June 19, 2009
SO MUCH FOR 'WATER'S EDGE'..... I remember a time -- I believe it's known as "2001 through 2008" -- when congressional Republicans believed politics had to end at the water's edge. They also believed that the United States couldn't have individual members of Congress coming up with their own foreign policies -- these responsibilities were in the hands of the president.
Ah, the good old days.
House Republican Caucus Chairman Mike Pence (Ind.) has spent the last few days advocating in support of a resolution, weighing in on developments in Iran. Pence has said he realizes where President Obama has "drawn the line," but he "respectfully disagrees" with the administration. Pence added that the U.S. can't "stay neutral," so his resolution is necessary to "condemn the violence."
In our reality, Obama has already expressed "deep concerns about the election," and publicly shared his concerns about "violence directed at peaceful protesters," but maybe Pence wasn't paying attention. Maybe he doesn't care. Maybe he wants to intervene in such a way as to undermine U.S. foreign policy, just to see what happens.
After watching Pence grandstand on (where else?) Fox News this morning, Tom Ricks expressed concern that Iranians might not realize why it's important to ignore Mike Pence.
I just hope that Iranian protestors know not to take this clown seriously.
This problem goes to the essence of strategy: A "tough" stance that Fox's anchors are pushing might feel good, but it likely would be unproductive. A sober stance of the sort that Obama has taken is more difficult but likely more effective in the long run.
I was cautiously optimistic that Republicans would realize this, especially after Obama's approach was endorsed by prominent conservatives who focus on foreign policy (Lugar, Kissinger, Sick, et al). Alas, a few too many GOP leaders have other ideas.
Watching this unfold, I am reminded of something Matt Yglesias wrote earlier this year: "The larger issue ... is that Mike Pence is a moron, and any movement that would hold the guy up as a hero is bankrupt.... I would refer you to this post from September about the earth-shattering ignorance and stupidity of Mike Pence.... [I]t's really staggering. In my admittedly brief experience talking to him, his inability to grasp the basic contours of policy question was obvious and overwhelming."
Update: The administration apparently worked with House Dems "to moderate [the] fire-breathing resolution circulated by Republicans to rebuke Iran for its post-election crackdown on dissent." After changes were made, the White House said it was fine with the resolution, and the measure passed this afternoon, 405 to 1.
—Steve Benen 12:45 PM
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pence: it's all about using people for his own political agenda.
literally, pence is one of those american 'statesmen' who would just as soon kill all iranians as support them -- or as the phrase goes "look at them."
he is a moron, and a corrupt evil narcissistic shithead.
Posted by: neill on June 19, 2009 at 12:51 PM | PERMALINK
Self-indulgence taken to a whole new level: Making anyone you care about in the world, American or Iranian, worse off so that you can feel good about yourself and pretend that you are tougher than the president. I know it hardly bears repeating, but these people are so inward looking it's frightening.
Posted by: Barbara on June 19, 2009 at 12:55 PM | PERMALINK
Pence is the representative for the district right next to me. And you'd be stunned at his popularity. Even two of my golfing buddies are big fans.
Doesn't say much for the citizens of Indiana nor my golf group.
Mike Pence is a pox on our country. A friggin national disgrace.
Posted by: jharp on June 19, 2009 at 12:56 PM | PERMALINK
Someone should drop Pence off at a carpet bazaar in Tehran and tell him it's Kokomo. And maybe leave Lindsey Graham and John McCain with him.
Posted by: Danp on June 19, 2009 at 12:58 PM | PERMALINK
"This problem goes to the essence of strategy: A 'tough' stance that Fox's anchors are pushing might feel good, but it likely would be unproductive. A sober stance of the sort that Obama has taken is more difficult but likely more effective in the long run."
As the late Hawaii Gov. John Burns -- a pious and profane an Irish Catholic if there ever was one -- once thoughtfully observed to reporters when questioned about a GOP political opponent, "Hell, any goddamned fool can draw a line in the sand."
Posted by: Donald from Hawaii on June 19, 2009 at 1:18 PM | PERMALINK
Just remember to stay out of the farmers markets in Indiana!
Pence is the stupid fool who declared, after a trip to Bagdad with John McCrap, that the open markets in Bagdad were as safe as the farmers markets in Indiana.
