"This is a guy who lived in one house for five and a half years — in prison."

Let's leave his first marriage out of this.

"This is a guy who lived in one house for five and a half years — in prison."

By any chance was he tortured during this period?

Yeah, they jumped the shark with this one. I think this gives the comedians license to start hitting him on this once sacrosanct subject, and as silly as it sounds, I think the comedians will end up doing more damage to McCain than any of the Obama surrogates.

A preview of President McCain's 1st SOTU:

"My friends, some among you complain that unemployment is higher, that foreclosures have risen, and that inflation is out of control. Now, I don't know a lot about this economics stuff. However, let me assure you that Treasury Secretary Gramm says that this stuff is all in your heads, and you need to stop being a nation of whiners. At any rate, you still have it better than I did in the freakin' Hanoi Hilton. I was a POW! So STFU. And if you want to save some money, maybe stop plastering on the makeup like trollops, you cunts."

The hilarious thing about this idiotic posting is that five minutes later some poor dope came in and said Kevin is never "nasty, sloppy, or injudicious"!

Why can't we just say it?

Is McCain just pretending to have Alzheimer????? And if so, and McCain is feigning Dementia, why is the press and media simply giving McCain a free pass on this most serious mental condition?

Why not just say the OBVIOUS? We are so use to given Republicans a free pass on this crap but NO MORE. McCain can't keep Americans safe if he seriously can't remember how many houses he has.

It's not really hilarious when you think about it. McCain is always saying Obama can't be Commander and Chief but if McCain has Dementia, than McCain certainly isn't qualified for the office of the president of US.

Its interesting that this is the issue (of them all) that the msm can sink its teeth into. Maybe they figure its a topic that ma and pa can understand. Break out the popcorn.

If the unthinkable happens and McCain wins in November, I hope he can run the country better than he could fly a Navy jet.

Deja vu all over again.

McCain used almost the exact same line early in his career against charges of being a carpetbagger. Huh. Both times about living accomodations & both times a complete non-sequiter.

All part of McCain's long history of not mentioning his POW experience, I guess.

I hope he can run the country better than he could fly a Navy jet.

Start drawing crosses in the dirt, folks.

Its interesting that this is the issue (of them all) that the msm can sink its teeth into. Maybe they figure its a topic that ma and pa can understand. Break out the popcorn.

That's exactly what they think. God forbid that anyone should ever analyze McCain's policy statements for the pure crap they are. It takes something short and stunning like this to get some slack-jawed people's attention and help them focus their vacant gaze. Well, whatever--it's working.

I think this gives the comedians license to start hitting him on this once sacrosanct subject, and as silly as it sounds, I think the comedians will end up doing more damage to McCain than any of the Obama surrogates.

Defginitely - if it is still an issue when the late night shows return after the Olympics hiatus.

I suspect Stewart and Colbert will have a field day with this whacked-out prison reference. Why are they always on vacation at these moments?!

I think the comedians will end up doing more damage to McCain than any of the Obama surrogates.

Earth to Barry: Hire some of John Stewart's writers and use the material every day.

Yes, I'm equally impressed by the Doughy Pantload's brilliant smack down:

My point is that wealth – i.e. being a member of the economic elite – doesn’t hurt you politically the same way that being a perceived member of a the cultural elite does. There was a time when there really was a rightwing cultural elite that could be described as "the rich." The old money crowd of blue bloods, fat cats and the like had a powerful cultural presence, often fueled by anti-British sentiment. But those days are largely over, thanks largely to the democraticization of wealth and also in part to the cultural implosion of the old aristocracy of wealth.

Where to begin? The democratization of wealth? So many gajillions of pathways from which middle- & under-class folks can choose to get themselves into the so-many-homes-I-can't-count-them demographic that their biggest obstacle is deciding which one to take?

Or the notion that working people don't mind struggling through a shitty economy while the rich get richer? It's really the swells with advanced degrees, and who eat things like arugula & Swiss chard (don't they grow that close to France?), that infuriate hard-working Americans.

I have no idea how long this story is going to get played, but the conniptions of the right on this one are absolutely hilarious.

By any chance was he tortured during this period?

