Editore"s Note
Tilting at Windmills

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May 22, 2009

NEPOTISM REIGNS.... Mid-day yesterday, I noticed that Mark Halperin had a headline that read, "Round 2: Liz Cheney vs Axe." Round 1, apparently, was President Obama and former Vice President Cheney, and Round 2's "Axe" refers to David Axelrod, Senior White House Advisor to the president.

Halperin added, "The two surrogates weigh in on the Cheney vs. Obama debate shortly after their speeches in MSNBC interviews. Must-see video...."

Notice the problem? Liz Cheney was brought on to offer analysis of her own father's speech, and parrot her dad's criticism of the president. (What a surprise -- she found her dad's argument very persuasive.)

What's more, as part of a full-throated defense of her dad's torture policies, Liz Cheney has been all over the television news. I asked my friends at Media Matters to check on just how many interviews Cheney has done lately. They came up with this list that spans the last 10 days (and today isn't over yet):

* On the May 22 edition of ABC's "Good Morning America"

* On the May 22 edition of MSNBC's "Morning Joe"

* On the May 22 edition of CNN's "American Morning"

* On the May 21 edition of CNN's "AC360"

* On the May 21 edition of Fox News' "Hannity"

* On the May 21 edition of "MSNBC News Live"

* On the May 20 edition of Fox News' "Your World"

* On the May 17 edition of ABC's "This Week with George Stephanopoulos"

* On the May 16 edition of Fox News' "Fox & Friends Saturday"

* On the May 15 edition of Fox News' "On the Record"

* On the May 12 edition of Fox News' "Live Desk"

* On the May 12 edition of MSNBC's "Morning Joe"

That's 12 appearances, in nine and a half days, spanning four networks. (On today's "Morning Joe," Liz Cheney was on for an entire hour -- effectively becoming a co-host of the program.) And this is just television, and doesn't include Liz Cheney's interviews on radio or with print media.

There's no modern precedent for such a ridiculous arrangement. Dick Cheney launches a crusade against the White House, and major outlets look for analysis from Cheney's daughter? Who everyone already realizes agrees with everything he says about torture?

This is just crazy.

Steve Benen 11:05 AM Permalink | Trackbacks | Comments (67)

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Comments

god damn dick cheney's shit-filled soul to hell.

Posted by: neill on May 22, 2009 at 11:11 AM | PERMALINK

I say put Malia and Sasha up against her.

Posted by: Stefan on May 22, 2009 at 11:12 AM | PERMALINK

She was listed on This Week as a "Republican strategist." Based on their current performance, I think my 45-year-old stuffed toy kitten Snowball qualifies as one of those.

Posted by: Mustang Bobby on May 22, 2009 at 11:12 AM | PERMALINK

Liz; Nice work if you can get it. They payoff must be great. Glad you were able to sell your soul at such a good return.

Posted by: John R on May 22, 2009 at 11:13 AM | PERMALINK

She's just working the family business: war profiteering. That's all this is, my friends.

Posted by: glutz78 on May 22, 2009 at 11:15 AM | PERMALINK

I am getting more and more incensed every time I see Liz Cheney on TV. Why is she given this platform? I had to turn off Morning Joe this morning after about 10 minutes of her "co-hosting".

Why aren't Democrats coming out full steam against the two Cheneys and their idiocy? Democratic Senators and Congressmen should be vocal about Cheney, as long as he's completely disregarded decorum about speaking out against successors.

The conventional wisdom, I suspect, is to let Cheney and his daughters continue to speak lies and treason and assume the public is wise enough to see through the bullshit. I don't think that works. We should be mounting campaigns against the Cheneys.

Posted by: phoebes-in-santa fe on May 22, 2009 at 11:23 AM | PERMALINK

I want to know what Cheney's other daughter thinks.

Posted by: Simon S. on May 22, 2009 at 11:23 AM | PERMALINK

Who the fuck is Liz Cheney? No, really.

Posted by: ckelly on May 22, 2009 at 11:23 AM | PERMALINK


Oh now Obama can play the persecuted messiah. Perfect. I hope he cries like Clinton.

Posted by: hmmm on May 22, 2009 at 11:25 AM | PERMALINK

Less about nepotism and more about justifying Liz Cheney's appearance. Sure, nobody cares about her opinions, but if she's commenting on her father, then having her as a guest is at least relevant.

