They might vote for it if the bill simply said that insurance companies are free to do anything they want.

If there were a vote on a strong public option in the Senate(meaning the vote to pass the actual bill), I bet there would be three or 4 Republicans that voted for it. The Maine twins plus Murkowski(sp?) of Alaska.

Sigh again. The Republicans aren't the problem here, it's the Democratic Senators who are using the Republicans as their excuse for doing nothing.

Our heroes ten years from now will be the political leaders who step up today and lead us to the public option with a sane, competitive insurance industry as a result, and Americans of all stripes receiving better health care along the way! -Kevo

A prominent Republican strategist (I forget who) said: "If the Democrats pass comprehensive health care reform. the Republican party is dead. It will become like MediCare or the VA." So, if the Democrats are reduced to 59 votes again because of a tragedy, I doubt one Republican will vote for closure. It would be a death penalty for their party. Obviously, the Republicans hope to drag negotiations out until tragedy strikes. And Baucus will probably go along because I don't think he wants any reform. He and several other Democrats don't want to take any risk. Drag it out and, oh well, fate and the Republicans killed health care reform. No blame for Democrats there.

And on another note in current Washington news, this here may be of interest to you: http://www.pressdisplay.com/pressdisplay/showlink.aspx?bookmarkid=GNAKQ029DGG6&preview=article&linkid=e20e9e86-4557-4698-b79e-eb93d97daab3&pdaffid=ZVFwBG5jk4Kvl9OaBJc5%2bg%3d%3d

Sincerely,
MediaMentions

I don't know if Bill Kristol is the one E L is thinking about, but he said something very like that. And E. L. is right. Republicans have only one motive in the health care matter: to prevent the D's from having any kind of victory. In other words, shock, shock it's all political.
Which is to say, wicked.

Are they slowly preparing the public for the path to reconciliation, with their solemn message of disappointment in regular channels? (i.e. normal rules and bipartisanship) That looks like a strong possibility, and what I've wanted all along.

Well MediaMentions I went to your link and I have to say. What are you some kind of complete asshole. That story although it was interesting had absolutely no relevance to the subject at hand.

here's the amazing thing to me: apparently the white house still believes that there is a point in trying to deal with the gop on this matter. how stupid can you possibly get? for an intelligent group of people (meaning obama and his advisers), this blind spot is unbelievably dumb.

me? i blame obama. if he had said we're going to do health care reform with or without the gop, the dynamic would be better.

negotiating is a public relations tool. the republicans are looking like a circus of obstructionists. They have almost no credibility with 65% of the country.

Bill Clinton is right: pass a bill regardless of public support and approval rating will skyrocket.

The moral of the story: there's no real point in still more negotiations with conservative Republican lawmakers.

If your actual purpose is not to achieve healthcare reform, but rather to hide behind the Republicans as an excuse for this failure while pretending nevertheless to be liberal, then there is very much of a point.

I predict that negotiations will continue for some time...

What I found especially interesting, though, is what John Harwood added, "I gotta tell you what a White House official told me today: 'Our problem right now is, if we tell some of the Republican opponents in the Senate, 'You can have everything you want in the bill,' they still won't vote for it.'"

How many bad bills have to be written and passed into law before the Obama administration figures this out? The stimulus could have been so much stronger, after all, if appeasement to Republican caterwauling hadn't been the meme of the day.

And though I don't think Democrats are serious about health-care reform -- they just want to be able to say "they tried" -- if there is a bill, you can bet it will be a bad one.

We have a very dysfunctional and broken governing mechanism.

I have to say that this is the only thing I give Republicans positive credit for. They backed Bush 100% and Bush got nearly anything he wanted. They stood their ground regardless of what the topic was, or if it sucked for the country.

The Dems are appeasers. They will fold like a house of cards if the wind blows. They will even try to appease those who spit directly in their faces and laugh. It's humiliating to watch.

Frankly, I'd still be a Republican if they hadn't lost their minds about 15 years ago.

...there's no real point in still more negotiations with conservative Republican lawmakers, and there never was. If Grandma is a nickname for Conrad and
Grassley's negotiations, then yeah, let's pull the plug on Grandma.

"If White House negotiators were to offer them a compromise today with no public option, no reimbursements for end-of-life counseling, and no taxes on the middle class, Republicans lawmakers will still oppose meaningful health care reform."

of course, then it wouldn't be meaningful health care reform.

It's one thing to be played for a fool; that happens to everybody at least once in their life. It's another thing to volunteer to play the fool and that is what the White House and Sen Baucus are doing.

In fact, continuing to negotiate with them positively reinforces what they're doing. The only reason for compromise is that it will produce a better result than failure to compromise. That's clearly not the case here. The Dems have the worst of all worlds--a watered down bill so discouraging to progressives that we're not sure we care and a reinvigorated Republican party--gave nothing, got a lot (maybe even total victory), and made Obama look weak and stupid.