According to Hitchens, yes. According to Cheney, no.

Condi's not sure.

Sounds like a contest. Here's my entry:

Affairs? This is a guy who could only make love to his palm for five and a half years — in prison.

I can see McCain running up to the podium to accept the nomination. Ok maybe not running as such. Then because he's a veteran he states: John McCain reporting for duty.

No wait been done. Instead he states POW McCain reporting for torture.

No wait George Bush says that what was done to McCain wasn't torture after all. It was Enhanced Interrogation Techniques. So wait I got it . McCain runs - no walks but not too all cripply - up to the podium and states: John McCain, who wants ribs! C'mon down to my cabin in Sedona.

The audience swoons, he gets a bounce and all the polls say he beats Obama by 8.

Then McCain grins and hundreds die in the stampede for the exits.

This is really silly.

Does it matter that McCain is rich, and married money? In 2004 I voted for a wealthy man who married money, because I thought he would make a good President. In 2008 I will vote against a wealthy man who married money because I think he'd make a terrible president.

But does the fact that he doesn't carry in his head an inventory of his wealthy wife's real estate holdings matter one damn bit? No, it doesn't.

For the record, I don't own any houses. A large and well-known bank owns a house, and they let me live in it as long as I keep sending them money.

I suspect Stewart and Colbert will have a field day with this whacked-out prison reference. Why are they always on vacation at these moments?!

(Fingers crossed...) Here is hoping their writers are taking copious notes.

For an interesting read Google "McCain+Forrestal" and read the account of what happened on the USS Forrestal when John McCain wet fired his aircraft resulting in an explosion and fire that killed 132 sailors!

But does the fact that he doesn't carry in his head an inventory of his wealthy wife's real estate holdings matter one damn bit? No, it doesn't.

Well, as I said in a thread below I'm not sure that "I'm not responsible because I'm just a penniless gigolo who leaches off his much younger wife's money and doesn't actually earn any of it himself" is really his best defense....

There was an old man who was prone to miscue
He had so many houses, he didn't know what to do.
He said the first thing that came to his head,
And now everyone's voting for Obama instead.

Does it matter that McCain is rich, and married money?

No, because he is against evil. Remember, Kerry was for evil.

I have to say that the McCain campaign's response to the "how many houses does he have?" dustup really has been hilarious.

Well as long as it's only 7-13 houses and not a $400 haircut, windsurfing, or a trip to Hawaii, then whatever. Then we'd know he was an elitist, natch.

if McCain has Dementia, then McCain certainly isn't qualified for the office of the president of US.

Nancy and Laura beg to differ.

tommy harper: that's exactly what I'm talking about.

Any unlucky pilot can get shot down on a combat mission and wind up prisoner of war. Not everyone can fuck up and kill 132 people and get away with it.

Ah, well I remember old Kerry accusing his opponent of elitism at every opportunity. Why, hardly a day went by when he wasn't comparing Georges Walquer Bouche to some Gallic dandy who was rarefied enough to order jus de l'orange at a diner and couldn't bowl like a real man. So it was only just desserts when that swaggering macho man JK got called on his raging hypocrisy.

What's really funny is that his spokesman's statement is untrue. He was actually held captive in at least two different prisons.

This is really silly.

Does it matter that McCain is rich, and married money?

Yes. It matters a great deal when you consider that his economic platform was shaped considerably by a guy who refers to the current economic situation as nothing more than "a mental recession," and to those suffering under that economic situation as "a nation of whiners." It matters a great deal when you consider that the aforementioned economic platform offers more & deeper tax cuts for the wealthy & uber-wealthy, while offering absolute dick to the middle & under-class. And since you seem to have completely missed the irony of anyone with the McCains' financial portfolio referring to anyone else as elitist, let me join the others in pointing that out to you.

Careful you don't pull a muscle with these false equivalencies, thersites.

Kevin and you guys are celebrating too soon. Obama's criticism of McCain for owning multiple houses opened the door for an attack on Obama for his shady real estate deal with convicted felon Rezko to buy Obaman's mansion. Oops!

How dumb was it for Obama and his people not to see this as the result of their silly attack on McCain's houses?

This is really silly.

