From the still it looks like Steve Doocy had the day off. Good thing; the combination of Doocy and Michael Steele would have been a critical mass of stupid that could have torn a hole in the fabric of the universe.

Never underestimate the stupidity of the American public.

The political system functions? Please, tell me which country you live in so I can move there!

Sad fact is the reason why the "death panel" lie worked is that the vast majority of Americans are ignorant.

Um ... what makes you think our political system actually functions?

If it did, there would be no American troops in Iraq, our economy wouldn't be in tatters, we wouldn't have tortured anyone, we'd all have health care, and the current reactionary GOP would be treated about the same as those who think little green men send them signals via the fillings in their molars.

Sadly, all the system does now is help the rich get richer and treat demonstrable liars with a respect they've don't deserve.

So, no, it doesn't function.

The Enlightenment Experiment: FAIL!

I'm waiting for the two lies to merge so we have trolls showing up claiming that Grandma's name will be written in the Death Book by the Death Panels so they make sure she can't escape euthanasia.

What is it with right-wingers deciding that they should be allowed to make everyone else's private decisions? It cracked me up when Michele Bachmann got all indignant about people interfering with her bodily autonomy while blithely continuing to insist that she should be allowed to decide what everyone else does with their body.

Next in the GOP, anti-HCR playbook [complete with the buzzwords they'll use to push them]:

1] The government will require all men to get hernia checks from Janet Reno. And they will be televised. GOP buzzword = "Flacid Trip"

2] In order to make the competition with for-profit insurers more even, the government will require those who are forced to take the public option to sit on the phone with a government representative for three hours every week. GOP buzzword = "Government Phone-bank Internment Camp"

3] The government will take your most cherished photographs of loved ones, urinate on them and burn them in front of you. They will say it is preventative care. GOP buzzword = "No Mo Photo"

4] The government will require DNA screenings for every man, woman and child and use this information to transplant organs from one person to another more genetically suited to them. GOP buzzword = "Organ Swapping."

5] The government will prohibit the consumption of the McRib Sandwich. GOP buzzword = "Uncivil 'Rib'erties"

6] The government will mandate all citizens recognize that a black man is our president. GOP buzzword = "After Birthing"

7] The government will turn the continental United States into a roiling, putrid hellscape of vibrant, pre-death humans who roam the land completely covered in oozing, rank health care benefits. GOP buzzword = "Liberals Win"

"The Enlightenment Experiment: FAIL!"

While Europe is by no means perfect, the discourse is far more enlightened. At least there isn't this level of utter stupidity propagated on TV. I lived in the UK and I really can't imagine the BBC or any of the other British channels pushing such obvious lies. Fox is obviously a propaganda machine, but what has happened to the rest of our media? The only corrective is wall-to-wall coverage of how stupid and venal the conservatives have become.
____________________________________________

Again: Without the "he said/she said" dynamic, their entire reporting structure breaks down, which would force journalists to actually go out and investigate issues. Further complicating the matter is that if the media really wanted to go out and do investigative reporting, their owners would not budget the money for them to do so.

There is an apparently fixed idea that to neglect asking irresonsibly provocative , rhetorical questions , is dereliction of duty .
Aside from needing their mommies and limbic limbaugh , nothing comes between the enraged right wing and their hair trigger lips .

Loved Olberman's comment on Friday night: If Fox News were held to the same standard for what constitutes the "news" as the pharmaceutical industry is for its products, then Murdoch,Hannity, Beck, O'Reilly, Wallace, and the rest of the pea-brained personalities on FNC would be running a car wash on the corner(with apologies to the car wash business and employees). Chris Wallace deserves to be yanked off the air for his newest "Death Book" promotions.

America First Marverick, John McCain, has been had military and VA medical benefits his entire life. Why no fuss when Bush instituted the military's "Death Book" in 2007?

After a few quiet weeks, Michael Steele is back, inserting both feet in mouth, dissing Republican leaders and the "bad policy" put into place by Bush #2. The guy's an idiot!

For what it's worth, Olbermann broke down the smear last night, and the Obama administration published a detailed rebuttal to the lurid claim this morning.

Too late! The lie machine will have 40% of the unwashed masses believing it. The compliant MSM will repeat it ad infinatum as it gives them a he - said- she said scenario where they can get bloviating assholes to discuss without ever managing to mention its a lie.

the teevee giveth and the teevee taketh away... but most the teevee eats your brains and and covers you in shit.

bow to one knee -- the teevee is god...

When Republicans assume the populous at large is 'dumb,' it's pretty much the only time I agree with them.

Of course, they see it as a feature, not a bug.

Sadly, our 'newest convert' Arlen has forgotten how his former party mates lie, and has begun questioning the VA about their use of this book.

Someone should mention to many of the concern trolls at Huffington Post, DailyKos, Firedoglake, and others like them that this is precisely the kind of knavery that folks like LBJ and FDR did not have to deal with. I have read so many posts on those sites weeping and gnashing their teeth because Obama hasn't slam dunked the health care reforms yet, all of them whining that presidents like LBJ and FDR, (you know, the ones with 'real' leadership skills) simply rammed through their reform programs, and why can't Obama?

Why not? Because of the 24 news beast that must be fed with baseless crap lies like this. Add to that a network (Fox) that yammers incessantly about every baseless fabrication, talk radio schlockmeisters blathering every day about Obama as a socialist Manchurian candidate, and all of the rest. My god, why does this not seem to enter into anyone's thoughts about why it is so bloody hard to get anything done, especially something on this scale.

