It is remarkable and kinda fun to watch a grownup do grown up things. I also admire the way the GOP is paddling its boat straight toward the huge waterfall. It's going to make the neatest noise ever when they finally go right over the edge into oblivion.

It only really counts as a win if it works.

If it does not fix the economy, it will be an albatross around the neck of every politician that voted for it. Given the problems you've already pointed out, that's a far more likely conclusion to this than flowers and candy for all involved.

If they had really cared about a win, they would have abolished paygo rules, told any member who balked that any bill they sponsored would be vetoed, and rammed through something much larger. Would the public have complained? Yes. Would they still be complaining in 2010? I doubt it. Now, they will likely cheer now and be in a righteous fury come 2010 and 2012.

Always good to distinguish the important stuff from what we will little note nor long remember.

Everyone has a pet peeve with this legislation. I suppose if/when the Republican Party ceases to exist as a major political entity, the Democratic party is going to split along the Progressive/Blue Dog divide. Either way, politically this was a huge score for Obama, and this bill has a ton of good stuff for the rest of us as well. I'm just hoping it's not the last one and that Obama is talented enough to thread the needle of just enough spending to boost the economy without creating an unfixable national debt.

They would be wise to save their crowing until the sun (economy) starts to rise

So, isn't now a good time to implement the kind of healthcare you could have if you were French?

It really IS fun to watch the Republicans self-destruct through petrification.

Their new-found fiscal concerns are so patently obstructionist (and ONLY obstructionist) that they ought to lose all of the independent voters immediately. When they've lost the _Chamber of Commerce_ you know they've lemminged off the cliff.

(a)Close your eyes.
(b)Imagine if Bush had one more year as Prez.
(c)Now open your eyes again - it's a beatiful day!

So, when does Doctor Biobrain get credit for being fucking right about everything?

I'm quite positive that the only thing preventing me from being hired as a top political strategist is that I've got the stupidest name in blogdom. Well, second stupidest, after Hindrocket. It seems you've got to have a "real" name to get recognized in this biz. What a crock!

One of the underreported items in the bill that passed last night is a compensation limit on execs from banks that are getting TARP money. Their annual bonuses are limited to 33% of base salary, must be paid in company stock, and can only be redeemed after the company repays the government investment.

Considering the supposed debate earlier this week between Axelrod and Geithner, and the necessary approval of the Republican delegation, I'd call this a quiet but smile-inducing victory.

A vocal path.

You live
near a vocal
path, and always
a young bird
returns in your
head like a
beautiful song
in the light
of a white dream...

Francesco Sinibaldi

What has become extremely apparent is that republicans have lined up on the side of a continuation of their failed policies and doing anything they can think of to makes sure Obama fails for political reasons.

40 senators will continue to obstruct the changes we can believe in...they will obstruct all democratic policies just to make sure they can't succeed in changing the way business is done in this country. 40 senators who come from policies of utter and complete failure.

It takes 51 votes to change the senate filibuster rule so that the majority can get back to legislating. When republicans controlled the senate and dems even threatened to filibuster they said no you won't or we'll just vote to remove the filibuster(nuclear option) so dems would give it up and not filibuster.

Now that dems control congress all republicans have to do is 'threaten' to filibuster and Harry Reid just gives it in to their demands. See Harry, they would do it to you in a heartbeat over minor issues like 'appointments' yet here we are in a crucial disaster and these 40 senators demand their way or the highway demonstrated by the fact that only 3 repubs voted for this package even after dems catered to their demands. The times demand that Reid get rid of this filibuster rule or these 40 senators will be writing all the policies.

Tyranny of the majority is also called "Democracy". Nothing gets done until the House agrees so the House is a check on the senate and we don't need this stupid obstruction monkey wrench filibuster rule in these dire times.

Reid won't even 'make' them filibuster so he will need a real push to come out and end this filibuster rule altogether. Time to replace Harry Reid. All republican progress in the next election will be because of Harry Reid's failure to end this filibuster rule which will be evoked every time the senate tries to move forward with good democratic policies...which represent the majority. 40 senators should not be allowed to prevent progress for purely political gain by evoking this ridiculous filibuster rule. It no longer belongs because the motivations for using the filibuster have changed with partisan politics. Now republicans use it for political gain and not for the good of the country. Get rid of the filibuster Harry before the filibuster gets rid of you.

Now if only Obama *would* overhaul the banking system...

It is remarkable and kinda fun to watch a grownup do grown up things.

mmmmmmmmmhmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm!

blah, blah, blah...the fact of the matter is, the nation is clearly working on economic disaster of epic proportions and everyone knows it - 3.5 million jobs LOST in half a year, the whole banking and financial system teetering on the brink of collapse, foreclosures skyrocketing, and construction activity halted - HALTED.

