April 15, 2009
DOBSON IS UNDETERRED.... Focus on the Family founder James Dobson found himself at the center of a new controversy (which I may have had something to do with) lately, following reports that he told his staff, "We are awash in evil.... Humanly speaking, we can say we have lost all those battles."
Dobson didn't say he was giving up -- in fact, he said the opposite -- but his comments were a reminder that the religious right doesn't have much to show for the culture war it's waged.
Last night, Dobson chatted with Sean Hannity on Fox News to explain what he meant in more detail.
"The left wing media is itching for members of the pro-family movement to put up white flag and declare the culture war over and to just hand the country to them and so they will take a statement like that, which was made to my staff -- it was not a press release or anything like that -- it was made the staff in reference to the election. And it is true that many of the battles that we have fought for many years were lost -- at least the battles were lost, the war was not lost."
Dobson added, "We're not going anywhere." He went on to concede, "[W]e lost the White House, we lost the House, and we lost the Senate, and we probably will looe in the courts, and we lost almost every department of government ... but the war is not over. Pendulums swing and we'll come back. We're gonna hang in there and, you know, it's not going to be a surrender."
I think there are two broad angles to this. The first is that the reports about Dobson's remarks to his staff, including mine, pointed to what seems like an obvious truth: the conservative culture war hasn't been successful at all. There have been isolated victories (election wins, confirmation of conservative judges, etc.), but the purpose of the "war" was to change the culture. That hasn't happened -- anti-gay animus is not only waning, four states now allow gay marriage; abortion is still legal and a majority of Americans are still pro-choice; school prayer isn't even on the political world's radar screen anymore; pornography is not only a multi-billion industry, it's more accessible than ever; the single fastest growing segment of the American spiritual landscape is non-believers and those with no religious identification.
Second, Dobson seems to acknowledge all of this while reminding us that he and his like-minded allies are going to keep trying. Well, of course they're going to keep trying. No one really expects millions of politically conservative evangelicals to just give up altogether.
The point, though, is whether, in light of the culture war's failures, Dobson & Co. have any realistic hopes of pushing the country in a more intolerant, hateful, theocratic direction. Whether Dobson "hangs in there" or "surrenders" is, I suspect, largely inconsequential. Most of the country has moved on.
—Steve Benen 12:35 PM
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" ... we lost almost every department of government ...."
"almost"? Which departments of government do you freakazoids think you still have control of?
Tell us now, loser, so we can wrest them from your cold, dead fingers.
Posted by: Yellow Dog on April 15, 2009 at 12:49 PM | PERMALINK
dobson's got two problems: he increasingly appears intolerant even those who would be his own constituency — younger evangelicals. and he's fighting the sweep of history. the trend in this country since its founding (and really the world as a whole) is to become more tolerant, not less. there have been and will be moments when it slows, halts or swings in reverse but the forward momentum can't be stopped by dobson or anyone else.
Posted by: mudwall jackson on April 15, 2009 at 12:54 PM | PERMALINK
FYI, Mr. Dobson.
When you lose Iowa, you've lost the country.
Posted by: 2Manchu on April 15, 2009 at 12:54 PM | PERMALINK
dobson could do a real service by urging his christian congregations to start producing some really fine anti-patriarchal 'pron'...
"to show us the way" -- as it were -- toward a healthier sexy society...
Posted by: neill on April 15, 2009 at 12:54 PM | PERMALINK
"[W]e lost the White House, we lost the House, and we lost the Senate,"
This is Dobson's problem. Who is this "we" he is talking about? As the so-called speaker for Christians, he has no business saying this. Christians didn't lose the White House, the House and the Senate -- the Republicans did. I mean really, why should he even say that Christians lost given that President Obama has plainly and repeatedly stated that he is a Christian. And, there are overwhelming numbers of legislators, both Democratic and Republican, who consider themselves to be Christians. But, of course, Dobson and the rest of the white evangelicals don't want to recognize certain types of people as Christians even if they define themselves as followers of Jesus. Dobson's brand of evangelicalism is simply Christian = Republican. And, truth be told, they began losing as soon as that unholy alliance was created for the purpose of ramming their so-called beliefs down the throats of everyone else.