Well then don't you worry your pretty little head about it. The rest of us realize that the election actually hinges on the opinions of people who are swayed by such silliness.

How dumb was it for Obama

Obama and crew were pretty smart actually, and they rightly figured that any McCain response would be weak and ineffectual. They knew he'd go to the "I Was a POW!" well once too often, and they were right. Funny, for a guy who "doesn't like to talk about it", he sure brings it up a lot.

Rezko? Snicker. Yeah, good luck with that, as your audience's eyes glaze over, wondering what the hell you're talking about.

Sucks being on the losing end of an effective attack, don't it.

Bob,

I appreciate your typical liberal condescending view that "people" are so stupid that they are swayed by stuff like how many houses a candidate for president's wife owns. I'm sure you were enamored with the issue last time when Kerry's wife owned so many houses bought with her dead husband's money.

I'm sure you were enamored with the issue last time when Kerry's wife owned so many houses bought with her dead husband's money.
Posted by: on August 21, 2008 at 11:40 PM

Of course he wasn't ... he's smart enough to vote Dem because Bush was a lying sack of shit!

Stupid, uninformed swing voters, however, were impressed by bullshit like windsurfing and charges of Frenchiness. That's the point.

I dunno. It sounds to me like they were ready for this one. Nice try, though.

K-E-A-T-I-N-G?

or maybe,

R-A-L-P-H R-E-E-D?

This is great. Liberals showing their typical contempt for "stupid, uninformed, swing voters."

Look, as jolly as you are about Obama giving McCain trouble on houses, within a short time you will see how the Rezko aided purchase of Obama's mansion is hurting Obama and you will lament how McCain is unfairly attacking Obama. You might then realize that Obama made a mistake by trumpeting the McCain housing issue.

If McCain really wanted to exploit it, he would ask the simple question of which is more important -- the number of buildings his wife owns or the number of buildings Obama's terrorist friend Ayers blew up. (courtesy of The Corner)

It is somewhat like the foreign trip and Berlin speech that you were giddy about a few weeks ago. It provided the basis for McCain to put the lasting tag of celebrity without accomplishment on Obama.

I saw someone on TV, maybe Rove or Dick Morris, say that Obama should personally be relentlessly positive. It probably would be a good approach. At a minimum, he should avoid stupid attacks like this that set him up for a counter punch far beyond the little value he achieves with his attack on McCain.

Well, I guess I been slapped down and put firmly in my place. But my point was, if McCain wasn't dangerously unqualified to be President, the fact that he's rich wouldn't matter.

Careful you don't pull a muscle with these false equivalencies, thersites.
I beg to differ. There are of course huge differences between Kerry and McSham. The fact that they're both married to wealthy women isn't one of them. How indignant were you when they called Kerry a gigolo? Yeah, me too.

the election actually hinges on the opinions of people who are swayed by such silliness.
You could be right. But if the future of the Republic rides on who's more easily mocked by TV comedians, we're f*cked already. Remember how much fun Letterman and Leno had with Al Gore? Are you still laughing?

Wishful thinking, brian.

***************

Chicago Sun-Times: “Obama Had Not Been Accused Of Any Wrongdoing.� The Chicago Sun-Times reported, “Obama has not been accused of any wrongdoing, but Republicans are already blasting him for his friendship with the now-convicted felon.� [Chicago Sun-Times, 6/6/08]

AP: Obama “Has A Spotless Reputation� And “Has Been Accused Of No Wrongdoing Involving Rezko Or Anything Else.� The AP reported, “Obama, who has a spotless reputation after 11 years in public offices, has been accused of no wrongdoing involving Rezko or anyone else.� [AP, 1/22/08]

Factcheck.org: “There’s No Indication Obama Did Anything Improper.� Factcheck.org was asked “Was Obama’s real estate deal in Illinois really an issue?� Factcheck.org concluded, “Obama has a relationship with Rezko that dates back many years, but there’s no indication Obama did anything improper.� [Factcheck.org, 12/28/07]

Washington Post: “There Have Been No Allegation That Obama…Broke The Law Or Committed Any Ethics Violations.� The Washington Post reported, “There have been no allegations that Obama, whose political fortunes are soaring as he mulls a run for president, broke the law or committed any ethics violations.� [Washington Post, 12/17/06]

