If Sarah Palin does well at the VP debate (which I certainly expect she will) does that mean that she is now qualified to be the VP and potentially POTUS? Does that mean that we don't need to question John McCain's judgment any more?

I find it hard to believe that a good debate performance can erase the SNL clips, the youtube videos, Troopergate, the other Alaska problems, and her dismal interviews. But I guess that's what the spin game is all about.

She most certainly will be viewed as a "success" in the debate considering expectations are below sea level, at least as far as the pundits are concerned--but I think the public is looking for more than clever evasion and funny quips this time around, with current events as they are.

Substance--Obama has it, Biden has it, Palin doesn't.

I'm mystified as to why the Biden team had Jennifer Granholm playing Palin in rehearsals. It seems much more useful and relevant to have a skilled, intelligent, observant actress - not Tina Fey, with all due respect, but maybe Anna Devere Smith - playing that role for him.

She would have done just fine, except the viewers now have be educated by Tina Fey to see through Sarah's filibusters and superficial quips. The world now demands from Palin a command of substance.

I agree. If the moderator, or Biden, can follow up on her evasivenesses like Couric and Gibson could in interviews, she'll come across as vague and ignorant. Otherwise she'll just seem confident.

Couldn't agree more. I think the debate format will help Palin a lot. She only comes apart when answers can't be scripted and memorized, or if she is pressed with more than one question on a topic. So Republicans wanted and got a limitation on the amount of time she could be questioned on a single topic, and the candidates will each have only 90 seconds to respond to questions, followed by a two-minute period for discussion. Given this format, if the questions are on subjects they've prepped her for, I'm sure she will appear to do fine, which is all it takes to have her defy the lowest expectations. If the moderator asks easy or predictable questions, Palin will walk away unscathed, and McCain and his wingnutosphere are already intimidating Ifill in this regard. On the other hand, I think Biden has to worry that Ifill doesn't Russert his ass with gotchas, since he's the Overdog to be taken down, and she probably will be intimidated; she isn't exactly known to be a friend of liberals, anyway.

With Palin's "I'm Joe-sixpack, just like you" folksy BS I wouldn't be surprised if the media reaction Friday morning is that she once again charmed her way into America's hearts, and by the way, here's a list of the elitist Joe Biden's gaffes and misstatements.

I can see this as the CW and I think a lot of Repubs are hoping that people expect so little she over delivers. But, I think she has crossed a line. A line that Quayle never even came close to. She is viewed so lowly now by non-Repubs, that the evading that many pols do to tough questions will not be allowed for her. If she tells some personal anecdote that would be just charming out of Fred Thompson's (i.e.) mouth 6 months ago, will be perceived as her not knowing the answer.

I also think the people prepping her have no response to the current financial meltdown. This was okay last week, but I would expect Biden to have specifics ready. I think a fishing story will back fire in the face of this economic implosion.

When Palin is in a bind she gets cutsie. When McCain is in a bind he gets Woe-the-poor-POW pathetic. But they're both angry.

That's Just What I Said

Biden should respond to a Palin's filibusters by calmly remarking "I didn't hear an answer to your question from the Governor..." and then proceeding with his own answer.

Whew. Thanks for revisiting the 2006 debates. For a while, I was wondering how my fellow Alaskans could ever have elected the airhead (if you'll pardon the term) on display in the Gibson & Couric interviews. After watching those video clips, you have to wonder, What happened to her???

By the way, if you watch footage of George W. Bush's gubernatorial debates, he seems like a different person from the man who became president. What's going on here?

Once the debate is behind her, it will be interesting to compare her original stump speech with her new one. Over the last month she has had to drop or dial back most of her best stuff. And lately her speeches are more like short intros for McCain and character attacks against Obama, Biden and Democrats.

Sarah Palin ignorant though she is has an uncanny ability to win debates and hearts without using any content whatsoever. Her acceptance speech did just that. It will be wrong to under estimate her in the debate, she may won some poll points back for the Republican ticket. Though McCain seems hell bent on destroying himself by appearing angrier and angrier in each interview. They way he is going he is in danger of exploding one of these days.

I agree with the others who say that empty answers won't be good enough at this point. Even Katie Couric realized she was being fed horseshit and kept repeating the question. It's not enough that Palin form complete sentences. People will be expecting to hear substance from her, even at the level of impressing the know-nothing media. If she can't do that for Charlie Gibson or Katie Couric, I don't think she can do that for the debate.

The expectation at this point is that she's going to avoid the questions and filibuster, which is obviously her strong suit. If she does, I think she'll be judged as the loser of this debate. And another issue, I really think all the pressure is psyching her out and that she's having trouble even answering basic questions at this point. I'm not expecting her to fold, but I do think she'll repeat the same performance we saw with Gibson and Couric. The media smells blood and I don't think she can avoid giving them something to mock her for.

OTOH, it will only take one question where she isn't sure of the scripted response and is forced to ad lib, and she's toast. Biden makes the occassional gaffe, but he doesn't give long answers to quesitons that don't make any sense at all--and that's what happens with Palin.