Posted by: PS on April 15, 2009 at 12:54 PM | PERMALINK
Careful. "They" may have taken a "lickin'" of late, but wounded animals, unless dead, tend to be more dangerous. It's an age old addage. The other major, and I mean major prize Dobsonites remain in control of is the MSM. Corporate america has a strangle hold on the "fifth column" and Dobson, as evidenced by this latest media pronouncement, knows that better than anyone and will never point it out or give it up. EVER!
So before we begin the eulogy, let us not forget the power of the press that the left has never ever had control over, or ever will.
Posted by: Stevio on April 15, 2009 at 12:59 PM | PERMALINK
The KKK is still fighting the civil rights "war" too. Oh sure, they've lost a couple of battles, but the war still rages on in their minds!
Posted by: Tree on April 15, 2009 at 1:10 PM | PERMALINK
Memo to James Dobson: You HAD the White House, the House, the Senate and the courts...and you STILL lost.
Posted by: Saint Zak on April 15, 2009 at 1:16 PM | PERMALINK
Dobson is right, pendulums do swing. In about 40 years they should be back in power.
Posted by: jeff on April 15, 2009 at 1:23 PM | PERMALINK
Dobson and his fellow culture warriors will continue the fight as long as there is money to be made by fighting it. Losing so many battles may even help them to improve their cash flow. The faithful are at their most generous when they believe themselves to be a persecuted minority.
Posted by: Okie on April 15, 2009 at 1:27 PM | PERMALINK
When I read the things that are uttered by people like Dobson, I wonder if they've even heard of the New Testament. No interpretation of the teaching of Jesus can make me believe that he intended his followers to take over any country's government or "fight" a "culture war." He taught his followers to offer the salvation story to the world and, if the world rejected it, to move on.
Posted by: Lifelong Dem on April 15, 2009 at 1:35 PM | PERMALINK
WTF! Dobson you old c**ksucker. Since when does a "religion " win an government position unless you are proposing a theocracy. If you want lessons in religious rule go see the Taliban in Afganistan and Pakistan. What a totally warped world view.
Posted by: John R on April 15, 2009 at 1:37 PM | PERMALINK
They can't stop, they are doing god's work, stopping would be an express train straight to hell with the rest of us heathens.
They, like many republicans, have backed themselves in a conger by vilifying everything and everyone else. Now they have no where to go because we are all evil heathens who worship socialism and believe in ruining America. Not fighting us would the truth, and so the fight continues.
Any word on the tea baggers sucess ?
Posted by: ScottW on April 15, 2009 at 1:40 PM | PERMALINK
Shorter Dobson: "We still want people to keep sending us money so we're going to keep saying this stuff even though most folks aren't listening anymore."
Posted by: Curmudgeon on April 15, 2009 at 1:41 PM | PERMALINK
Ah, the Sour Grapes Society is back from the 90s. Next thing you know somebody will get a blow job in a lofty office and somebody will get impeached and we'll have President Palin after all. Isn't that how America works?
Posted by: Capt Kirk on April 15, 2009 at 1:46 PM | PERMALINK
He went on to concede, "[W]e lost the White House, we lost the House, and we lost the Senate, and we probably will looe in the courts, and we lost almost every department of government ."]
Maybe there really IS a God!
Posted by: kc on April 15, 2009 at 2:17 PM | PERMALINK
"There have been isolated victories (election wins, confirmation of conservative judges, etc.), but the purpose of the "war" was to change the culture. That hasn't happened"
Uh, do you remember what the culture in America was like in the 1960s and 70s? Things have gotten a lot more conservative in many ways, just not in the partisan fashion that matters to the culture warriors.
Mike
Posted by: MBunge on April 15, 2009 at 2:55 PM | PERMALINK
Dobson is right, pendulums do swing. In about 40 years they should be back in power.
Yep. But the issues will have changed.
Dobson's predecessors fought for slavery in the 1860s. They fought for prohibition in the early 1900s. They fought for institutionalize racism and sexism in the 1960s. He fought for institutionalized discrimination against gays in the 1990s.
Each battle they lose they'll find another. But they do lose because as the population turns over the old fears die with the old folks. The gay marriage hysteria is skewed to the older populace -- the younger folks don't give a rat's ass about it.