Except, as you say, it's irregular (if not unprecedented) for offspring to speak in defense of parents who are capable of defending themselves.

Posted by: Grumpy on May 22, 2009 at 11:26 AM | PERMALINK

Why aren't Democrats coming out full steam against the two Cheneys and their idiocy?

Because they apparently can't get booked on anyone's show. Morning Joe, for example, has Harold Ford on every day so they can say they got the "Democrat" view of things. No need to have any additional Democratic voices!

Posted by: Lifelong Dem on May 22, 2009 at 11:28 AM | PERMALINK

What neill said.

Posted by: chocolate Thunder on May 22, 2009 at 11:28 AM | PERMALINK

Oh now Obama can play the persecuted messiah.

He's not the one making the rounds with his daughter, whining and trying to re-write history. Talk about a persecution complex. Hmmmm, coward.

Posted by: Allan Snyder on May 22, 2009 at 11:29 AM | PERMALINK

Gotta love that liberal media, huh?

Posted by: r_m on May 22, 2009 at 11:30 AM | PERMALINK

phoebes-in-santa fe: "Why aren't Democrats coming out full steam against the two Cheneys and their idiocy?" Because some Democrats are too busy in their circular firing squad over Obama's "preventive detention" proposal, and the rest are busy worrying that some terrorist might be put in their state's prison system.

Posted by: Sapient on May 22, 2009 at 11:31 AM | PERMALINK

Is there a pattern here. Liz Cheney, Meagan McCain - proDaddy. But Elizabeth Edward writes a book about healthcare (I guess), and all the media wants to know abaout is her husband's infidelity.

Posted by: Danp on May 22, 2009 at 11:31 AM | PERMALINK

it's now a Torture Tour Chore for Liz Cheney- more whitewashing apologisms until the next mynah-bird shiny comes into the next news cycle.

Posted by: johnnymags on May 22, 2009 at 11:32 AM | PERMALINK

I say put Malia and Sasha up against her.

"Yeah. Unless I'm politically tone deaf, the whole country is just waiting to see those Obama kids taken down a peg."

Posted by: jonas on May 22, 2009 at 11:38 AM | PERMALINK

enough talk! Where are the indictments against Cheney?

Posted by: mljohnston on May 22, 2009 at 11:44 AM | PERMALINK

MSNBC, the so-called liberal network, is simply selling a point-of-view held by the guys who make up GE's Board of Directors. Its the same with Disney's Board of Directors and ABC, and all the rest. This is a limited few among the very wealthy stuffing their self-centered ideology down our throats.

Steve is doing a great job of getting the word out about the bias that the traditional media has. The more people know about the scam they're running (including the lie about liberal bias), the less seriously these so-called "news" outlets will be taken among independents.

Posted by: Chris on May 22, 2009 at 11:44 AM | PERMALINK

Are there any other Cheney defenders out there? Maybe Liz is all they can find. If that is so, they ought to note that they have been unable to find any unbiased analysts who are willing to back the Dick, so they have resorted to booking his daughter.

Posted by: majun on May 22, 2009 at 11:45 AM | PERMALINK

seems everyone is missing an obvious point:
Dick is setting his daughter up for a career in Republican politics. None of this is about him or about Obama. This has all been about Liz.This is setting his kid up in the family business..the economy is rough and she needs a job. Have we heard her opinions this loudly before? She is not the one with the gay. she is a lawyer. Her husband is a lawyer with homeland security. She worked at state department. she co-chaired a presidential campaign (ok ok so it was Fred's). Face facts folks. She is a rising star in our current mold of american nepotism politics. (Just like an unknown son of Bobby is now a senate candidate. Torches being passed, etc)

Hell my dad found me a job when i was 19. I helped my daughter too.

it is a fool who looks at a finger pointing at the moon.

Posted by: glichte on May 22, 2009 at 11:47 AM | PERMALINK

You mean to tell me that big, bad, macho, scary,soothsayer of doom Dickless Cheney has to have his DAUGHTER go on tour to defend him?!! Oh, how appropo is that? Letting daddy's little girl go out and fight daddy's fight. Dick proves yet again yet a cowardly, rank hypocrite and toothless bastard he is. Quick DICK, go hide yourself away again in an undisclosed location for a few years. Running and hiding, getting the women in the family to fight and defend him. Not that women aren't as capable, if not more so, than a man. But coming from him, Mr. Scary Macho Mephistopheles himself. C'mon sheeple, wake up!! This man is a war criminal, death profiteer, craven, soulless, arrogant, selfish bastard that is using the people of this nation to feed his own bottomless pit of ego and greed.