The Couric interviews remind me of someone(such as myself) who interviews for a job that you know you're not the best qualified for, but you muddle through it and try to explain how your education and experience would apply to the particular job. You know the potential employer isn't buying it, but you have to say something.
Hopefully the voters will be sending Palin a form rejection letter next month.

I don't care how well she does in the debate.

We don't need her trigger finger on the largest nuclear arsenal in the world.

(also I can't stand her voice).

h

"If the moderator...... can follow up on her evasivenesses like Couric and Gibson could..... she'll come across as vague and ignorant."

Posted by: Richard
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Um, I've watched what CBS released and the Gibson interview. In which one did either journalist insist either a substantive, responsive answer be provided to a question or the interview was being terminated? When prefaced with "Specifically" a question never was greeted with specifics. Citations please?
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Couric: When President Bush ran for office, he opposed nation-building. But he has spent, as you know, much of his presidency promoting democracy around the world. What lessons have you learned from Iraq? And how specifically will you try to spread democracy throughout the world?

Palin: Specifically, we will make every effort possible to help spread democracy for those who desire freedom, independence, tolerance, respect for equality. That is the whole goal here in fighting terrorism also. It's not just to keep the people safe, but to be able to usher in democratic values and ideals around this, around the world.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Well, I'm illuminated, how about you?

Palin is going to slip in a few snarky comments towards Biden much like the "I've been seeing his debates since like 2nd grade". Biden has to be ready to bite back because her ability to get these snarky comments across are what makes her appealing to her base. Even if he just calls her on her character attacks and not addressing the issues.

The Fact-Checking Dept. needs to be working overtime. So what if she can be articulate. Can she tell the truth? So far, the answer is no.

Well, the Alaska debate was being watched by, what, 5000 people? Most of whom she knew. And the issues were pretty finite and easy to bone up on; and I'm sure she did a good job boning up on them.

Now we're talking about an audience that's 10,000x larger. All strangers, from parts of the country that may as well be foreign lands. And the issues are more or less infinite. And Palin is probably aware now that she only has a tenuous grasp on most of them.

I wouldn't say she hasn't got a prayer. But a prayer is about all she has.

I watched the primary and regular gubernatorial debates with Sarah. I believe there are three fundamentally different circumstances that will work against her here.

1. She lucked out by having three people in the debates - two rabidly going after each other and Sarah almost serving as a referee. It made her look like the adult. She won't have the cover this time.

2. We know more about Palin than Alaskans did when she ran.

3. She was unemployed for a while before running for governor and spent more time campaigning for governor than she has for VP.

I would assume also that Palin did well in her television interviews when she was running for governor, but that was a very different race from the one she is now. Because she was both a front runner and an outsider, she could get away with answering questions with vague generalities. She also knew far more about Alaska issues than she does about national politics. Finally, I would imagine the Alaska media is more forgiving than the national media.

I know the conventional wisdom is that Palin has lowered her expectations going into the debate, but I am wondering if she has possibly done the opposite. Debate performances like the one she gave during the Alaska gubernatorial race might have been adequate a month ago, but now I wonder if voters are going to be looking for more substance, if they are going to be looking for her to start uttering empty soundbites. Simply being able to speak coherantly may not be enough. Voters may want to see that she actually understands the issues.

I also think the people prepping her have no response to the current financial meltdown.

Even McCain had to change the subject to earmarks because he couldn't discuss the topic--I expect some variation of the the same from Palin.

I'm not buying the "she's a great debater" spin. She's not dumb as a stump, and she may be terrific with a limited set of issues she knows top to bottom, and the format doesn't really allow for probing. But she's still going to have to speak for a very, very long time about issues she has thus far demonstrated little familiarity with. Can she memorize forty-five minutes of BS (more, actually; she's got to be prepared for a huge number of contingencies) and deliver it when cued?

I'm betting that there's going to be at least one episode of rambling nonsense that is immediately identified as such. If that happens, she's toast and her ticket with her. If it doesn't, I still don't see it as a big win--the damage of the Couric interview is probably irreversible at this point.

The big difference between the Alaska debates and this debate -- I hope -- will be that Palin knew something about Alaska issues, but clearly knows squat about most national and all foreign policy issues. I think complete lack of knowledge of the subject matter has been why she's been so awful thus far.

I have been giving a lot of thought to this debate, mostly because everybody thinks Biden should treat her with kid gloves. I think Biden should just answer the questions put to him straight up. He should be respectful, but he should push her on substance. No free pass.

The moderator should treat her with respect by asking straight up questions. She shouldn't be afraid to follow through.

The woman is a professional politician with a degree in journalism. She will do well in a debate.

Right now McCain has a lot of bigger problems to worry about. The biggest is that McCain has squandered his reputation as a truth teller.

This whole format has been nonsense from the start. JFK "won" because Nixon had a 5 o'clock shadow. So, Palin will "win" because she can make jokes and evade questions?

