South Carolina and Louisiana. No surprises there.

When did tar/feathers go out of 'style'???

In my America, I was taught to never look a gift-horse in the mouth! Jindal and Sanford are hurting their citizens for political purposes. What balderdash! -Kevo

"When times go south you cut spending," Sanford recently explained. "That's what families do, that's what businesses do, and I don't think the government should be exempt from that process."

I missed the news that our problems were a result of the government being out of money. If so, Sanford should be praised for noticing what absolutely no one else on the planet believes.

Here's a better analogy for you: parents go into debt for their kid's education so that the kid does not live on their sofa forever. That is what our government is doing.

I'm guessing Bobby and Mark have decided the median Republican in an early primary state is still a.) employed and b.) completely devoid of any sense of empathy, or possibly c.) a and b.

Is Barbour running for anything or is he just screwing the colored folks and/or being a dick for dickishnes' sake?

I'm not sure it's that great an idea for their presidential campaigns either. Governors usually can run on a platform that their states had X% economic growth and created Y new jobs thanks to them. How will it look in 2012 when those numbers are negative for Sanford or Jindal and positive for everyone else?

Do repubs want to lose the south too? Strong stands against gay abortion are only going to carry them so far.

The needle that any potential Republican presidential candidate gets harder and harder to thread each year, as the craziest of the crazies demand more and more fealty to the extreme right's pet causes.

So, now we've got a Republican party that is forcing its supposed future leaders to vote against new jobs, cleaner environments via those new jobs, and the single biggest tax cut in the history of the United States.

Well played, GOP, well played.

The crazy level is escalating rapidly. The following Glenn Beck segment is posted at TPM, but here is the web address, I think:

http://www.foxnews.com/video/index.html?playerId=videolandingpage&streamingFormat=FLASH&referralObject=3675251&referralPlaylistId=playlist

This is crazy in a scary sense. And, in Beck's mind, he's defending the Constitution! Stupid, and truly scary.

And it's mind-boggling to remember, as a post at Daily Kos reminds us, that all these right-wingers were gung-ho for the US federal government to take over Iraq and re-build that nation -- and to do it entirely with borrowed money.

One listens to Krugman and Roubini on ABC and thinks, at last some sophisticated common sense (delivered, even, with a bit of a smile).

And then stuff like this. We are already into several layers of right-wing crazy, and Bush has only been out of office for only a month.

"Sanford added, by the way, that supporters of the economic recovery package are "the real fringe" in American politics. "

This makes absolute sense to me. You have to understand, that as far as Sanford can mobilize that little mind of his, the CENTER of America is conservative Repugs, and anything else is fringe. If you never leave your small clique of sick friends, you think everybody thinks like they do because everyone you speak to, in your SMALL group, thinks the exact destructive thought.

And Repugs wonder why they are out of power? This last sentence says it all.

I know that no one every went broke underestimating the intelligence of the American people, and I certainly don't want to put a jinx on anyone, but I really hope one of these fools gets the nomination next cycle.

I am not a republican. I am not a democrat.
I am an individual that belives that you can't borrow from your children for ever.
Real pragmatisem suggests that Gov Sanford is correct. Sooner or later this disease we suffer from is going to starve your children.

mr. shortstop and I have been working our way through the John Adams series on DVD. At one point, during a tussle in the Senate, Adams mutters, "Why is it always South Carolina?" mr. s. and I burst out laughing.

EC Sedgwick wrote:

I am not a republican. I am not a democrat. I am an individual that belives that you can't borrow from your children for ever. Real pragmatisem suggests that Gov Sanford is correct. Sooner or later this disease we suffer from is going to starve your children.

You could benefit from reading up on "ripple effect" in economics. Honey, if we follow your formula, we'll all soon be riding goats.

h

let's just assume EC Sedgwick you are right that "sooner or later" we cannot deficit spend. well, it had better be later because if it si sooner we are all doomed. That is THE fundamental point of this entire pseudo-debate. No one arguing for the stimulus is saying that large spending bills are per se good government; but instead those poeople are arguing that it is good government when looking at the factual circumstances taht exist at the moment.