Posted by: In what respect, Charlie? on May 22, 2009 at 12:03 PM | PERMALINK

I say put Dick Cheney in Supermax for his crimes against this country and that will be the only place Liz can visit him. Oh, they (the prisoners) are not afforded too many visits even by family.

Mary MacElveen

Posted by: Mary MacElveen on May 22, 2009 at 12:07 PM | PERMALINK

The big problem is that everybody is taking cable news far to seriously. Remember this, because the people working for the networks sure know it, political news isn't news anymore. Political news exists merely to sell soap. It is entertainment. It is kind of like reality programing but nobody ever gets voted off the island. The news divisions of the various networks report to the entertainment division heads. Those bean counters only have one idea--increase ratings to make more money. Liz Cheney is entertaining. The false equivalence between a war criminal like Dick Cheney and our popular President is entertaining. Yesterday's "thrilla near the hilla" was entertaining and might have actually sold some soap.

Trust me, unless something outside of the control of the entertainment divisions happens, you can take the summer off and come back in the fall without missing a beat. You will be able to pick up the story lines in a heart beat. Cable television politics is just like Desperate Housewives, but the women aren't as pretty.

I am going to tour some wineries. Have a great weekend.

Posted by: Ron Byers on May 22, 2009 at 12:13 PM | PERMALINK

"What's more, as part of a full-throated defense of her dad's torture policies, Liz Cheney has been all over the television news. I asked my friends at Media Matters to check on just how many interviews Cheney has done lately."

Now you know how I felt at the sudden emergence as of Meagan McCain as someone who views I should take seriously, despite the fact that her every appearance exposed her as an empty head liberal who couldn't string a couple of coherent sentences together, which is about the best you can hope for with liberals. (See Lawerence O'Donnell's diatribe against Cheney's speech yesterday for a perfect example of the inability of liberals to debate anything without resorting to ad hominem attacks.)

And unlike Ms. McCain, at least Ms. Cheney has the ability to articulate her position effectively enough that it has Steve whinning about how much exposure she's getting. lol

Posted by: Chicounsel on May 22, 2009 at 12:16 PM | PERMALINK

I thought the crux of Dick Cheney's argument was that torture produced intelligence that led to the disruption of terrorist plots, but Obama won't release the memos proving that it did so. Dick Cheney's claim is based on the fact that he had access to the memos when he was Vice President.

Did Liz Cheney have access to the memos as well? If not, why would anybody care what she says? Beyond the fact that she's the Vice President's daughter, which is apparently enough to get her across the pitifully low threshold for cable tv "news", how is she even remotely relevant to the conversation?

To take this one step further, it's amazing to me that Dick Cheney can say we should take his word while keeping a straight face. That and Iraq had weapons of mass destruction, was affiliated with Al Qaeda, we would be greeted as liberators, that the war will pay for itself, and on and on and on. Excepting perhaps Bill Kristol, is there any public figure in America with less credibility than Dick Cheney?

Posted by: Nick on May 22, 2009 at 12:20 PM | PERMALINK

I used to get all up in arms about this sort of thing. Then I realized I am a political junkie, and that not many other people watch the cable shows and read the blogs like myself. The rest of America has other more pressing things to deal with. Trust me, when you are struggling to keep your job or your home, the last thing you are doing is sitting at home in the morning watching Liz Cheney.

Also, Americans on '06 and '08 overwhelmingly voted for Democrats, despite the supposed genius of KKKArl Rove, despite the obvious right wing slant of the MSM, etc.

I have a little more faith in the public than I used to. Plus the old adage still rings true, that if you give someone enough rope they'll hang themselves. At some point this Liz character will be just another bobbling head bimbo to most of the public.

Relax folks, the torture tour can go on crying and complaining, the coward can send his daughter out for whatever reason, but it's not going to make a difference.

Posted by: citizen_pain on May 22, 2009 at 12:22 PM | PERMALINK

ON NPR this morning, after noting yesterday's "dueling speeches," the "newsperson" commented, "I wonder who'll win," Obama or Cheney? Hmmm, who might that be, the one with no official office and no power, or the President of the United States, with executive authority to implement his will (authority vastly expanded, by the way, by Cheney).