We deserve to be on the ash heap of history.

Okay. Let her answer a question about how much property tax she cut in Wasilla, which seems to be an answer she has memorized well.

Then let Biden ask why she left them with $22 million in debt when they had never been in debt before.

She's nothing more than a fifth grader reciting the names of state capitols. Once you interrupt her flow, she'll either have to start over or will derail.

the key is for Ifill to learn from Couric, who responded to non-specific dodges by asking for the "pros and cons" of an approach. analysis is hard to pre-script, and it is something Palin does not do well. do the exact opposite of the gotcha/trivial pursuit stuff - talk at an abstract level, ask for analysis, go after the "why" and the "how" instead of the "what" and Palin will be totally lost.

she evaded questions well, she filibustered effectively, and she'd prepared a series of superficial quips that seemed to connect with her audience. If she can do this again tomorrow, Palin will probably do just fine.

Gotta disagree with you, Steve. Right now (mainly because of Couric), the doubts are about her substance. Sure, the rootless, inbred, and confused media will focus on quips, but the public will want some reassurance that we won't have an ignoramus as Vice President. They won't get it, because there is no possible policy question that she could answer with any substance.

But there are a few difference now - in Alaska she was surrounded by her team now she has John's team. That is probably why they flew her husband and team to Arizona. She has only been around McCain's team for 1 month which is not really long enough to build the trust and understanding. We can see from Alaska she would rather choose an old, trusted friend to rely on then someone most aptly suited to the job. This may be why she did so bad in training in PA.

Another big difference is that she seems to have no interest in national issues. With her husband AIP membership there was obviously alot of pro-Alaska talk always going on around her. Also just with her interests she can speak to the fisher/hunter group naturally.

Finally if you notice in the interviews everything going back to Alaska. Even in the debate she has the quip about her daughter Bristol, Bristol Bay and environmental issues. The references are too regional and seem to be her fall-back position. I just do not see these techniques playing as well nationally.

Tomorrow, or today, is as good a day as any to drop this troopergate bomb:

http://progressivealaska.blogspot.com/2008/09/saradise-lost-chapter-ninety-eight.html

An Alaska woman who owns a company that processes workers’ compensation claims in the state has told an independent investigator that she was urged by the office of Gov. Sarah Palin to deny a benefits claim for Palin’s ex brother-in-law, a state trooper who was involved in an ugly divorce and child custody dispute with Palin’s sister, despite evidence that the claim appeared to be legitimate, according to state officials who were briefed about the conversation.

Murlene Wilkes, the proprietor of Harbor Adjusting Services in Anchorage, had originally denied that she was pressured by Gov. Palin’s office to deny state trooper Mike Wooten’s claim for workers compensation benefits.

Nothing like a little scandal to roil the pre-debate pot.
Get back at me on that one, eh Sarah?

she filibustered effectively, and she'd prepared a series of superficial quips that seemed to connect with her audience.

All the qualities I want in a vice president

Here's the deal. When people defend Sarah Palin [even the trolls in these very pages] they don't use examples of policy or ethics or intelligence or experience or worldliness or fairness. They use words like "nice" and "tough" and "ready."

They defend her in the same way she defends herself, by avoiding the legitimate question of her fitness for office, and answering with feel-good words that connect with some people on an emotional level.

During the debate she will win back her base by talking emotionally and getting some zingers off at Joe. That's all any republican wants. "Make me feel like you care and show me you hate democrats as much as I do." That is the republican platform. And it's the only drum she needs to beat.

Joe needs to make easy and constant reference to her lack of substantive answers. He needs to start every answer with "Unlike Sarah, I actually have an answer to your question..." He could even try answering her questions for her with "I think what Sarah is trying to say here is that being governor of Alaska makes you an expert on foreign policy."

Palin will probably try to turn the debate into a shouting match. He should let her rant all she wants.

I thought I'd mention that Palin did well on the questions where she had knowledge: her own accomplishments. On other subjects, not so much.

And she sure has gotten a wowzer of a Fargo accent in a year and a half. If ever there was a manufactured candidate, it's Sarah Palin.

I would bet that she would do fine in the debate. In fact, if she manages to get off a zinger, that might become the entire focus of the media attention afterwards, and she might be declared the debate winner.

However, average viewers may also view her answers more critically and skeptically, given that many viewers are now assuming that she doesn't know what she is talking about.

Also, weren't many, if not all, of the Alaskan debates multicandidate debates? Wouldn't that mean that there was less time for her to respond?

Biden, I think, needs to attack John McCain and George Bush--not so much that he seems harsh or overly critical--but by doing so, he can put her on the defensive.
If he does this, then Palin is in a bind. If she doesn't respond to Biden's attacks on McCain and defend her running mate, then she will seem completely out of it. If she does respond to his attacks on McCain, however, her lack of policy knowledge may become apparent.