Unfortunately, I know a number of persons in his congressional district and they adore him. Pointing out his ignorance and stupidity to them was a waste of breath. Rethug forever!
Posted by: AngryOldVet on June 19, 2009 at 1:19 PM | PERMALINK
Every time I get discouraged by stuff like this (which admittedly is happening more and more frequently), I partially console myself with the fact that there have always been idiots like Pence in the public square.
William Jenner, for example, in the 1950s accused General George C. Marshall -- my candidate for the greatest and most selfless American of the 20th century -- of being a 'front man for traitors.' Jenner was a senator from Indiana at the time -- so in a sense Pence is simply carrying on a long Hoosier tradition of pinhead behavior. Saying he has the brain of a gnat is an insult to gnats.
Posted by: JCB on June 19, 2009 at 1:21 PM | PERMALINK
But they are still hysterical over Carters jaunt to Palestine...Hypocrites- it's in their job description.
Posted by: johnnymags on June 19, 2009 at 1:55 PM | PERMALINK
I think it was monumentally stupid to give the Iranian regime any legs to stand on. They can now claim American meddling. Does anybody in Congress get this? Since when has any Iranian resolution made a postive impact or hasn't come back to bite us in the ass. This has been going on for decades. We have wrong about how to deal with Iran since before the Shah - hence revolution. We have been carefully crafting a perfect American opposition in the Middle East since the 50s. I'm not sure why
Why are we even passing resolutions on Iran? Don't we have deficits, health care, energy, and an overstretched military to handle? Speading democracy is nice. It's nice to want to give everybody freedoms. It becomes hypocritical when we are forcing freedom on every country in the world. And by freedom - I mean more like America.
Posted by: Mick on June 19, 2009 at 2:06 PM | PERMALINK
"I was cautiously optimistic that Republicans would realize this"
Are we supposed to believe that this has anything at all to do with a thought process? It is "standard Republican". Anything a Dem is doing has to be wrong and we oppose it - no other reason required, no thought process needed, and "damn the torpedos".
Posted by: Mark-NC on June 19, 2009 at 2:10 PM | PERMALINK
Pence is the sort of person who would loudly and publically double-dog-dare the Taliban to behead a captured American soldier, dumber than a bag of dry rocks.
Posted by: Winknandanod on June 19, 2009 at 2:58 PM | PERMALINK
I think the most telling part of this post is the last few lines. Obama quietly and effectively got the inflammatory language out of the resolution, and it passed almost unanimously. Some people will claim this proves that Obama and the Dems are weak, but there's another possibility. Sounds to me as though he did, again, just what Jonathan Chait described in his recent TNR article: treated his opponents with respect, operated on the assumption that they were acting in good faith to solve a particular problem, and challenged them to find a realistic way to solve it. On one level, this is just plain good manners. On another, it works a kind of jujitsu on the other side, using their strength against them. And Pence got pwned without even realizing it was happening.
Posted by: T-Rex on June 19, 2009 at 4:21 PM | PERMALINK
I still find it funny that the same Chi chapter of the Sigma Chi produced Mike Pense and Woody Harrelson. (Well, and me.) Mike is three years older than me, so I did meet him but all I remember is the face.
Posted by: crag on June 19, 2009 at 4:24 PM | PERMALINK
Why are we even passing resolutions on Iran? Don't we have deficits, health care, energy, and an overstretched military to handle?
While the wisdom of any resolution in Congress on the matter is debatable, it is a matter of national concern particularly because we have those issues (particularly energy and an overstretched military) to handle, since the stability of the region impacts both of those, and is itself impacted by the results of what is now going on in Iran.
Posted by: cmdicely on June 19, 2009 at 5:09 PM | PERMALINK
What could explain all the idiotic behavior by the Republicans?
How about: they have learned (at the feet and other lower spots) of the masters (Atwater, Gingrich and Rove) how to win elections. Unfortunately, none one member of that trio has/had any idea on what it actually takes to govern.
The result is that we end up with a group of incredibly incompetent legislators who are capable of running very good election campaigns (well, getting elected anyway), then pimp their votes out in Congress to get campaign contributions to finance their next electoral go-around.
Having "low information" voters doesn't help, either...
Posted by: Doug on June 19, 2009 at 8:17 PM | PERMALINK