I am an individual that belives that you can't borrow from your children for ever.
Real pragmatisem suggests that Gov Sanford is correct.

I sure hope you are not a money manager, because you have absolutely no understanding of return on investment.

Yes, we cannot borrow forever. But no one is arguing that. What we are arguing is that by borrowing now, the money that we spend will allow us to borrow much less in the future.

Borrowing money is not bad in of itself. If it were, then no one should ever get a loan for anything. The problem is when you borrow but do not use that money to earn even more money (e.g. borrowing for a depreciating asset like a car, and spend more than the car can earn you transporting you to and from to work).

It is the previous administration that believed that deficits do not matter; they borrowed without any concern of return on investment. That is what this administration is trying to change. If they do not, then we still have the debt to pay from the last administration, but no economy to pay it with.

Being a fiscal conservative means that you have some idea how money works. I no longer support Republicans because they have all convinced me that they do not.

ec sedgwick, the people who believe in borrowing from your children as a basic approach to governance are known as republicans.

the people who think that in desperate times we borrow from our children are known as sane individuals.

and just so you know, sanford's point makes no sense whatsoever on the national level (it doesn't really make any sense on the state level, either, but constitutions trump sense on this matter): the time to run a deficit is when the economy is underperforming. the time to run a surplus is when the economy is growing.

when mark sanford can show us his lengthy list of quotes opposing republican deficit spending during the bush years, we'll pay attention to him.

when he can show us his documented opposition to paying for the war in iraq (more expensive than the stimulus, after all) through borrowing, we'll care about his comments about the present.

otherwise, we're going to treat him as a deranged individual. there is no sense to his remarks, which is why they are nonsense.

Throwing themselves to the lions in barbecue-flavored clothing...

Jindal still leads. Here's why: From a story in the NYT on 2/16:

A leading scientific group has announced its intention to boycott Louisiana because of a new state law that could open the door to teaching creationism in the public schools. The measure, signed into law last summer by Gov. Bobby Jindal, allows teachers to “use supplemental textbooks� in the classroom to “help students critique and review scientific theories.�

A leading Christian conservative group here, the Louisiana Family Forum, championed the law; a member proposed the bill to its legislative sponsor.

Scientists denounced the law as a back-door effort to sneak creationism into the classrooms. In response to the law, the Society for Integrative and Comparative Biology, formerly the American Society of Zoologists, wrote to Mr. Jindal this month to announce it would not hold its 2011 annual meeting in New Orleans, opting for Salt Lake City instead.
...

A citizens’ organization that Dr. Forrest helps lead, the Louisiana Coalition for Science, commented in a news release that “the citizens of Louisiana, whose educational well-being the governor claims to be so concerned about, are now paying the price — literally — for his loyalty to his conservative Christian base.�

Hopefully, the end of the republican party is shaping up to be like 'Reservoir Dogs'.

Sanford is insane, I know I live in SC. Hell even his own repub controlled legislature thinks he is insane that is why they override most of his vetoes. vetoes of legislation passed by his own party

I assume that the money refused by these Rethugs will be added to the money given to the governors who did not refuse it. There is no reason to undercut the recovery plan just because these morons are morons. I imagine that those out of work in South carolina and Louisiana might take note that had they been supported by less obtuse and obdurate fools, they might have received more assistance in their time of need.

The true tragedy is that these are, already, among the poorest states in the country. South Carolina may be a little better than the others -- but that's only because the economy exists on the massive influx of Federal Government money -- in the form of military bases -- and the 'stimulus' this causes to surrounding businesses.

As for Alaska, despite the oil money that gives everybody a governmental check, the Western parts of Alaska are suffering a crisis that should be getting everybody concerned, except that it is mostly happening to small Native Alaskan Villages.