Also, I think that Palin has a tough time discussing or defending people who are not herself. I don't know if she really likes John McCain, and she probably doesn't know that much about his record--so putting her in the position of defending him will be psychologically and intellectually difficult for her.

In any case, Biden needs to play it safe--he should not be aggressive towards her, because such a stance would set him up for her to smack him down with a zinger. This zinger would then become the entire focus of the post-debate analysis.

Off topic for this thread, but Obama is giving a whopper of a speech now in Wisconsin and it's the one I have been waiting for..strong, clear and full of values and inspiration!

The woman is a professional politician with a degree in journalism. She will do well in a debate.

Posted by: ron byers on October 1, 2008
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Alaska Governor Sarah Palin, the 2008 Republican Vice Presidential nominee, graduated from the University of Idaho in Moscow, Idaho in 1987 when she was 25 years old. The University of Idaho was the third and fifth institutions of higher learning that the-then Sarah Heath attended in five years after she graduated from high school.
Her college career began in Fall 1982 semester, enrolling as a freshman at the Honolulu-based Hawaii Pacific University, a private college. Hawaii Pacific boasts a diverse student body numbering nearly 9,000 souls from over 100 countries. One of the school's most popular majors is business administration, which Sarah signed up for as a full-time student. However, she attended Hawaii Pacific for only one semester.
Sarah Heath then transferred for the Spring 1983 semester to North Idaho College, a junior college in Coeur d'Alene, Idaho, an area the opposite of Honolulu, Hawaii (the birthplace of 2008 Democratic Presidential nominee Barack Obama) in terms of diversity. Coeur d'Alene is the heart of the white separatist and Christian identity movements that congregated in that part of Idaho in the 1970s and '80s. North Idaho is a comprehensive community college with a student body of over 4,000 students. Matriculating as a general studies major, she spent the Spring 1983 and Fall 1983 at North Idaho.

In June 2008, the North Idaho College Alumni Association announced that it planned to honor Governor Sarah Palin with its Distinguished Alumni of the Year Award for 2008-2009 .

In the Fall of 1984, Sarah Heath Palin transferred to the University of Idaho, which is the premier public college in the Gem State, with a student body approaching 12,000. At the University of Idaho, Sarah majored in journalism with a specialization in broadcast news. She stayed two semesters, Fall 1984 and Spring 1985.

For the Fall 1985 semester, Sarah registered at Matanuska-Susitna College, a junior college in Palmer, Alaska. The colege, which offers two-yer associate of arts degrees, was create din 1958 as Palmer Community College. Five years later, it acquired its new name to signify its location in Matanuska-Susitna Borough, where it is located. The student body numbers approximately 1,650. However, Sarah Palin returned to Idaho State in the Spring 1986, and completed that semester as well as her senior year in the Fall of 1986 and the Spring 1987, when she took her journalism degree.
In an interview with the University of Idaho's alumni magazine, Governor Sarah Palin said it was her love of writing that influenced her decision to study journalism.

"I was always asking everyone the questions, and I still am today," Palin said. She did not work on university's student newspaper, so there is no written record of her writing. Neither did she participate with the university's student-run television station. After graduating from Idaho, she worked briefly on commercial TV station KTUU in Anchorage, Alaska, where she covered sports.
Courtesy: http://www.associatedcontent.com/article/1016160/what_college_did_sarah_palin_graduate.html?page=2&cat=4
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Yes Ron, a real titan in the world of journalism. Wheezed across the finish line in college. No written record of any of her works. Read the high school sports scores on camera for a small Alaska TV station. Got distracted and decided the world of beauty pageants was more interesting. McCain wants her to have nuclear launch codes. This isn't a tin foil hat I'm wearing, there really is LSD in the drinking water.

By the way, if you watch footage of George W. Bush's gubernatorial debates, he seems like a different person from the man who became president. What's going on here? Posted by: Grumpy

What's different here? How about the stakes are about a thousand times higher being elected VP of the U.S. than the governor of Alaska, essentially a welfare state with more wildlife than people. The mayor of Seattle has greater responsibility than the governor of Alaska.

She will get her ass handed to her because she knows that while Gwen Ifil will do her best to toss everything to her underhand, she'll still have to deal with Biden, who will expect a bit more detail than Ifil will be content with.

A GREAT DEBATER -- OR EVADER?

With her lack of knowledge, Palin is Dearth Evader.

That's Just What I Said

She has more substance than I thought; but lampwick, biobrain , Mike B and Tom C all have good points. I think she's in over her head and she knows it. It maybe explains why she has been performing extra miserably in recent interviews. She is a great cheerleader and the events she attends are perfect for her, but with a silent audience, she will not have the reiforcement crowd cheering her on when she makes stabs or general "we rock and we're going to win!!" stuff. She will crack under pressure the first time she trips up and it just may spiral down after that.

I know this is rude to say but I wish she would just shut up already, you know? I've heard enough..