Posted by: mrgumby2u on May 22, 2009 at 12:27 PM | PERMALINK

This is a limited few among the very wealthy stuffing their self-centered ideology down our throats.

Steve is doing a great job of getting the word out about the bias that the traditional media has. The more people know about the scam they're running (including the lie about liberal bias), the less seriously these so-called "news" outlets will be taken among independents.
Posted by: Chris on May 22, 2009 at 11:44 AM | PERMALINK

Right you are. That is why we need to support independent media, it is our way out of the Corporo-Repig controlled media swamp. If we want the media to put out information that is more than corporate spin trying to maintain the same entities in positions of power, then it seems that we have come to a point in this country where we have to be willing to pay for truth. Bullshit is free, truth comes at a price. If you haven't ever supported FSTV or LINK TV, now is the time. CURRENT TV, UCTV, NAUHS - The Universityhouse Channel, and the DOCumentary channel are also very good and worthy of support. Take back the media!!! They are our airwaves!

Posted by: Get Real on May 22, 2009 at 12:28 PM | PERMALINK

Relax folks, the torture tour can go on crying and complaining, the coward can send his daughter out for whatever reason, but it's not going to make a difference.

What I am up in arms about is that fact that some narcissitic asshole with a 22% or something approval rating during the last lap of his reign in office, is somehow still relevent with the possiblity to still shape future policy?

He didn't actually do a good job. In fact, if no one noticed the country is in really rough shape, his administration sort of crashed and burned under its own weight.

Usually when a pilot crashes a 33 milliion dollar plane, they are grounded. Will somone please ground this son of a bitch?

Posted by: Mick on May 22, 2009 at 12:51 PM | PERMALINK

Trying desperately to make sure daddy isn't prosecuted...creating reasonable doubt.

torture didn't work, was done for political reasons, detained anyone that might make a connection to Sadam and 9/11, and WAS AGAINST THE LAW, Cheney has no excuse for breaking it.

They only show up on right wing media shows who promote the republican agenda. Where is the outrage...if party roles were reversed we'd never hear the end of it.

Posted by: bjobotts on May 22, 2009 at 1:08 PM | PERMALINK

Will someone please tell Ms. Cheney that her middle name is "draft deferment"? It's really the only reason she's on the planet.

Posted by: Roger the Cabin Boy on May 22, 2009 at 1:09 PM | PERMALINK

I find it troubling that Liz Cheney knows ANYTHING about her father's work. I'm in the Army and even at my level, giving your family unnecessary information is not allowed. I can't imagine what unauthorized information she has. That or she's just out there spewing completely uninformed opinions.

In the words on Jon Stewart... How about a nice up of shut the f- up.

Posted by: Caleb on May 22, 2009 at 1:13 PM | PERMALINK

I am nothing more than a Repiglican shit stain .. forgive me for my spluttering stupidity ... god i love the smell of shit in the morning

Posted by: Chicounsel on May 22, 2009 at 1:16 PM | PERMALINK

mrgumby2u is right about the "news analysis" between Steve Inskeep and Ari Shapiro today on "Morning Edition." The prevailing wisdom at NPR is: "The republicans must have a valid point, otherwise they wouldn't be yelling at us all the time." Mama Lynne Cheney used to spend an unusual amount of time visiting NPR headquarters. Today we see the unbiased results.

Posted by: Jay Schiavone on May 22, 2009 at 1:19 PM | PERMALINK

I say put Dick Cheney in Supermax for his crimes against this country and that will be the only place Liz can visit him. Oh, they (the prisoners) are not afforded too many visits even by family.

Mary MacElveen

Good idea, Mary. I think Dick, "Mr. I'm the only guy strong enough to make the tough decisions to keep America safe", Cheney should be thrown in a Supermax so that he can personally keep a close eye on the Gitmo prisoners. That should put all the GOP concerns about terrorists getting loose and running free in the streets to rest. Who better to guard the terrorists than Mr.Macho himself?

Posted by: about time on May 22, 2009 at 1:19 PM | PERMALINK

Why is no one asking what Jenna Bush thinks? That's what I want to know.