It's not just the Democrats who should be worried about the Republicans never forgiving them for winning the White House. A majority of the country voted to put the White House and Congress in the hands of the Democrats. The Republicans will never be appeased until all of those people have been crushed as well.

And you thought 8 years under Bush were bad? When they come back, they'll be out for revenge. Heck - they've never forgiven the country for getting behind FDR and his policies. They will not be able to rest until America has been destroyed.

And if you need any proof of this, just look at how wealth is getting concentrated at the top. When Grover Norquist talks about starving the beast, he's really talking about a middle class the GOP elites feel has gotten above itself.

What does it take for these dems to get that? The republicants oppose everything that might make the dems look good...they have been filibustering everything just for political gain...and blackmail dems with "well it not bipartisan so it's unfair".

Just like all of Obama's nominations...there will be one repub to place a hold or stall...same with legislation...they only want Obama and the dems to fail because they believe it will bring them back to power.

How many more people have to point this out?> How much more obvious does it have to be before dems realize there is no working with defeatists. You can't compromise with a hanging. Baucus would ensure reelection just by saying Grassley only wants to defeat any reform so there is no possibility of bipartisanship with this liar. The nation would applaud him.

Rootin tootin dems with balls saying we stand with the people and not with the corporations...now that's change we could believe in huh.

WE won the election. It was a landslide. Stop negotiating with rethugs. F all of them

From your mouth, Krugman's mouth and Harwood's mouth to Obama's ear.

Yes, the big surprise, I think, has been how much opposition there is within the Democratic party. We knew most Republicans were in the back pocket of the insurance companies, and big pharma, but now we see how many Democrats are in there with them. It is, to say the least, more than a little disconcerting to see that we have lost so much of our own party (or, rather, how much of our party really doesn't care what the party supposedly stands for).

With Grassley telling the media that Obama needs to come out and publicly state that the Public Option is dead, when the Congress returns from the August recess, Obama needs to put the hammer down on Baucus to pull in the gangplank and sail away, leaving the Republicans on their own Island of the Lost.

You write: "The moral of the story: there's no real point in still more negotiations with conservative Republican lawmakers."

Yes there is. As long as we keep ourselves on the straight and narrow, the longer this process goes on, the crazier and crazier the Repubs become. Obama is driving them nuts, or perhaps giving them space and time in which to reveal their nuttiness. And giving time for Keith and Rachel and Jon and Steven to expose and make fun of them. And for the blogs and parts of the old media to get out the facts. Facts are important, but ridicule may be even better.

Equally important, the further out the Repubs get, the easier it will be for the Blue Dog Dems to be Dems. They have to be able to say, "we tried." And they need to be able to say, "look how crazy they are."

You quote John Harwood, who quotes a WH aide: "Our problem right now is, if we tell some of the Republican opponents in the Senate, 'You can have everything you want in the bill,' they still won't vote for it."

We know that. But a lot of people don't. It has to absolutely obvious. The more that point becomes obvious about Grassley, for example, the easier it will be for Baucus and his comrades to vote for cloture and for the final bill. And easier for a Repub or two to join us.

Why is this so difficult for people to grasp? We are talking the basics of constitutional government, political strategy, future campaigning, and human psychology here.

So why is it that so many on the left seem to be either WATBs or anxious to join a circular firing squad? We will lose only if we let our conception of "great" become the enemy of "good," or if we turn on our fellow Dems and any less than all-out sympathizers who come our way. Democratic rivalries and infighting killed Carter's energy program and Clinton's health plan. Please, folks on this site, don't make that mistake again.

Throw The Healthcare Obstructionist Out!

More than two thirds of the American people want a single payer health care system. And if they cant have a single payer system 76% of all Americans want a strong government-run public option on day one (85% of democrats, 71% of independents, and 60% republicans). Basically everyone.

We have the 37th worst quality of healthcare in the developed world. And the most costly. Costing over twice as much as every other county. Conservative estimates are that over 120,000 of you dies each year in America from treatable illness that people in other developed countries don't die from. Rich, middle class, and poor a like. Insured and uninsured. Men, women, children, and babies. This is what being 37th in quality of healthcare means.

I know that many of you are angry and frustrated that REPUBLICANS! In congress are dragging their feet and trying to block TRUE healthcare reform. What republicans want is just a taxpayer bailout of the DISGRACEFUL GREED DRIVEN PRIVATE FOR PROFIT health insurance industry, and the DISGRACEFUL GREED DRIVEN PRIVATE FOR PROFIT healthcare industry. A trillion dollar taxpayer funded private health insurance bailout is all you really get, without a robust government-run public option available on day one. Co-OP's ARE NOT A SUBSTITUTE FOR A GOVERNMENT-RUN PUBLIC OPTION. They are a fraud being pushed by the GREED DRIVEN PRIVATE FOR PROFIT health insurance industry that is KILLING YOU!