A lot will depend on how deferential Ifill is to her. As some have already mentioned, the right is coming down hard on Ifill for her supposed pro-Obama bias and she'll be under tremendous pressure to play nice with Palin. As long as Palin doesn't literally soil herself on stage, the media are going to look for a way to either say she won, or call it a draw given that she didn't suffer a total meltdown. It's a heads-I-win-tails-you-lose situation for Biden, unfortunately.

While this debate footage is very impressive, I would be concerned about the timeframe she's operating in.

Going by the LA Times story ("Underestimate Palin at your own risk, former rivals say"), there are some limitations to her style. She relies on pithy answers and charm, rather than nuanced policy-based answers. That's fine on first brush, but she's been a disaster every time a reporter insisted on a follow-up.

Former aides says that she has a "sharply limited attention span for absorbing the facts and policy angles." She does have a talent for boiling down policy to its essence, but it clearly requires prep and focus on her part.

So, if she had more prep time, and if this was a series of debates, I'm pretty sure she'd eventually mop the floor with Biden. But she has very limited time and she's operating under an enormous amount of pressure. She might pull it off, but the Couric interview makes it look like she's not quite ready for this debate yet.

Still, don't underestimate her.

Palin has shown a few consistent tendencies that are going to work to her disadvantage: she throws way too many words into her responses and she tends to way overreach in attempts to demonstrate confidence ("Oh, I read all the magazines.")

Biden, on the other hand, tends to get brutally frank. He is going to provide a really clear contrast to Palin. While Palin is tripping all over her trainwreck of run-on sentences that go nowhere, Joe is going stand out as the person who isn't trying to bullsh*t the public.

Biden has substance, he has personality, he can connect to intellectuals and the workingclass alike. Quips? "A noun, a verb and 9/11."

I rest my case.

The woman is a professional politician with a degree in journalism. She will do well in a debate.

In June 2008, the North Idaho College Alumni Association announced that it planned to honor Governor Sarah Palin with its Distinguished Alumni of the Year Award for 2008-2009.

Ron, you're joking, right? That's pathetic. North Idaho is an also-ran junior college in a state without a decent college or university. Moreover, Boise State plays football on a blue field.

if palin is asked why
she wants to be v p
and what she brings
to the table [exp/qual]
i believe her answer
will be enough
to let everyone
know that this
would be emperor
is already wearing
a barrel

"Ron, you're joking, right? That's pathetic. North Idaho is an also-ran junior college in a state without a decent college or university. Moreover, Boise State plays football on a blue field."

Posted by: Jeff
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Isn't it wonderful? Only in America can you spend 2 semesters at a junior college as part of some incredibly byzantine mess of a journey in getting a degree and you're honored as a "Distinguished Alumuni"?

Biden can be very good at times. But his ratio of pithy quips to rambling answers is not so hot.

You can't have your cake and eat it too. For the last month the media, along with the leftwing blogosphere has been denigrating this womans intelligence to such a degree Joe Public expects a drooling retard to appear on stage.

Now we're trying to portray her as a competent intelligent women, just so we can counter that perception and score Political points.

To some extent, it depends on the questions she gets. She is obviously on shaky ground on national or international issues, but if she gets quizzed on questions regarding her behavior as Wasilla mayor or Alaska governor, she'll probably do just fine with that. To some extent, it depends on how much the moderator wants to play investigative reporter.

I think we are all in general agreement that the expectations for Palin are so horrendously low, she couldn't help but to do fairly in this debate. Perhaps even a witty soundbite or two could sway the debate 'victory' to her, according to the MSM.

Here's how that could be preempted:

In Biden's opening statements, he should make a heartfelt appeal to the audience and viewers, stating that our country is in no shape to waste time on petty bickering about who said what and when. This debate is solely for the purpose of educating voters on specific stances on key issues held by the two candidates that will determine the course and fate of our nation.

He should also appeal to the moderators to avoid 'gotcha' questions, and insist that questions be answered with the utmost detail.

This would serve twofold:

One, it would set a more serious tone to the debate (which obviously favors Biden), and two, it would allow for the Obama campaign to take the high road, should the debates take on the typical tabloid atmosphere. For instance, a statement could be made by Obama's camp that basically says: "Once again our republican opponents have decided that soundbites and petty blame games are what they are best at; not providing the American people a clear and concise vision of their plans. They once again have squandered a golden opportunity to raise the level of political discourse. The American people want, and DESERVE more than MCCain and Palin can offer".

And she sure has gotten a wowzer of a Fargo accent in a year and a half. If ever there was a manufactured candidate, it's Sarah Palin. Posted by: Jeffrey Davis

I noticed that the other day as well. WTF up with that? People in Alaska don't speak like that.

It's exactly like Bush's faux redneck accent (perhaps made more pronounced because of nerve damage due to drug and alcohol abuse). No one else in the Bush family talks like he does.

If she pulls that out at the debate, she'll even piss-off the folks from Wisconsin (it's really a Wisconsin accent and not really N. Dakota) and the U.P. They'll think she's having them on.