Posted by: Arachnae on May 22, 2009 at 1:19 PM | PERMALINK

Well, Dick Cheney learned everything he knows from the original Tricky Dick, and one of Nixon's last-ditch efforts to win sympathy during the Watergate hearings was to send Julie Nixon Eisenhower out to stick up for him.

Posted by: T-Rex on May 22, 2009 at 1:24 PM | PERMALINK

Oh, Steve, you're so cynical. Don't you remember all those times in the '90s that they brought on Hillary to critique on of Bill's speeches?

Posted by: Steve M. on May 22, 2009 at 1:52 PM | PERMALINK

"Notice the problem? Liz Cheney was brought on to offer analysis of her own father's speech, and parrot her dad's criticism of the president. (What a surprise -- she found her dad's argument very persuasive.)"

How's this:

"Notice the problem? David Axelrod was brought into offer analysis of his own boss's speech, and parrot his boss's criticism of the Bush administration. (What a surprise-- he found his boss's argument very persuasive).

I love unjustified indignance, but when it's from an alleged professional writer, it's even better.

Posted by: RH Potfry on May 22, 2009 at 2:21 PM | PERMALINK

In an aristocracy, this is normal. So what's your point?

Posted by: lambert strether on May 22, 2009 at 2:23 PM | PERMALINK

Most MSM is an incestuous relationship anyway. Why wouldn't they want Dick's daughter on? Just keeps it in the family...

Posted by: Last Dem on May 22, 2009 at 2:23 PM | PERMALINK

"god damn dick cheney's shit-filled soul to hell."

Whoa. Somebody owes people with shit-filled souls an apology.

Posted by: Steve S. on May 22, 2009 at 2:30 PM | PERMALINK

What no one seems to understand is that a lot of this Cheney offensive is about Liz Cheney. As someone who knows them, I can tell you that the Cheneys have enormously high hopes for Liz -- even to the White House. Yeah, I gag, too. This critique of Obama is only partly about refurbishing the Bush-Cheney legacy. It is primarily about Cheney re-establishing his own identity as the leading bad-ass of Republican politics, which will sell well in a large portion of the party. And it allows Liz Cheney a large number of platforms to defend her father's view, establish her own identity nationally, win admirers (yeah, I'm gagging again) and prepare for her own political future. Liz will run for either the Senate or a governorship within the next two election cycles and after that watch out -- she has her eyes on the prize of the presidency in 2016 or just beyond -- and no I am not kidding. (Final gag.)

Posted by: Scott on May 22, 2009 at 3:04 PM | PERMALINK

Cheney and his obnoxious daughter can come on TV every day from now on, but torture is torture, water boarding has been torture for hundreds of years. Cheney thinking he can save himself by trying to convince the american population that torture saved them is a no hope, we should investigate everything & all of his crimes. Lawrence Wilkerson, Colin Powells chief of staff said 'now we know who was running the white house from 2001 -2005. Meanwhile the spanish judge is working on a prosecution & it was said yesterday that they might rethink it if Mr Obama (has he has been doing) changes the Cheney tactics.

Posted by: JS on May 22, 2009 at 3:06 PM | PERMALINK

She has her daddy's mouth, poor woman.

Posted by: MsInformed on May 22, 2009 at 3:16 PM | PERMALINK

Oops. I meant poor bitch.

Posted by: MsInformed on May 22, 2009 at 3:27 PM | PERMALINK

Why isn't this man in jail?

Posted by: baba durag on May 22, 2009 at 3:32 PM | PERMALINK

Just refer to her as deferment # 5!

Posted by: Mark Provost on May 22, 2009 at 3:33 PM | PERMALINK

Unfortunately it is Obama's own weak response to the mounting evidence of criminal acts of torture sanctioned by Cheney and others in the Bush regime that is fueling the Cheney family PR blitz.

As all the Republican supporters of torture know, torture is out and out wrong, immoral, ineffective, and clearly and unarguably a criminal violation of U.S. law. They know that a tough Obama response that moved inexorably to criminal prosecutions would be a disaster for the Republican party, maybe for a generation. So the strategy seems to be to play to that sizable block of Americans who are ignorant of U.S. law, and still consumed with getting revenge against those they consider a force of evil. These Americans are comfortable with torture of particularly heinous criminals like the al Qeada perpetrators of 9/11. It's unfortunate but true that many Americans feel this way. The Cheneys are counting on that group to prevent Obama, who is extremely sensitive to the electorate, from taking decisive action that may threaten his popularity. Perhaps if there were not an economic crisis which could also sink his presidency, Obama would be more willing to stand firm against torture. So far he has refused.