New York Times: “There Is Not Sign That Mr. Obama…Did Anything Improper.� “There is no sign that Mr. Obama, who declined to be interviewed for this article, did anything improper.� [New York Times, 6/14/07]

“Nobody’s Been Able To Find Anything That Obama Specifically Has Done Wrong.� Clarence Page of the Chicago Tribune said, “Nobody's been able to find anything that Obama specifically has done wrong.� [NBC News, 4/29/07]

Pittsburgh Tribune-Review: “Obama Did No Wrong.� The Pittsburgh Tribune-Review reported, “Obama did no wrong. But he expressed regret.� [Pittsburgh Tribune Review, 1/14/07]

“No One Is Seriously Accusing Obama Of Any Wrongdoing.� Conor Clarke wrote, “Of course, there's just one problem with the scandal (Baragate? Obamawater?): No one is seriously accusing Obama of any wrongdoing.� [Chicago Sun Times, 12/24/06]

By the way, brian and the rest of you wingnut apologists: No one is criticizing him for having multiple domiciles. We are criticizing him for not knowing how many they own. And we are criticizing him for the callous disregard for average working people when he said people struggling to hang on to their homes should "cancel their vacations" while at the same time, the McCains were buying yet another luxury beach condo.

I appreciate your typical liberal condescending view that "people" are so stupid that they are swayed by stuff like how many houses a candidate for president's wife owns.

How many houses does McCain own? I'm still waiting to hear back from that staff member! I assume it's the same one who is still researching why Viagra gets covered by insurance but contraceptives don't.

Tee hee. Must be nice being in the elite where you don't have to keep track of such things like how many homes you own. I guess Mrs. Buffalo Chip keeps track of that stuff for him, eh?

Liberals blah blah blah

"When you can't deflect, project!"

It's easy to profess love of swing voters when they swing your way, isn't it Bri-Bri. You guys are all about dumbing down the process and assuming voters are stupid when it comes to evoking Paris and Britney, but when someone rightly points out things that McCain himself says, oh the humanity! So unfair!

I admit, it's fun to see you guys sputtering nonsensical for a change.

I admit, it's fun to see you guys sputtering nonsensical for a change.

For a change? Bri-Bri has never sputtered anything but!

But if the future of the Republic rides on who's more easily mocked by TV comedians, we're f*cked already.

Oh, I know we're fucked. And I'm not happy about that, by any means. But I can't deny the reality of the situation. And I can at least hope the fuckedness of it this time results in a better result for the country than the last two presidential elections.

Remember how much fun Letterman and Leno had with Al Gore? Are you still laughing?

Sad to say, it was the unfair media treatment of Al Gore that led to this perspective. I came to understand that our country is in the thrall of the pithy joke - not among the entire electorate, but among the relatively small percentage that ends up deciding these things. And it's not the jokes being told by late-night comedians - it's the jokes being sold to us as news or "analysis" that become the drumbeat from the traditional major networks and news orgs.

It's now a question of who is the butt of the funniest and/or earliest pithy joke. It's a stupid way to pick a President, but frankly, if the Congress did its fucking job, it still wouldn't be as calamitous a situation as it has become.

For a change? Bri-Bri has never sputtered anything but!

A fair point! I guess I can't help being generous even toward my political foes.

So you guys don't think it is a problem when Obama pays a heavily discounted price for his mansion and his convicted felon friend pays full price for a vacant strip of land next door to facilitate the deal?

Yes, there is nothing provable criminal in the deal at this point, and there won't be assuming Rezko does not sing at Obama's expense as his sentencing date draws near, but don't even you guys see at least a bit of suspicious game playing going on?

It was political malpractice for Obama's folks to lunge into this debate about houses and re-open the Rezko deal.

Good column by Kathleen Parker on Obama's problems related to his opposition to the Born Alive Infant Protection Act and his attempts to explain his opposistion. She is a talented thinker and writer, not without some sympathy for Obama. I think she assesses him pretty correctly. Anyone else troubled to the idea of a guy who basically has never ran anything of significance in his life having to make all the decisions of a president?

http://www.realclearpolitics.com/articles/2008/08/obamas_bornalive_problem.html

So you guys don't think it is a problem when Obama pays a heavily discounted price for his mansion and his convicted felon friend pays full price for a vacant strip of land next door to facilitate the deal?