C-Span broadcast one of her taped debate performances a few weeks ago. I thought she did remarkably well. She was poised, knowledgeable and persuasive. I would expect the same polished performance in the VP debate.

I don't understand the emphasis the media places on the debates. I take that back. I do.

Moreover, Boise State plays football on a blue field.

My Thetans are acting up.

(Chris Petersen, Boise State head coach, is a Scientologist. Seriously.)

With her lack of knowledge, Palin is Dearth Evader.

Oh, tasty.

I don't blame the climate change for the accent, Charlie.

And, BTW, I'm from Wisconsin and people don't speak like she does. It's a Fargo/Minnesota-type accent doncha know? You saw the movie, ainna?

Ainna is a Wisconsin (Milwaukee) word. Means "is that not so?".

I don't know.... after she was first announced many were thinking she wouldn't embarrass herself, that she would be kept under tight raps and not to expect any embarrassing gaffes. I don't think she's going to rock the debate. She is out there playing a character that is not herself and the McCain campaign is working hard to make sure she says what they want her to say. I don't think she'll crash and burn but I don't think she'll impress either.

"I know this is rude to say but I wish she would just shut up already, you know? I've heard enough."

That's how I feel about W. Just 110 days, 19 hours, 25 minutes and 14 seconds to go.

You can't have your cake and eat it too. For the last month the media, along with the leftwing blogosphere has been denigrating this womans intelligence to such a degree Joe Public expects a drooling retard to appear on stage.Posted by: Dublin

She's not a drooling retard. She actually is quite attractive. However, the low stakes interviews she did with Gibson and Couric amply prove that she is dangerously out of her depth. And I might add here, any woman who supported Clinton through the primaries and is still torn between voting for McCain because of Palin is insulting Clinton. Clinton is everything Palin is not and at 40+ years old never will be - well-educated with a variety and wealth of public experience.

To some extent, it depends on the questions she gets. She is obviously on shaky ground on national or international issues, but if she gets quizzed on questions regarding her behavior as Wasilla mayor or Alaska governor, she'll probably do just fine with that. To some extent, it depends on how much the moderator wants to play investigative reporter.
Posted by: demisod

True. Except she's not running for mayor of Wasilla or even governor of Alaska. Next to nothing of her experiences in those jobs has any bearing on being chosen as the VP of the U.S.

I disagree with most of the prognostications here.

I think she's gonna stray off message and say something really fucking stupid.

a couple of things:

1) Palin will be declared a winner, if only to even things up since Obama "won" the last debate. This thing is fast becoming a runaway victory and not a nailbiter, and we know how much the CNNs love a nailbiter.

2) I fully expect the base to think she did great. I suspect it's going to be difficult for her to win back the independents. I'm not so sure 90 minutes can make up for a month's worth of bad/awful press. I wouldn't be surprised if we see a replay of the first McCain/Obama speech (and the Palin acceptance speech for that matter) - ALOT of posturing to the base, not so much to the middle.

I believe dialectic experts are calling it an amalgamated accent, which is a kind way of saying "manufactured candidate." Jeffrey Davis called it as usual--she didn't speak like this on the vids of 18 months ago.

(Voice going all perky with way HIGH note).

"Shortstop, I wouldn't blame the climate change, but you people would be surprised that Alaskans are a MICrocosm of American accents."

steve duncan: "Read the high school sports scores on camera for a small Alaska TV station."

For the record, KTUU in Anchorage is Alaska's major TV station with the largest newsroom. That may be small in absolute terms, but in Alaska terms, she could've done worse.

I think the McCain campaign is going to go for broke and have her mostly ignore the questions entirely and just give her a series of snarky insults and quips. That was what won over everybody in her Republican convention speech, so it might work again. Plus, if she pisses Biden off, he might try to be funny himself and that could be disastrous.

I expect the base will climb back on board the Palin train and write a lot of articles about how we're finally seeing the Palin that America loved before all the McCain campaign advisers tried to change her. She might even reverse tose downward approval numbers a bit, but I don't think the McCain campaign is even trying to reach anyone but the base anymore.

Comparing the debate skills of Sarah Palin to those of "the Bidenator" is like comparing a wind-up tin mouse to a freaking Panzer. It isn't going to matter one blasted bit if the mouse has lipstick or not; the Panzer is going to grind it flat.

Filibuster? That's her debating skill? WTF is she going to do---start reading from all those Alaskan newspapers that she's never even heard of before, but "reads all the time?"

Please. I've seen those tapes of her Alaska debates as well; the questions were dean-pan softballs compared to what she'll get tomorrow night. With any luck, some of the more serious questions will go to her first, and Biden can dismantle her replies on a piecemeal basis.

There's a difference (or at least there used to be, and should be, a difference) between being a good speaker, and a good debater. Folksy charm & funny quips are fine at a speaking engagement, and can ably assist in a debate, but first and foremost, a debate is supposed to be about issues. Even the opinions you defend or attack are supposed to be based on issues. And Palin avoids issues like a vampire avoids garlic. If this were to happen during the debate, and no one calls her out on it, then yeah, it'll be argued that she won the debate, or at least didn't embarrass herself.