40 years from now Dobson's successor will have found a new group to fight against. He may be gay, or black, or a recent immigrant, or even a she -- because by then those issues won't seem so important anymore.
However, what is constant is this: human DNA is such that about 1/3rd of our population has a tribal gene that causes them to join factions and blindly follow whatever they are told with no regard for facts or obvious contradictions. Belief in superstition and "spirituality" will always be there, no matter how many facts humanity learns to destroy the superstitions. And those who have these genes have a strong need to see everything as an us-good, them-bad dichotomy.
So, until we find a way to engineer the tribal gene out of existence we will always be plagued by the dobsonites and their tribal followers.
Posted by: Cool on April 15, 2009 at 2:57 PM | PERMALINK
Dobson and the others who depended on fired-up religious foot soldiers to fight their culture war were aided by the completely predictable rise of religiosity as the millennium approached, and they are now crestfallen at its (again completely predictable) fall as the millennium recedes and we resume our rational Enlightenment ways.
There is a lesser but still important centennial effect but the millennium is the real doozie.
Posted by: Daddy Love on April 15, 2009 at 3:33 PM | PERMALINK
Aw, Hell Jimmy---you said a bunch of surrender-monkey stuff. You said it to your own staff, for crying out loud---and they're not even your staff any more---remember? You got caught saying the surrender-monkey stuff that makes you out to be the surrender-monkey, and now the whole world knows it.
Face facts, Jimmy---you can't put the piss back in your bladder, once you've pissed in the ocean. Life doesn't work that way.
Deal. With. It.
Posted by: S. Waybright on April 15, 2009 at 3:53 PM | PERMALINK
"Most of the country has moved on."
Steve Benen at 12:35 PM
Which is exactly why these folks will continue to get more and more fanatical in order to make their voices heard. Giving up (or buying in) is not an option, not least because their narrow obsessions are all they have. Add in the extreme level of self-pitying narcissism these folks display and Dobson's statements come as no surprise. IMHO, the best possible outcome for the religious right and the country is some kind of consuming distraction other than politics, something like, oh, Theology of the Body. Maybe some christianist/Kundalini sex work would relax their sphincters a bit.
Posted by: Conrads Ghost on April 15, 2009 at 4:09 PM | PERMALINK
1) Jesus' commision o his followers was to be outsiders--not ot be comfortable. "Give up all that though hast and follow me." He wanted them to put their treasure in heaven, not on earth. "Blessed are you when men shall persecute you and revile you for righteousness' sake." Dobson is a Pharisee.
2) If he believes in the end time (and boy does he!) he should know that all his efforts are foredoomed to failure. The anti-christ is going to unify ALL nations, not 'all nations except for the USA." The only people who will fight at Armageddon will be Jews. According to their beliefs, the only part good Christians play in the end times is to be raptured out of it.
Therefore all these efforts to reform America on Christian principles is worse than useless: the absolute most they can expect to achieve is to postpone Armageddon, and why do they want to do that? And if they still happen to be around and unraptured when the Anti-Christ shows up, it means they're damned anyway.
Posted by: pbg on April 15, 2009 at 4:32 PM | PERMALINK
Pendulums swing and we'll come back
As mentioned by cool it won't matter what Dobson and his contemporaries think. Dobson is correct in the inevitable swing of the pendulum.
Fortunately for the rest of us, by that time he'll be pushing up daisies, along with his cohorts. He'll go to his grave heart broken with the knowledge that he did not succeed.
As mentioned by other commenters: there will be other battles they take on, just not the ones we're currently used to.
They'll be against marrying your pet, and against relationships with your domestic robot, or something along those lines.
Posted by: bruno on April 15, 2009 at 10:56 PM | PERMALINK
When I read the things that are uttered by people like Dobson, I wonder if they've even heard of the New Testament. No interpretation of the teaching of Jesus can make me believe that he intended his followers to take over any country's government or "fight" a "culture war."
Well, in all fairness, didn't some of his own disciples have the same misunderstandings? Throughout the Gospels, they're depicted as operating under the assumption that he was preparing to overthrow the Roman government, establish an earthly kingdom in Jerusalem, and appoint them to rule with him.
Posted by: Brian on April 16, 2009 at 1:54 AM | PERMALINK