Posted by: bobc on May 22, 2009 at 4:37 PM | PERMALINK

Mary Cheney's only qualification as an "expert" is that she was presumably spawned by the sperm of Dick Cheney, but under the ordinary rules of mainstream journalism that should be a disqualification, not a qualification.

Posted by: Helen Highwater on May 22, 2009 at 4:44 PM | PERMALINK

I'm typically a big fan of Mr. Benen's work, but I have to agree with RH Potfry here. You cant complain about Liz Cheney being brought in to analyze the speech unless you complain about Axelrod, too.

And really, I see nothing to complain about. The media wanted to play up this Obama vs Cheney thing, so they got surrogates to do a rebuttal.

I think it's ridiculous how Washington has become such a royalty, with politics being the family business for some folks. I mean, when Tim Russert's kid started getting put on shows, the whole idea became a joke.

But that said, I dont see anything wrong with Liz Cheney being the defender of Dick. Focus on the Cheney arguments, not the messenger.

Posted by: TG Chicago on May 22, 2009 at 4:52 PM | PERMALINK

President Obama referred to supermax prisons as to where the detainees would go. Me, I think it's a great idea and even wrote a column on it: http://www.marymacelveen.com/blog/_archives/2009/5/22/4194418.html Seeing the conditions at these prisons is a perfect place for Dick Cheney to go.

All the best,
Mary MacElveen

Posted by: Mary MacElveen on May 22, 2009 at 5:46 PM | PERMALINK

If that's the most informed, and most convencing person they can put up.......

Posted by: Marnie on May 22, 2009 at 8:43 PM | PERMALINK

The most common answer I've received to "Why do you hate Dick Cheney so much?" is usually "Well, if I have to explain it to you, you're too far gone to be helped."

The irrational hatred of Dick Cheney will someday be a case study in runaway group-think.

Posted by: RH Potfry on May 22, 2009 at 9:07 PM | PERMALINK

Tell Liz to get her old man's ass to the Hague--I have business with him.

Posted by: War Crimes Prosecutor on May 22, 2009 at 9:07 PM | PERMALINK

You cant complain about Liz Cheney being brought in to analyze the speech unless you complain about Axelrod, too.

Apples and oranges. Axelrod's qualifications for this sort of analysis are a bit more extensive than just being some political figure's daughter.

Posted by: Realist on May 23, 2009 at 9:21 AM | PERMALINK

Sadly, someday Cheney will be proven correct in recognizing that tough measures are required to get information out of tough people. But WHEN that happens (a biological attack, etc.), you liberal shitheads will think up some kind of excuse. The REAL question is about the no-bid logistics contract given to Halliburton. I think the answer to THAT one would send Cheney (and probably Bush as well) to prison. A worthwhile investigation could well also send leading Democrats to the same place. That's why that WILL NEVER BE INVESTIGATED.

Posted by: Steve on May 23, 2009 at 9:45 AM | PERMALINK

And as for waterboarding being torture; I was watching a DVD of matches from an old local wrestling program a while back. I KNEW I'd seen waterboarding before: Dick the Bruiser, God bless his soul, was doing it to an opponent outside the ring on the announcers table! Oh yeah. Torture. Right. Give me 15 minutes with these Arab shitheads (and yes, ALL 19 OF THE 9/11 HIJACKERS WERE OF ONE DEMOGRAPHIC GROUP-YOUNG TO MIDDLE-AGED ARAB MALES) and you'd see some "enhanced interrogation". You'd also GET INFORMATION! I'd start with the physical. We'd then progress to what would happen to them (and their families) if their answers are found to be FALSE (disinformation-NOT information, for you bunch of under-educated tools)!! Then, if their answers are found to be false, THOSE THINGS WOULD HAPPEN. I'll bet the next raghead I'd interview would be EAGER to tell the truth!! Al Qaeda recruiting tool? Yeah, right!! Step right up and THIS TOO, CAN BE YOU!

Posted by: Steve on May 23, 2009 at 10:11 AM | PERMALINK

So Steve, you're OK with torturing someone's children to elicit information.
Just checking.
You dishonorable piece of crap, somewhere right now an Islamist recruiter is printing out this very post to convince a young Muslim that Americans are the rabid Christian demons they were calling us all along.
This very post. Or did you think this was your own little echo chamber?
You've just helped befoul the American Flag with the blood of children.