One more thing I think Biden has in his favor is the results from the Pres debate last Friday. The media, by and large, started off giving McCain praise during the debate. Harshest criticism was in the vein of "he didn't humiliate himself, he held his own, but he needed to do better on a debate about foreign policy, which is supposed to be his strong suit." But all of the post-debate polling gave much higher marks to Obama. I think there are a lot of Americans who are looking for a reason - ANY reason - to trust a McCain-Palin ticket. And they're REALLY looking. Whether it's because they don't trust Dems in general or Obama in particular, they're begging this ticket to take itself seriously, and prove they're ready to lead. And they're not getting it.

Yeah, I know, there are a lot of thunderdolts who are going to be predisposed to thinking Palin's wonderful no matter what, and she'd pretty much have to skin and eat one of her children for those people to see her in a harsh light. But really, this time, this election, more people are scared and broke and angry enough to at least try to pay attention to the issues. Much like Palin herself holed up and getting drilled on the history of American politics in a few weeks, so too are many Americans finally trying to understand how a nation - and their beloved Republican party - could consistently eff them over so often.

Furthermore, I think maybe - JUST MAYBE - the media is catching on to this fact. Lord knows they're starting to get pissed from being treated like McCain's booty call, where he's all smiles and sweet-talk when he's got it up for them, but now that he's found himself a new gal he doesn't have time for them. While I wouldn't be surprised if the media gives Palin high marks just for being able to count to 20 without taking her shoes off, I also am slightly optimistic that the ride's coming close to being over, that the media understands that more people will be judging Palin critically than they did when she was first announced as the veep nominee, and that being charming and funny just won't cut it.

In fact, that's my prediction. That's the feedback Palin will take away from the debate tomorrow night. She was charming. She was funny. She didn't particularly embarrass herself. But she also didn't say or do anything to prove her worth on the national political stage. She evaded questions the public really wanted answered. She didn't prove herself to be presidential. And Biden did. No one but the most snide wingnuts will try to play that off as sexist or even false. And that's assuming she doesn't decide to play in the mud and drag the process down to an insulting degrading Yo-momma-shout out.

We'll see.

While Sarah Palin might have done well in debates about issues affecting Alaskans during her race for governor of that state, the level of questions and the demand for clarity, and the public scrutiny is much different during a major televised debate for the VP of the USA. I still think she is going to have problems, even if she does know how to filibuster and evade. Just my two cents worth,.

You know, I look forward to visiting Alaska someday, and I own two seasons of "Northern Exposure", but the place is hardly Periclean Athens. Palen's debate skills may have had her opponents filling their mucklucks; Joe Biden may be made of sterner stuff.
His practice with Granholm is one tell. She's as attractive as Palen, though smarter, and has developed a soft style that deflates the high-testosterone GOP pols of Michigan. If Palen goes soft, he can deal with it. If she goes hard, he can sit back and watch the flames.
Especially if the moderator can bring herself to remind a speaker that the question hasn't been answered.

My Thetans are acting up. (Chris Petersen, Boise State head coach, is a Scientologist. Seriously.)
Posted by: Idi Amin's Last Meal

No shit? I wonder if recruiting involves making mostly clueless HS seniors take one of their tests?

I want her destroyed, in a burn-it-to-the-ground, plow-salt-into-the-fields way. I want her to end this sorry that she ever entered local politics, let alone nationally. I am *that* insulted that this packaged nothing has been proposed as the Vice President of the United States.

I think the best outcome is if Biden just gives her enough rope to hang herself, but if need be I hope he throws the gloves down and rips her to shreds. This time it's the republicans who have brought a plastic knife to a gunfight. Make. Them. Pay.

Let her stonewall with her debate answers.

Let her be vague and smily. Let her change the subject. She could be accused of being a witch and her base wouldn't care. They don't want answers from her that they can't understand and have been rewarded with that over and again. It's the slice of America that still functions mentally that will not be enthralled with double speak and vague changing of subjects. Her views on Roe/Wade will sink her with the woman not willing to give their personal choice up for a evangelical zealot VP. Her breathtaking lack of knowledge concerning national security will not move men in her direction who are thinking of her as a heart beat away from the "codes".

Sure she'll win points by not answering questions directly and the MSM pundants will fall for the Palin trap head-over-heels but her not knowing "shit from shineola" will be as evident in these debates as it was in her Couric and Gibson interviews. The best comment I have read came from a journalist who used the analogy that she is cramming for an exam in a course she has never attended.

You can put lipstick on a pig...

While the Obama campaign must do what it can to dampen expectations I do not agree that she is a formidable debater.

She did reasonably well in a closed room debate talking about topics she was actually reasonably knowledgeable.

She will now be in front of a live audience and millions of people watching. The topics will about things she has shown she has only a cursory understanding of.

I think there is more than a reasonable possibility that she will pull a Dukakis and simply not have an answer for question.