Just as cadaver could have won the election, under the circumstances anything, any president put forth would have passed. Its the economic equivalent of rallying 'round the president in time of war.

More importantly than misplaced beautification, lets hope its enough and the right mix to work. There is an awfully lot of economic talent that thinks its fails on both counts.

Just as cadaver could have won the election, under the circumstances anything, any president put forth would have passed.

Maybe. But the "who is president" matters rather largely at the moment. Hillary may or may not have gotten something similar through. Edwards was a cadaver who would have lost (although one would imagine he would have had a more liberal proposal). McCain would have said "tax cuts" and it would have no chance of working even if it did pass. On the other hand, Obama parlayed huge popularity into passing something that while it may be imperfect, actually has substance.

I would further argue that it's not the last thing he'll pass. So for 3 weeks, it's a rather monumental success.

Keep in mind too the other things this brand new (all senses of the phrase) administration has done: the Lily Ledbetter law, S-CHIP, stopping off shore drilling, lifting Bush Error health policy restrictions, confirming or moving toward confirmation cabinet and deputy cabinet posts which, two vetting bumps and one Republican treachery excepted, are sailing into place (Holder the most important in my opinion), and on and on. Obama is with one exception (Geithner, perhaps a special case because of financial threats) abiding by his own very high ethical standards and off loading people who don't on second look measure up. So bravo.

Obama has TWO huge victories here.

First - a stimulus package that has the promise of really helping the current fiscal situation.

AND

He has castrated the Republicans. By stonewalling and losing, they are now irrevelent. In the future, Obama needs to talk to Sen. Snowe, Specter, & Collins - nobody else. If there are any other Republicans in the Senate who want to have anything positive to happen for themselves or their states, they will have to beg for somebody to believe they have even one sincere bone in their bodies.

Just as cadaver could have won the election, under the circumstances anything, any president put forth would have passed. Its the economic equivalent of rallying 'round the president in time of war. -- zoot, @17:24

a) something close to a cadaver *did* run (on the GOOP side) and didn't win. So how can you claim it could have?

b) I didn't see much "rallying 'round the president", not on the GOOP side, anyway. If you had (seen it), then you need to sue your optometrist -- he gave you the wrong specs.

Just as cadaver could have won the election, under the circumstances anything, any president put forth would have passed. Its the economic equivalent of rallying 'round the president in time of war.

Zero Republican votes in the House and three in the Senate is rallying 'round the prez? What does half-hearted support from the GOP look like--taking out Dem legislators with sniper fire?

Now if only Obama *would* overhaul the banking system...

The two things are integrally related. Failing to fix the banks will doom the success of the stimulus.

zoot - If a cadaver could have won then we should be looking at McCain. Wonder what he would have cooked up for us? Oh yeah, that's right, Obama is epic fail, but McCain would have done just great...

Sheesh

Yeah, but... John Edwards would have fought for you!

man you guys are thick as republicans:

any cadaver on the "D" ticket could have beaten mccain.

republicans don't rally around democratic presidents. luckily, more than 2/3s of the nation don't identify with republicans.

Vermonter, @ 20:23,

Maybe he would have. *If* he found the time to spare, between his wife and his mistress *and* fending off knickers-sniffing Repubs. But it's a big "if"...

man you guys are thick as republicans -- zoot, @21:36

No. It's your skill in making a coherent argument and/or your command of English that's as good as W's.

One can only speculate if “soullite� is an economist expressing his professional opinion when he predicts that the mysterious they “will be in a righteous fury come 2010 and 2012�. One would not expect him to be a Keynesian. It is hard to tell, by what he writes, what in is that he is predicting. Is it tautology, or inspired wisdom

Frank Rich offers up a lovely celebration/analysis of the whole insane process that unfolded and resulted in a huge win for Obama

Feb. 14 op-ed at the NYT website.

"They sure showed that Obama"

God, I love his essays.

To those who say it's not big enough, I would say: its only been three weeks, 75% of the bill is to be spent in the next, what 18 months? More will come, ARRP II, maybe? After 2010 (which the GOP is setting up to be another epic fail for their side) there will be no need for screwing around.

I think Obama started at 700-800 billion because he thought once it hit Congress it would balloon up to 1 Trillion or more (which was a very easy thing to expect, given history).

republicans don't rally around democratic presidents. luckily, more than 2/3s of the nation don't identify with republicans.

Um, this thread is about a major legislative accomplishment, not about public support. What was that about being dense?

It's okay with us if you want to pretend that Hillary or Edwards or someone else would have been able to a) pull this bill off and b) enjoy upwards of 60 percent public approval (if that's the measure you're using now). We'll still let you enjoy the fruits of stimulus relief.