19 months ?? jeebus. what a load of horsesh*t.

No residual force - None.

No GD mercenaries anywhere - None.

Close the embassy and turn it over to the Iraqis.

LEAVE THE OIL BEHIND, amerika !!!

YOU CAN DO IT !!!!!!!!!!!!!!

usa OUT OF IRAQ NOW !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

And the dingbats will spin like dervishes tonight - they'll go apoplectic. Expect the birth certificate nonsense to take off - "Obama is a traitor!"

Wonder what they'll do when they realize that the US has moved the war to Afghanistan/Pakistan, where Taliban is resurgent and Al Qaeda actually is?

It would be nice to get out faster, but not at the risk of (re)creating more deadly chaos - which any sudden and drastic change would likely bring to Iraq's fragile stability. We've had plenty of impulsive and reckless foreign policy decisions in the last 8 years. It sounds like Obama is listening his experts, not his gut.

When did Joke Line grow a brain?

"A dreadful chapter in the history of American policy -- a bloody war of choice launched thoughtlessly"

He says that as if he opposed the war at its inception. Barely anyone in the neo-con media did.

How can you fault Bush for doing something you also advocated? The most you could say is, "Bush's war, OUR noble war, was badly mismanaged"...

Of course, the wingnuts will try to claim this as some sort of validation of Bush's decision to go there in the first place. An effort has to be made to reminde people of their original claims made by Bush, Cheney and Rumsfeld as to how long the war would last and how much it would cost. Not to mention the horrific mismanagement in the following months where the entire country (other than the oil fields) was allowed to be ransacked.

OUT OF IRAQ NOW is absolutely right.

"Combat troops"? Didn't we hear that distinction, oh, back in Vietnam 1965?

But, MSLBs like this one will trumpet this as what Obama promised in the Dem primaries, when he didn't use the "combat troops only" loophole that he did in the general election.

C'mon, Steve, when are MSLBs -- mainstream liberal blogs -- like yours actually going to hold Obama to account on Iraq.

Judis talked about the real left needing to hold Obama's feet to the fire on domestic issues; unfortunately, he overlooked this.

It would be nice to get out faster, but not at the risk of (re)creating more deadly chaos

The deadly chaos in Iraq has been created by our presence, not our absence.

Close the embassy and turn it over to the Iraqis

So we're not going to have diplomatic relations with the country? That's smart.

Also, as opposed to Bush's unilateral invasion and occupation, this withdrawal strategy is widely supported by the Iraqi government. Finally, even if he "removed" troops starting tomorrow, it would take a substantial amount of time to finish the job -- more time than you'd like, I'm sure. But what do you suggest "LEAVE NOW"? Do you have the logistical chops?

This is basically his campaign promise and he seems to be meeting it just past his first month in office.

Obama's Executive security/privilege policy has been a travesty -- but since this is basically what he said he'd do, I don't really understand why you'd scream at him for doing it.

yeah Jay B i do.

you line up every single swingin' richard, and you start marching / loading up. if you f***ing have to, you march all the way to Kuwait. didn't dumsfeld say that Iraq was going to be a 'long hard slog'??

this is how it was done when i served with the 101st from 1984 to 1987 and again in 1989 / 1990 as an 11BPH. we were able to move from Fort Campbell to Fort Lewis to Korea in 24 / 48 hours, from Fort Campbell to Fort Polk to Honduras in 24 / 48 hours, from Fort Campbell to Fort Bragg to Europe / Middle East in 24 / 48 hours etc etc etc. It is not hard to IF YOU REALLY WANT TO and are WILLING TO LEAVE THE OIL BEHIND.

how did you do it when you served your country ?

and closing that $854 Million+ monstrosity that the cheney / bushitheads called an embassy which everybody else sees as the squatting on Iraqi soil by an Imperialist Oil Stealing War Criminal nation is a huge step in the right direction. the usa can have a normal sized embassy just like everybody else.

you assumed that i was saying break off diplomatic relations - note that i did not write that - that's what you get for assuming, Jay B.

yeah Jay B i do.

you line up every single swingin' richard, and you start marching / loading up. if you f***ing have to, you march all the way to Kuwait.

Boy, you're a moron.

You aren't a Republican troll, are you?

30-50K is to "residual" forces as 2-3 years is to "surge". It may make centrist sense politically (just as splitting the difference between 16 and 23 months does) but, from a linguistic/reality POV, it's pure, unadulterated, Bush-speak BS.

you assumed that i was saying break off diplomatic relations - note that i did not write that - that's what you get for assuming, Jay B.

No, instead, i figured you were staking your version of a successful outcome on something incomprehensibly unrealistic -- like "closing the embassy" -- so you can feel sold out when the inevitable doesn't happen.

It's a surefire way to ensure your disappointment in the process, which is the way some people like it.

And sure, I guess in some version of reality an occupying military can bug out en masse, leave everything behind and march to the border, but this also WON'T HAPPEN. And in no way was that EVER on the drawing board -- in fact most of us who opposed Iraq to begin with and wanted an immediate withdrawal, understood that "immediate" meant a number of months (knowing it takes a lot longer to UNFUCK something if you want to UNFUCK it better than you fucked it) -- so it's another perfect solution for you so you can bitch when it inevitably doesn't happen (see? what did I tell you?).

That this withdrawal is happening with the approval of the Iraqi government and is being done under the framework of an agreement between the two countries is also probably problematic somehow.

I agree with the general sentiment of this thread, that we have to not only remove troops, but also our perceived presence as an occupier with ulterior motives (oil).

Turn the Green Zone over to the Iraqis and let them control their oil. Fire Blackwater and KBR, I think the Corps of Engineers is perfectly capable of taking care of our own.

Gwangung, et al:

While I don't agree with the "close the embassy" part,

If you think OUT OF IRAQ NOW is a GOP troll, I'll say you're a Kool-Aid drinking Obamiac.

I've seaid it before and will say it again... the combat/noncombat troops distinction... that's back to Vietnam and "advisors."

It's weaselly, and The One knows it.

He's possibly already better than the Slickster at parsing his words, though.

That said? No, I'm not a GOP troll myself. I'm a left-liberal Green voter pointing out the truth about Obama.

I'm getting a little tired of the euphemism "war of choice". I wonder when we'll be ready to handle the older term for these, i.e.: "war of aggression"