rove.

Something will because the universe always regulates up to justice.

What's the biggest misconception

Yes, I'd like someone to ask that question about the Republican Party these days. What is free enterprise if under Repug control, the Repugs do way with regulation, thus making giant, conglomerate companies that have NO competition.

Lets talk big oil.

Yes, I know that it’s an over-heated discussion that nobody wants to discuss, but does anyone really know a bit about the history of oil, or for that matter, oil rich communities and regions?

It used to be that not long ago, oil companies were not the giant conglomerate corporations they are now due to big oil companies buying up everything in the same way that Coke and Pepsi bought up all soft-drink companies such as Dr. Pepper and Sprite. Indeed there were many drilling companies and those little companies were very community based oriented people, completely Christian in their dealings with employees, as my whole family has worked in one way or another for varios oil companies since before the mid 1950's and beyond.

I’ve always known that oil was a mining operation but oil was different that coal mining and steel mining in that the old style Republican, Christian philosophy NEVER would even consider the cheating of their employees, at least not like they do now-a-days. Oil companies of old never needed labor unions based entirely on the companies complete fairness and consideration for people that worked for them. Loyalty was not merely something employees gave their company but something employers gave their employees too.

I know, because my folks have always, one way or another been employed by oil industry people who had these very kinds of beliefs – you didn’t fuck over your employees, at least not like Big Oil does it now-a-days. In the olden days, your family lived in those little two bedroom camp houses, and when the rig moved, you’re little camp-house moved right along with it to the next location. If someone was injured on a rig or killed, the company didn’t write the family off, didn’t consider it simply the family’s misfortune, at least not the way they do now.

It isn't the way it is now. I’m hearing that if you’re unfortunate to be injured on the job, the drilling company grudgingly pays for workers compensation, but then, the injured individual goes back to work after recuperating only to be fired the very next day. This action being a punishment for the employee having filed workers compensation in the first place. I have also heard of how if one person on the team is injured, the whole crew is then fired, which of course is a good way to shut everyone up. It’s as ugly as the stories you read about in the old coal mining days of operation before labor unions become a force to be reckoned with, and business of oil drilling has become really ugly now, and truly symbolic of the transformation of the Republican Party and what it means under the Karl Rove transition. I don't even recognizance the party anymore. Republicans have indeed, become the nastiest people on the face of this earth anymore. They have none of the old values, don't care about the elderly, and don't care about wounded veterans, or even fair deals.

In fact, supporting "the troops" has become a little yellow bumper-sticker you put on your car, but anything else for injured vets is simply entitlement programs the repugs hate, and veterans of wars are entitled to nothing according to todays Repug.

You need to read his remarks dispationately - as if you were studying the opposing teams playbook.

That's so cute. It's almost like you believe he tells people what he's really thinking. Are you new to the U.S.?

No AJ

I don't believe Non-Republican postion == partisan.

Being partisan ( i.e. having an opinion ) is not bad when it is not the dominant reason for your views.

But to totally discount all Republican as non substantive indicates someone who is so partisan that he discounts the intelligence of any person with the opposite point of view. This is the kind of extreme partisanship which does not foster healthy debate. Its a very immature attitude. That's what I mean by partisan.

Hansen: Republicans have not been worthy of a second thought by thinking people for some time. I am thinking maybe it was the gay marriage abortion flag burning tort reform racism big oil big pharma starve the poor Wal-Mart wage outsource everything platform. Und Reichsmarschall Karl Rove.

That anyone in the press would still give this slimeball the benefit of an off-the-record promise tells you all about what's wrong with the chickenshits who pretend to be "reporters." We need some like the Scot who published what that Obama campaign advisor said after she asked for an off-the-record comment.

Click here for the story that may and probably, should end Hillary Clinton’s political career.

TCD: That stuff has been well covered in freeper land for over a decade. Zeifman's a crazy man who thinks Ted Kennedy has bugged his underwear.

Tina Brown's Mar. 17th Newsweek story put it all in perspective with culturally youthful pronouns: "Hillary exudes a painful mix of.. embarrasing mom and annoying high school over-achiever."

These are youthful adjectives, not pronouns (to channel Mrs. Clinton), but the description is on the nose. One of the reasons she won't win the presidency is that her persona is so unpleasant as well as fake.