Her Excellency's response -- after five weeks of bad press forced her into it? To finally fly to the area, accompanied by Franklin Graham, to make the point that these starving, freezing people can rely on private charities to save them. To make the point further, as Mudflats tells us
"In what we’ll call the “Runner Up Flight�, Lieutenant Governor Sean Parnell accompanied local wannabee national celebrity evangelical Jerry Prevo of the Anchorage Baptist Temple in a King Air plane that followed."

Meanwhile, on the useful front, many (anti-Palin) groups are arranging their own food drops to these people, and, further:

"Without fanfare, without a pair of evangelical celebrity preachers flanking him, Senator Mark Begich traveled to Bethel and video conferenced with several other villages, including the village of Emmonak. Who was on his arm? The very un-glamorous Bureau of Indian Affairs Regional Director for Alaska, Niles Cesar. This release touts the efforts of both Senators in bringing relief to the area.

'Traveling to Bethel with U.S. Sen. Mark Begich today, Bureau of Indian Affair’s (BIA) regional director for Alaska, Niles Cesar, announced the BIA will provide emergency financial assistance to help residents in Emmonak struggling with the price of fuel.

'At a video conference arranged with several villages through the Yukon Kuskokwim Health Corporation, Cesar told participants that the BIA has agreed to waive eligibility rules so more people in Emmonak can receive assistance of up to $1,000.

'“I am extremely pleased that the BIA has answered Senator Lisa Murkowski and my request for assistance to help these residents get through the winter,� Sen. Begich said. ‘This is not a long-term solution, but it’s a step in the right direction. I am hopeful the State of Alaska will step in and help solve this for the future.�

'Sen. Begich arranged the meeting in Bethel today and asked BIA officials to go with him. Cesar said the assistance may range from $400 to $1,000 depending on a person’s income. He didn’t know how many people would eventually receive the extra help, but said the average person will receive around $500.

'Cesar also said his office is requesting the wavier be made available to 56 villages in Western Alaska and to 11 villages in the Northwest Arctic. Sen. Begich endorsed the request to expand the waiver to help more villages."

Please,please if these dillweeds don't want the money and think it's such a bad idea don't give it to them. Maybe the people of those states will start electing sane leaders then.
I'm 100% sure that the governors of several midwestern staters will step up to the plate and take the money that those brilliant governors don't want.

In response to the law, the Society for Integrative and Comparative Biology...wrote to Mr. Jindal... to announce it would not hold its ...meeting in New Orleans, opting for Salt Lake City instead.

Salt Lake City? Way to make a bold statement.

Please,please if these dillweeds don't want the money and think it's such a bad idea don't give it to them. Maybe the people of those states will start electing sane leaders then.

<rolls-eyes>
Because social unrest has always been an effective way of getting quality leadership in the past.
</rolls-eyes>

Well, at least Michael Steele won't have a hard time coming up with a new slogan: "The New GOP: Crazier than you thought!"

Hell,the above excuses and reasons amounted to.
She was already raped so when I do the same thing,I should recive less censure.
Bull shit.

Personally, I think it is great what those Republican Governors are doing.

It's all well documented on Youtube, cable TV, MSM, and the internet 'tubes' and blogs.

3 years from now, it will be interesting how they twist themselves into pretzels trying to explain 'why' they did not want to take the money. (They will take it anyway, it's just grandstanding)

How to explain to 'regular' people why you (GOP)obstructed the rebuilding of the economy, will be interesting to observe indeed.

Wow.

In a rare moment of civility on the comment page of a blog, a bunch of people read EC Sedgwick's head-in-the-sand comment about borrowing, and instead of hurling insults, they each left dignified explanations as to why EC was wrong, how EC has what they consider reality exactly backwards.

That's the rare part.

Then EC returns, leaving another comment, which seems to indicate he/she didn't read any of the responses. Or if they did, they have not a friggin' clue what they're talking about. They just keep insisting they are right, no matter what facts are presented to them.

That, sadly, is not rare.

