Other than the minimum wage increase, I'm trying to think of something the Dems got passed that, even tangentially, could have had any effect on the economy. Surely, Foxx doesn't think the problems began with TARP, or that Dems controlled the money.

This is called

Magical Thinking.

"It makes substantive dialog exceedingly difficult."

Ya Think?

Please, please, please read George Lakoff's The Politcal Mind that gives strategies to progressives on how to deal with such nut cases.

foxx forgets..

from jan. 2007 until october 2008...

the fundementals were strong...

remember?

This shit will only work with the mainstream of the GOP -- which has fast become the fringe 25% of American politics. Most people, FAR BEFORE 2007, found the "Bush economy" to be a bust, geared strictly to the rich, while wages and salaries for the overwhelming majority of us remained stagnant.

In short, everyone but the average Republican knows this is bullshit, despite the "stats" which show growth (people know where the money went). They tried doing this in 2006 too -- telling people that they were wrong to feel like the economy was good and, of course, as late as 2008, they were calling Americans "a nation of whiners".

What we have to realize, and fast, is how marginalized the GOP is -- and forget what hyperbole we think worked for them in the past. It's not working for them. And it won't, so long as it's as demonstratively false as this.

Substantive dialog is not possible with mentally ill people, which is what the Republican party consists of these days. They can only be managed and handled as skillfully as possible to prevent public relations problems for the adults who are finally in charge.

Let's all keep repeating our mantra: "The American people elected the Democrats to save the country from the disaster inflicted on it by the Republicans. And we're going to do it with them or without them. Start liking it."

wrong to feel like the economy was good

Whoops. I meant "the GOP tried to tell people that they were wrong to think the economy is bad."

This is a common meme in right-wing chain emails as well, and has been going around since about mid-2007.

A whole lot of people in the Republican caucus believe crazy things.

The multitudes of silly people otherwise known as the moronic minions of Lord Limbaugh the Ludicrous are supposed to believe crazy thing. They can't help it; they were bred that way....

as i said yesterday, the republicans seemingly are doing all they can to attain permanent minority status.

i really like to believe that there are reasonable people on that side of the aisle. if there are, they're doing their best to hide, especially in the house.

or maybe they're just overwhelmed by the crazies and the wingnuts.

This is called

Magical Thinking.

It doesn't matter what it's called or if the rest of us thinks GOP line or reasoning is utter garbage. The problem is that GOP can say anything it wants and uninformed voters take care of the rest - by jumping through GOP hoops.

a good summary of what is going on.

http://agonist.org/stirling_newberry/20090129/unity_goes_obama_for_the_repbulican_party_progressives_cheer_getting_screwed#comment

Steve, almost every post you make is devoted to hunting rabbits/GOP bashing. I can't remember one thorough examination of the stimulus package.

The problem is that GOP can say anything it wants and uninformed voters take care of the rest - by jumping through GOP hoops.

I disagree. Sure there are "uninformed" voters on a lot of things -- but "how the economy impacts you" is not one of them. The Democrats were "winning" the economy battle way before 2006, it's just that the GOP was winning the fear and war vote -- which is partly the reason why the Democrats voted with them (idiotically), to get the debate on domestic politics, where the D's were much stronger.

But the GOP's failure has been so total and immense that they are now trying to force people to believe retroactively that they had it good back when most people already knew they didn't. Fail. And Fail Again.

This is why they poll at 25%.

Steve Benen wrote: "A whole lot of people in the Republican caucus believe crazy things ... It makes substantive dialog exceedingly difficult."

The problem with the Republicans is not what they "believe".

The problem with the Republicans, and the reason that "substantive dialog" with them is "difficult", is that they represent the interests of America's Ultra-Rich Ruling Class, Inc. (otherwise known as "the top one percent", otherwise known as "Bush's base") and as such their agenda is inimical to the interests of the American people.

Furthermore, the Republican Party under the leadership of Dick Cheney and George W. Bush ceased to be a political party in the usual sense, and became an organized crime enterprise whose "governing philosophy" centered on abusing the power of government for corrupt purposes of private financial gain for themselves and their ultra-rich corporate cronies and finanical backers.

If a burglar breaks into your house and holds you at gunpoint while he ransacks and loots your home to steal anything and everything of value, certainly "substantive dialog" with him will be "difficult". But it won't do you much good to worry about what he "believes".

Similarly there is little reason to ponder what Republicans "believe". It's not important what they claim to believe in the course of spewing self-serving lies and deceit.

What's important is that they are gangsters and crooks, and enemies of the American people, and must be defeated for the good of the country.

It seems to me that we should let representative democracy work.

If the house republicans believe that their constituents do not want a stimulus package, then, based on their vote, we should respect their wishes and not send any of the reconstruction funds to their districts.

the nation's problems started when Democrats regained majorities in Congress in the 2006 elections.

As Danp said, the problem with this statement is that Democrats didn't actually get anything done with their majorities because Republicans successfully filibustered everything in the Senate. Bush didn't even have to veto laws Republicans disagreed with because they never made it to his desk.

Noam Scheiber tries to use reason

You can't refute a theology.

I think we're near the point when we can either a.) invoke the principle of cuius regio, eius religio , give them the old CSA and the Big Empty Square States, and get on with the business of running the rest of country, or b.) get a stake, collect bundles of kindling, and scout up a Zippo.

Temperamentally, I'm in favor of Plan A. For entertainment value, you can't beat Plan B.

Dick Armey had it right on Crossfire last night. The Bush tax cuts were part of an "income redistribution" program aimed at enriching the Republican base. It worked and now America suffers.

Posted by: SecularAnimist on January 29, 2009 at 1:40 PM

Nail - Head.

Everyone here fails to factor in Bill Clinton's time machine which the Dems constantly use to screw up the GOP. The Mainstream Media, of course, is part of this time-traveling conspiracy and helps keep it hush-hush.

Wake up people, it's all on the Internets.

Steve is right: this kind of idiot-think, or no-think, makes discussion impossible. It's tempting, as some I hold dear believe, to tell Republicans as a whole to take a hike, jump in the lake, or whatever handy dispose-all idiom leaps to lips. Yet millions voted for these clowns. They, too, are Americans. How to enlighten them is as big a problem as any we face. Thinking, fact-checking -- hey, it's hard, a habit of mind that may seem foreign (quelle horreur!) or daunting if you've never done it. Liberals need to find a way to show that what the right wing calls "liberalism" is usually mainstream American principle in our laws and the Consittution.

...and nutballs like Foxx dominate the media, while smart reasonable analysis is almost nowhere to be found

America's governing principles may be liberal, but its mythology is conservative, and therein lies the problem.

Steve,

It's amazing how you and others like to beat down that rich 1%, yet you never seem to have any drive of your own to rise up to that level and use your hard earned money for "good of the country." I must be eaiser to look up at others and say give me some of yours. How about backing away for the computer, getting out of your moms basement, and going out and see what it it like to make some money of your own. In case you are wondering why I am on the computer as well, this is what I do and I have made a lot of money doing it. However, sure that you savior "Obama" will make sure I have less by the time he is done.

I could give you PAGES on just how bad the previous eight years have been, but let's boil it down to just one compelling indicator:

* Poverty in America DECREASED each and every year of the eight years that President Clinton was in office.

* Poverty in America INCREASED each and every year of the eight years Chimpy was squatting in the office.

joe...

Number of years poverty rate FELL - Clinton: 7

Number of years poverty rate ROSE - Bush: 5

http://www.census.gov/hhes/www/poverty/

heckofajob...