She has looked foolish, not because she is dumb or inarticulate, but because she is being asked questions that she simply has no depth on.

I think the McCain campaign is going to go for broke and have her mostly ignore the questions entirely and just give her a series of snarky insults and quips. That was what won over everybody in her Republican convention speech, so it might work again. Posted by: sophronia

The problem with this theory is that most Americans are not Republicans. Most Americans really have no coherent political philosophy of any kind.

Reading a speech prepared by someone else full of red meat applause lines for a friendly crowd is not the same as answering questions in a debate in a fashion that sways approximately 50% of the American voters who are really neither Rethugs or Dems.

The best comment I have read came from a journalist who used the analogy that she is cramming for an exam in a course she has never attended.

OT, how old do you have to be before you stop having the nightmare that you're on your way to the final exam in an undergraduate class you forgot to go to all semester?

She has looked foolish, not because she is dumb or inarticulate, but because she is being asked questions that she simply has no depth on.Posted by: flyerhaw

Correct. That she doesn't have any answers about pretty much anything anyone has asked her, and then lied about all the deep reading she does does not prove she is dumb. But it is ample proof that she has never had any interest in national or international politics and so shows that she has no business being the VP of the U.S.

Biden needs to calmly and concisely challenge Palin on just one or two selective, salient points.

In other words, he needs to pick his battles-- but DO pick what he wants to address and do fight wisely.

She is a slippery snake from the word go. We all know that. Let her show her slipperiness. I say let her dodge, let her B.S. and hollowed out, beauty pageantry responses emerge as much as possible.

Let 80 percent of it go, but do address the 20 percent that will affect what Americans want to hear.

Someone above suggested the networks and talking heads will say Palin won just to 'balance' Obama's win on Friday and keep up the semblance of a close race.

While we can't discount the possibility, I don't think the bias we have seen in the campaign so far is necessarily going to continue.

For one thing, it seems increasingly likely that Obama will win no matter what happens between now and election day, and that the Democrats will have an overwhelming edge in both the House and the Senate regardless of who becomes President. While the corporations that run the news organizations may prefer a McCain win, they don't want to get stuck on the wrong side, look foolish and offend the new officeholders.

Also, the McCain campaign has made so many serious gaffes lately and been on the wrong side of so many issues, that even the big corporations may be starting to question whether they really want him in power. It's unlikely they will completely change sides, but they may be a little less enthusiastic in their support.

Finally, to the extent news organizations may want to keep ratings up by pretending things are close, we have relatively little time to go before election day so the return on this strategy is becoming smaller with each day. Meanwhile, there is possibility of even bigger rating, readership, etc from the excitement that could be generated by a landslide victory.

It is going to be interesting and revealing to see what happens to the election coverage over the next few weeks. The one thing I expect we will continue to see is that most of it will be relatively shallow.

Yes, but--she knew her stuff in the Alaska debates, it included fewer subjects, was more similar to the issues she dealt with as mayor, and presumably she'd had more time to prepare for (and during) the run.

I expect her to pull herself together compared to that last interview, but if there are any surprise questions they will still trip her up quite a bit. I'm not sure what effect this will ultimately produce, though.

I think the reason she did so well in the gubernatorial debates is because she lives in Alaska and KNOWs the history and the workings of the government there. She lived in a bubble while she was in Alaska and she never had to concern herself with national/international scale politics.

Notice how in her gubenatorial debates her words flowed quickly and freely. It's because she DID know what she was talking about. In these recent interviews with Gibson and Couric, she speaks much slower and obvious (like a puppet with someone's hand in her back moving her jaw); because she is NOT comfortable with the talking points she is being spoon-fed, she hasn't lived these talking points, and it doesn't come off on camera as being sincere. Yes, she manages to fool some people, but anyone with a little intelligence can see right through the facade.
To have to remember talking points you have never lived, and have only had a short time to prepare, is much harder to do. She has had to cram for these debates and as anyone [who has ever cramed for an exam] knows, it's much easier to speak on a topic if it has been of personal experience.

I think she may (I hope not) hold her own, but she going to come off sounding like the puppet she is; answering the last question every contestant is asked in the beauty pageant.

I'm going to go out on a limb here and say that she falls on her face in the debate tomorrow. She does not know anything about the subjects she's going to be debating, and you can't learn this stuff in one month.

OT, how old do you have to be before you stop having the nightmare that you're on your way to the final exam in an undergraduate class you forgot to go to all semester? -- shortstop @13:41

Don't know. All I can tell you is that 59 (almost) is *not* old enough. Ditto for the textbooks you had lost at the beginning of the course (reason why you didn't attend the course) which were replaced the day before the exam...

"It's a heads-I-win-tails-you-lose situation for Biden, unfortunately."

I call bullshit. Palin will score a few points, but her ugly personality will out. She is a supercilious, oleaginous, near-shreaky harpy. Her whacko religiosity and uber-right-wing beliefs will be impossible to hide. *That's* a losing combo.