Strong stands against gay abortion are only going to carry them so far.

I assume you mean "gays and abortion." Many republicans might actually be for gay abortion, even post-birth.

Schwarzenegger just said he'd take the money. There is no better reply to their reckless silliness than that. I have never voted Republican in my life. I never thought I ever would. But I'm seriously considered it with Schwarzenegger. This simple fucking obvious response punctures their whole posturing bullshit bubble.

The Dems are arguing whether unemployment with the package would be temporary or permanent. Schwarzenegger just says "I'll take it." Beautiful. A real emperor-has-no-clothes moment for the GOP.

"Good medicine to the wrong patient ultimately makes the patient sicker," Sanford continued. "What we're dealing with here is a fundamental misdiagnosis of the problem."

There's nothing like letting an insurance-company hack with absolutely no knowledge of medicine make a medical decision for lots of people.

You could benefit from reading up on "ripple effect" in economics. Honey, if we follow your formula, we'll all soon be riding goats.

Posted by: h

I've got a couple of books dealing with the topic of butchering and cooking a goat. I wonder how they'd work on Sedgewick?

he "wins" by currying favor with unhinged Republican activists, while "losing" as his state's economy deteriorates and his constituents suffer.

Which means Obama fails, which means Rush and co succeed... Don`t you just love a two party system 8-( Imagine if half the intersections in the US were closed down with a sign reading "anonymous hold on a cloture vote, try again two years from now"

When is the media going to stop treating these idiot's statements like they have any creditability? They need to be marginalized using shame and laughter instead of treated like "very serious people". The newsreaders would be doing us all a favor if they would grin, groan and chuckle while relaying this insanity.

The Southern White People's Party (GOP) doesn't want to be giving "handouts" to those pesky poor black people. After all, they caused this whole mess by not paying their mortgages, right?

Denying help to your poor and unemployed citizens for politcal grandstanding purposes is indeed a dangerous game. South Carolina, Louisiana and Mississippi are the last places anyone else in the country wants to be like. What a bunch of losers.

In a rare moment of civility on the comment page of a blog, a bunch of people read EC Sedgwick's head-in-the-sand comment about borrowing, and instead of hurling insults, they each left dignified explanations as to why EC was wrong, how EC has what they consider reality exactly backwards.

Technically, the start of my post was not incredibly polite. But he didn't prove me wrong either.

Sanford added, by the way, that supporters of the economic recovery package are "the real fringe" in American politics.

Yes, because RealAmericans get a funny feeling in their pants for Sarah Palin, think Joe the Plunger Jockey is an economic and foreign policy expert, know Obama is an illegal alien and worship at the church of Flush Limpbags. People who think otherwise are dangerous radicals. WOLVERINES!

I am not a republican. I am not a democrat. -EC Sedgwick

It's also fair to say you're not an economist. Nor a historian.

And your rape analogy was fucking obscene. You honestly do not deserve the dignity of any further response.

Technically, the start of my post was not incredibly polite. But he didn't prove me wrong either.

Walker, I admire anyone who had the patience to write anything more polite than "Hey, EC, are you a complete fucking retard?" because that's all I could muster.

Good on ya.

And here I am in Charleston trying to do my best as a public school teacher while they're talking about doubling class sizes. Sanford, get off your high horse and give us what we need.

A tip for EC, turn on spell check at least when you're trying to make a point on a board with many people obviously intellectually superior to you.
I usually let spelling mistakes go but yeesh, when there's one in every post AND the content of the post is uninformed....

That's the best news I've heard in a long time. All their political careers down the toilet! You think they are going to get reelected? I think every unemployed, poor person in Louisiana, Alabama and South Carolina is going to string them up by their teeny, tiny balls!

That makes way for more Democrat Senators and these three jerks can get a job sweeping and mopping their congressional halls. Hell, I bet all three will just claim mental disability and get on the guberment dole.

