"That's a stunning act of faith in American democracy."

Or they just happen to be poor with few prospects for a livelihood outside of signing up to be part of a killing machine.

I like your Memorial Day thoughts, Hilzoy. Thanks.

It's always worth reading (if somewhat depressing)Arthur Silber

we owe everyone who serves the effort to be the best citizens we can be, and to elect the people who are most likely to exercise good judgment about whether and when to ask them to risk their lives.

We, and especially our nonSupreme Court, let down our service men and women, in a supreme way, the day that bu$h and his DICK sidekick were sent to the White House. For that, I am ashamed. For that, I grieve for the dead. For that, I ask God for forgiveness.

from our perspective, we appreciate your sentiments but it'd be nice if you hadn't been so flippant about the detainee abuse photos issue. the AG photos directly led to thousands of American casualties.

No, the illegal invasion led directly to thousands of American and Iraqi casualties.

from our perspective, we appreciate your sentiments but it'd be nice if you hadn't been so flippant about the detainee abuse photos issue. the AG photos directly led to thousands of American casualties.

Actually, it's pretty obvious that abusing the detainees ultimately led to casualties arising from acts of revenge -- and let's be clear, by abuse we mean humiliation, beatings, torture of family members in front of one another, rapes, and murders.

If anything, the efforts to bring all involved to justice would might have proven our good faith to the Iraqis and lessened casualties.

Too bad the investigation was stymied by the Bush Administration and the Republicans in Congress.

the AG photos directly led to thousands of American casualties.

Hate to tell you, but the Iraqis knew about the abuses at AG long before those photos made their way to the US. What, you thought that the people being abused wouldn't tell their friends and families what was going on? You thought the families who received their loved ones' battered bodies back from "detention" didn't figure it out? These are people who lived with Saddam's abuses for decades. They know how it works and what the signs are.

Only you would add a bogus reference to suicides in a Memorial Day post. Previous such "reports" have all been shown to be bogus since the military age male has the highest suicide rate and the other reports have all shown the military rate to be less than civilians of the same age. It should be classified with that idiotic press release a few years ago about domestic violence peaking on Super Bowl Sunday. Keep trying, though. I'm sure Obama will soon convince North Korea to give up its nukes.

Agreed. God bless our men and women who serve. May we provide leaders worthy of them.

Only you would add a bogus reference to suicides in a Memorial Day post.

Silly hilzoy, taking the word of the Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff that this is a serious problem over that of a random internet commenter who presents no proof whatsoever. Clearly the random internet commenter knows much more about what's going on in all four branches of the service than the Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff who only has "facts" and "statistics" on his side.

In which hilzoy demonstrates that if one is sufficiently lacking in class, there is nothing which cannot be exploited for a bit of Bush/Republican bashing.

Yes, an immense amount of respect to all those who die repelling aggressors, to the Finns and Hungarians who fought against the Soviets, to the Americans in WWII... but why this automatic exaltation of all military personnel whatever the circumstance? It's not healthy. It's a hallmark of certain systems that at one time I didn't think the U.S. would ever trend to.

Yes, an immense amount of respect to all those who die repelling aggressors,

Speaking of which, meteor blades reminds us of one group of Americans who died attempting to repel aggressors who go largely unremembered on the last Monday in May.

Meteor Blades along with Billmon, my favorites of the blogosphere. Also h/t Digby. But by and large best commentators (yours truly excepted) at WM.

Soldiers who die after being loaded on the plane out of Iraq aren't counted either. So the figure is obviously way higher than 4300.

if one looks at *all* the wars the U.S. has engaged in the idea of memorializing its troops looks considerably less attractive, as does the troops'"faith in democracy."

Hmmm, what to believe? The word from the Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff or that from a fellow who once, briefly, donned the anchor and globe as a second louie and hummed the melody of that love French tune written by Offenbach and gets his info from notes left in bottles washing ashore at Newport Beach? Close call.

And upthread, many of those who joined that "killing machine", as you have, incorrectly, labled it, defended your sorry rear. There have been millions of regular citizens, women and men, who have served honorably in both war and peace time to give you the right to post such garbage. Yesterday, was our version of Remembrance Day, the olden Decoration Day. Better to have left some flowers or poppies than spew such venom.

Thank you, Ms Hilzoy, for your thoughts.

"the AG photos directly led to thousands of American casualties."

No, your last CinC lying to save his job led to thousands of American casualties (and in fact more American deaths than 9/11 - quite a feat). Lions led by chickenhawks, rather than donkeys, being the issue here.