YOU CANT HAVE AN INSURANCE MANDATE WITHOUT A ROBUST PUBLIC OPTION. MANDATING PRIVATE FOR PROFIT HEALTH INSURANCE AS YOUR ONLY CHOICE WOULD BE A DISASTER. AND UNETHICAL, CORRUPT, AND MORALLY REPUGNANT. AND PROBABLY UNCONSTITUTIONAL AS WELL.

These industries have been slaughtering you and your loved ones like cattle for decades for profit. Including members of congress and their families. These REPUBLICANS are FOOLS!

Republicans and their traitorous allies have been trying to make it look like it's President Obama's fault for the delays, and foot dragging. But I think you all know better than that. President Obama inherited one of the worst government catastrophes in American history from these REPUBLICANS! And President Obama has done a brilliant job of turning things around, and working his heart out for all of us.

But Republicans think you are just a bunch of stupid, idiot, cash cows with short memories. Just like they did under the Bush administration when they helped Bush and Cheney rape America and the rest of the World.

But you don't have to put up with that. And this is what you can do. The Republicans below will be up for reelection on November 2, 2010. Just a little over 13 months from now. And many of you will be able to vote early. So pick some names and tell their voters that their representatives (by name) are obstructing TRUE healthcare reform. And are sellouts to the insurance and medical lobbyist.

Ask them to contact their representatives and tell them that they are going to work to throw them out of office on November 2, 2010, if not before by impeachment, or recall elections. Doing this will give you something more to do to make things better in America. And it will make you feel better too.

There are many resources on the internet that can help you find people to call and contact. For example, many social networking sites can be searched by state, city, or University. Be inventive and creative. I can think of many ways to do this. But be nice. These are your neighbors. And most will want to help.

I know there are a few democrats that have been trying to obstruct TRUE healthcare reform too. But the main problem is the Bush Republicans. Removing them is the best thing tactically to do. On the other hand. If you can easily replace a democrat obstructionist with a supportive democrat, DO IT!

You have been AMAZING!!! people. Don't loose heart. You knew it wasn't going to be easy saving the World. :-)

God Bless You

jacksmith — Working Class

Twitter search (#welovethenhs) Check it out.

I REST MY CASE (http://krugman.blogs.nytimes.com/2009/07/25/why-markets-cant-cure-healthcare/)

Republican Senators up for re-election in 2010.

* Richard Shelby of Alabama
* Lisa Murkowski of Alaska
* John McCain of Arizona
* Mel Martinez of Florida
* Johnny Isakson of Georgia
* Mike Crapo of Idaho
* Chuck Grassley of Iowa
* Sam Brownback of Kansas
* Jim Bunning of Kentucky
* David Vitter of Louisiana
* Kit Bond of Missouri
* Judd Gregg of New Hampshire
* Richard Burr of North Carolina
* George Voinovich of Ohio
* Tom Coburn of Oklahoma
* Jim DeMint of South Carolina
* John Thune of South Dakota
* Kay Bailey Hutchison of Texas
* Bob Bennett of Utah

Settling For: "It's a funny thing about life. If you refuse to settle for anything but the best,
that's what it will give you."
Somerset Maugham

Lose these Republicans.
Just the fact they seek to scare the elderly with false information is sickening enough for me.

Grassley was the last straw.

But Democrats should have never left for recess without a plan for constituents to review.

Repeatedly at the Netroots Nation convention in Pittburgh, the fact that none of us
Obama supporters have "the plan" to review has remained an issue.

Meaningful health care reform is dead. Compromise is no longer needed. Now the goal is squash it so strongly that it embarasses Obama personally.

lol, mediamentions...eric margolis is a laughing stock in Toronto...not to mention Sun Media and the Toronto Sun which he works for is going out of business and is barely good enough to line the birdcage...but thanks for the laugh!

the "White House source" ought to finish the sentence about republicans not voting for healthcare reform no matter what: ...'because they see defeating healthcare reform as a means to give Obama a political defeat, the American people be damned.'

Obama ain't going nowhere with healthcare reform unless he is willing to jam it down the throats of republicans and blue dog democrats, which to-date he has been unwilling to do. Hence no healthcare reform, or at least no legislation worthy of the name.

Grassley, Enzi, et. al. have probably been on what amounts to a sabotage mission. Drag the negotiations out while professing good faith, giving the mobs and the demagogues more time to marshall forces to destroy the effort.

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