I'm so sorry for the citizens of Louisiana, Alabama and S Carolina, but these jerks are too stupid to see that they are digging their own political graves.

So, what you're really saying is not only have the Republican Party been taken over by the religious right; they have specifically been taken over by the Seventh Day Adventists who are applying the same philosophy against using modern medicine as towards economics?

All righty then. Kids dying from easily treatable medical problems writ into the entire nation's economic health. Wheee!

I don't think the Seventh Day Adventists are against modern medicine. I think you are confusing them with the Christian Scientists. My son-in-law is a SDA and the only thing slightly out of the Christian "mainstream" is their dietary avoidance of pork (actually, many tend to be vegetarians) and their Saturday sabbath.

walker I see reading comprehension isn't one of your strongt suits.

I hear that Jindal is a bit of a wierdo anyway, conducting exorcisms etc, was he born in India, and is he a hindu? Has anyone seen his birth certificate,since the rethugs have such an interest in Obama's birth certificate.
Also Jindal's state is a welfare (so called) state that gets more back from the Federal Govt each year than is paid in that state in federal taxes.What has he ever done?

Ever since the left took over the country, I've wondered how happy liberals have become. But judging from this site, lefties are just as angry and discombobulated as ever. What is the matter with you people? I suspect that what you want is a guillotine on every corner and total control. Then you would start eating one another.

Perhaps it's best to assume that whatever Mark Sanford a Republican politician says, the opposite is true.

Fix't.

Has anybody seen this so-called Obama forum?

http://www.theobamaforum.com/

It has sections called "OBAMA NATION WATCH ~ Keeping an eye on our enemies" and "The Obama Youth Brigade - The Mandatory Obama Youth Paramilitary Service Program."

Who is behind this? Some right-wing group trying to make Obama supporters look like extremists?

My son-in-law is a SDA and the only thing slightly out of the Christian "mainstream" is their dietary avoidance of pork (actually, many tend to be vegetarians) and their Saturday sabbath.

My god the heretical effrontery. Why don't they just sacrifice virgin children to their great god Moloch at their Saturday gay orgies and drop all the pretense?

msmolly - Ah. Sorry about my confusing the two.

Ever since the left took over the country, I've wondered how happy liberals have become.

Just because we "took over" doesn't mean our work is done, mi amigo. We still have some ass-kicking to do so could you kindly bend over and let us proceed?

Why do we have to hear, every stinkin' day, what loony Republicans think? Who cares? They lost last November, and if they get their way, again in '10 and '12. Since they only have broken ideas in their little bag of useless tricks, their only hope for survival is that the Democrats are successful. Ours too.

In order to get Social Security and unemployment insurance past the Southern Democrats, Roosevelt had to take steps to minimize the number of black Americans who would benefit. Look up the story of the competing Lundeen Bill.

"That's the best news I've heard in a long time. All their political careers down the toilet! You think they are going to get reelected? I think every unemployed, poor person in Louisiana, Alabama and South Carolina is going to string them up by their teeny, tiny balls!

That makes way for more Democrat Senators and these three jerks can get a job sweeping and mopping their congressional halls. Hell, I bet all three will just claim mental disability and get on the guberment dole.

I'm so sorry for the citizens of Louisiana, Alabama and S Carolina, but these jerks are too stupid to see that they are digging their own political graves."

Wish I could join in the reverie over my state getting fucked over. Hopefully it'll work out for the best. Anyway, Sanford's term is up in 2010, and I'm pretty sure he's not eligible for a third. But maybe this'll torpedo the presidential aspirations people keep talking about.

Jindal, Barbour and Sanford have nothing to worry about, since Southerners have a 300-year history of supporting criminals, assassins, and general scum as their "leaders" despite the fact that doing so directly screws the typical Southerner in the ass economically. But those leaders are "bible believin' men."

Remember, 90% of the idiots who fought for the South in the War of Southern Treason had absolutely no social, economic or political reason to support the traitors they called their leaders.

Moron stupidity is in their genes now.