You still don't get this. It's not about real estate investment, it's about being able to count. As long as Obama knows there is one house, one felon, and one strip of land involved, he wins this one.

To settle this, I have a suggestion for a tie-breaker: Let's ask them both how many crooks were in the Keating Five.

Oh dear lord -- Brian, everyone's favorite faux-reasonable Republican concern troll, takes a break from pushing the Rezcko Wingnut Talking Point of the Day to write Kathleen Parker ... is a talented thinker and writer. The mind reels.

Note here the message discipline (and, therefore, lack of critical thinking) of the Republicans...the dishonest Republican blogs -- but I repeat myself -- try desperately to distract from yet another mcLame gaffe with the already-debunked Rezcko reference, and from Fat White Guy to Mike K to brian, they all come here and parrot it.

Haven't you guys learned yet not to believe anything you read on the Republican blogs? Are you so desperate to have your loathsome and discredited worldview validated that you suck up any kind of nonsense from jackasses like the doughy Pantload? Here's a free clue: Anyone who looks at "Liberal Facism" and thinks, "Maybe he has a point", as opposed to collapsing in gales of laughter at a stupid idea poorly executed, should probably check their brain in for a tune-up. Sheesh.

(Oh, and brian? We're showing our showing their typical contempt for dishonest GOP message shills like you. Get bent.)

Rudy Giuliani: Noun, verb, 9/11

John McCain: Noun, verb, POW

What about McCain's cottages?

My favorite response came form the wingnut on Dan Abrams' show, who claimed that mocking McCain for not knowing how many houses he and the missus own was, in fact, an attack on Cindy! After all, she's the one who owns the houses. Yes, that's right. After the POW defense failed to work, McToughy tried to hide behind Cindy's skirts. I guess he's going for the kept man vote.

Without getting into all the other problems with the whole "Rezko real estate scandal" meme, anyone who thinks that paying $1.65 million on a home that had an initial asking price of $1.95 million represents a "deep discount" has no fucking idea how real estate sales work.

Asking prices are never more than an educated guess based on recent sales and trends. In a booming market, a new listing may result in multiple offers and close significantly higher than the asking price. In a depressed market or for expensive homes that have a limited buyer pool, homes may take several months or even years to sell.

The pressure on the seller to take the best offer can be considerable. This is particularly true if the owner still making mortgage payments on an empty house or needs to use the equity for something. Even more so if they are not sure they can get the asking price by waiting, or if their real estate agent is advising them to accept.

Thersites,

It doesn't matter if you are extremely wealthy, if say, you are a Kennedy, as everybody knows being really wealthy is who you are.

If you are John McCain, trying to be an everyday guy, the MAVERICK of the Senate, looking out for the people of this Great Country, the POW who selfishly gave 5 years of his life inprisoned in a foreign land, the man who is going to work for US against the interests of Washington, it matters a lot.

It isn't about the counting, folks. Regular people think about their house everyday. It is where we live, it is our biggest investment, we worry about how it looks and how to take care of it; all the time.

McCain doesn't even know how many houses he owns. He has absolutely no idea what regular people's lives are about. Now everybody knows exactly where he stands. He isn't one of us, he isn't a guy you can go have a beer with, no matter how dumb he acts. He is just a rich guy. And we all know rich guys get rich by screwing the little guy.

We are just getting through with 8 years of being screwed by a rich guy that pretended he was one of us. McCain's only chance in this election is to come across as being different, not being the rich Washington insider completely ignorant of regular people's lives. That charade is dead.

It would work for Donald Trump, or even Arnold Schwartzenegger, but it is killer for John McCain.

Anyone else troubled to the idea of a guy who basically has never ran anything of significance in his life having to make all the decisions of a president?

That does worry me a bit about McCain, yes.

I agree with 'says you' that the real damage this issue does to McCain is to clearly demonstrate that he is completely out of touch with the economic reality most Americans live with.