Posted by: pbg on May 23, 2009 at 11:07 AM | PERMALINK

@Steve, 10:11 am: Hey, tough guy! Why don't you put down your dick and go join some Syrian death squad? No point in Jack Bauer fantasizing when you can make it all come true. Go ahead... what's stopping you?

Posted by: JenJen on May 23, 2009 at 2:04 PM | PERMALINK
WASHINGTON - Former Vice President Dick Cheney’s high-profile speech Thursday defending the Bush administration’s policies for interrogating suspected terrorists contained omissions, exaggerations and misstatements, according to intelligence officals and the historical record, including:

Cheney said waterboarding and other harsh interrogation techniques produced information that “prevented the violent death of thousands, if not hundreds of thousands, of innocent people.” He also quoted Director of National Intelligence Adm. Dennis Blair as saying the information gave U.S. officials a “deeper understanding of the al-Qaeda organization.”

In his statement April 21, however, Blair said “these techniques hurt our image around the world, the damage they have done to our interests far outweighed whatever benefit they gave us and they are not essential to our national security.” A 2004 CIA inspector general’s investigation found no conclusive proof that the information helped thwart any “specific imminent attacks,” according to one of four secret Bush-era memos released last month. And FBI Director Robert Muller said in December that he didn’t think that the techniques disrupted any attacks.

Cheney said only “ruthless enemies of this country” were detained by U.S. operatives overseas and taken to secret U.S. prisons.

A 2008 McClatchy investigation, however, found that the vast majority of Guantanamo detainees captured in 2001 and 2002 in Afghanistan and Pakistan were innocent citizens or low-level fighters of little intelligence value who were turned over to American officials for money or because of personal or political rivalries.

http://www.bostonherald.com

Yep. He's a self-serving liar.

Posted by: trex on May 24, 2009 at 1:23 AM | PERMALINK

"Apples and oranges. Axelrod's qualifications for this sort of analysis are a bit more extensive than just being some political figure's daughter."

How can David Axelrod be qualified to provide unbiased analysis of his boss's speech? He can't.

Or is this one of those moments I love so much where folks on the left argue that someone can't be biased if they are right?

Posted by: RH Potfry on May 24, 2009 at 2:23 AM | PERMALINK

@Steve, 10:11 am: Did you have a "happy ending" when you got done writing that post? That was some of the best torture porn I've ever seen.

Posted by: Roger the Cabin Boy on May 24, 2009 at 10:57 PM | PERMALINK

Dan Froomkin does a succinct job of critically analyzing Cheney's litany of lies:

Cheney's Desperate Defense

http://voices.washingtonpost.com/white-house-watch/cheneys-desperate-defense.html#more

Posted by: GordM on May 26, 2009 at 9:39 AM | PERMALINK

Here something special:

Bush's Shocking Biblical Prophecy Emerges: God Wants to "Erase" Mid-East Enemies "Before a New Age Begins"

By Clive Anderson, CounterPunch. Posted May 25, 2009.

Bush explained to French Pres. Chirac that the Biblical creatures Gog and Magog were at work in the Mid-East and must be defeated.
_________________________________________________
Bush believed the time had now come for that battle, telling Chirac:

"This confrontation is willed by God, who wants to use this conflict to erase his people's enemies before a New Age begins".

The story of the conversation emerged only because the Elyse Palace, baffled by Bush's words, sought advice from Thomas Romer, a professor of theology at the University of Lausanne. Four years later, Romer gave an account in the September 2007 issue of the university's review, Allez savoir. The article apparently went unnoticed, although it was referred to in a French newspaper.

The story has now been confirmed by Chirac himself in a new book, published in France in March, by journalist Jean Claude Maurice. Chirac is said to have been stupefied and disturbed by Bush's invocation of Biblical prophesy to justify the war in Iraq and "wondered how someone could be so superficial and fanatical in their beliefs".

http://www.alternet.org/politics/140221/bush%27s_shocking_biblical_prophecy_emerges%3A_god_wants_to_%22erase%22_mid-east_enemies_%22before_a_new_age_begins%22/

Posted by: GordM on May 26, 2009 at 9:41 AM | PERMALINK




 

 

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