Of course, if Obama did start acting like an LBJ, the news would only cover his over-the-top, brutal, Chicago-style of bare-knuckled politics, but also likely tip over into day after day of saying, 'yep, just like Rev. Wright after all. We warned you.'

This conundrum is highlighted by an article today at the Daily Beast about Rahm Emmanuel's style (you know, pugnacious, in your face), the very style that the left wants Obama to adopt. It is written by a Republican thrashing Obama because Rahm's style is giving Republicans all the oxygen they need to scream about Obama's heavy-handedness. Do we not see the crushing irony in all of this? Honestly.

It is a different era, folks. Time to figure out a new way of playing the game - perhaps President Obama, like candidate Obama, knows what he is doing.

NPR helped stoke the lie last night, too.

the teevee giveth and the teevee taketh away... but most the teevee eats your brains and and covers you in shit.

bow to one knee -- the teevee is god...

Posted by: neill

I don't know what you expect
Staring into the TV set
Fighting fire with fire.

--Talking Heads, "Burning Down the House"

:-)

Our political discourse is just so ridiculous, it's sometimes surprising the political system functions at all.

And you think it actually functions - anywhere? - anytime???

The right has done all this, and the result is that the so-called health care "reform" has become insurance reform that keeps the insurance companies in the saddle and holding the reins as they ride the American people like the mule they think we are.

I am sure people are going to get tired of me saying this, but the corpierations already won through the intimidation of their far right troops. The so-called "employer mandate" is now a sham. There is no requirement for any certain minimum level of services and options on offer in a plan, and any employer-offered plan will qualify as "health insurance" for saying you are covered. And if you want to take a pass on the craptacular plan your employer offers so you can take advantage of one of the many other plans on offer, including the golden "public option" - you can't!! If you take a pass on what is offered by your employer, you will not be able to go elsewhere. And the IRS will be chasing you with a hefty fine for your failure to "obtain insurance." The only "mandate" in the Employer Mandate is that you are mandated to take it and shut up.

Hewy, you thought Wal-Mart was supporting health care reform out of the goodness of their heart? This is what they extracted from the "good" Democrats in return for that support. Like big pharma getting their prices and their patents protected.

"Change we can believe in" my ass! Fuck you very much, Rahm Emanuel, you scum-sucking futhermucker!

I suggest you all go get the latest issue of Rolling Stone and read Matt Taibbi's article, to see how far downstream you're being sold by the people you worked your hearts out for last year.

Okay, time to fight fire with fire.

New Democratic talking point:

REPUBLICANS ARE BLOCKING HEALTH CARE REFORM BECAUSE THEY WANT TO INCREASE THE NUMBER OF ORGANS AVAILABLE FOR TRANSPLANTS FOR RICH PEOPLE BY HARVESTING ORGANS FROM PEOPLE WITHOUT HEALTH INSURANCE!

Republican warns of organ transplant "rationing"
http://www.bioethicsinternational.org/blog/?p=1290\

Our political discourse is just so ridiculous, it's sometimes surprising the political system functions at all.

If this is functioning, I really don't want to see not functioning. Unfortunately, I think I'm going to.

Oh, sweet Jayzus: NO.

The VA "Death Book" nonsense is one of those arguments that is best handled by someone people believe in, who is identified with precisely what they're attacking.

A few years ago, the obvious response would have been: cue Colin Powell. The most famous modern American veteran could simply have appeared on a talk show or been interviewed on camera, to point out that 'anyone who says that any American president -- any AMERICAN -- is trying to pass legislation that would encourage our elderly veterans to forgo expensive health care, to die to save the rest of us money -- well, that's just deranged. I know that no responsible political party would give a home to that despicable sort of politics...'

Now there isn't any obvious choice -- one of the sadder (and less noticed) things about modern political partisanship is that there aren't any popular military figures who are NOT partisan in some way, the way George Marshall or even Douglas MacArthur (and certainly Dwight Eisenhower up through 1952) aspired to be.

But I could be wrong: suggestions?

It says a lot about our media that they don't even mention that the guy pushing this meme wants the VA to buy and use his book instead of the one they're currently using. According to conservatives, mentioning that the guy has a financial stake in getting this story off the ground and stands to make a shitload of money if he succeeds in pressuring the VA to buy his book instead of the one they're currently using is totally irrelevant because shut up, that's why.

Truth is the first casualty of Republican talking points.

Of course, if Obama did start acting like an LBJ, the news would only cover his over-the-top, brutal, Chicago-style of bare-knuckled politics, but also likely tip over into day after day of saying, 'yep, just like Rev. Wright after all. We warned you.'

Yes, but we would at least have adequate healthcare. A lot of folks would be too busy waiting to see a doctor to be paying attention to the bullshit.

And yes, if we suddenly had universal healthcare there would be a lot of waiting to see doctors. Not because universal healthcare would ration care, but so many people have gone without medical care for so long they'd overwhelm the system, for at least a couple years. Yeah, wouldn't that be a tragedy? Not.

No one ever went broke underestimating the intelligence... etc., etc.

This, by the way, is why I don't fully believe the Bob Herbert theory that the goal is a diluted bill that includes a windfall for the insurance and drug companies and bupkis for the rest of us. I think that's what we'd get if the GOP let up right now. But the 'pubs keep fighting. Unless they've gone rogue even relative to their corporate masters, I think the goal is no bill whatsoever. That's presumably the ideal result for the GOP (Obama humiliatingly defeated), but if it weren't also in the interests of Big Medicine, I don't think they'd be fighting this hard. I think they'd be ready to settle for a useless bill.

Staring into the TV set

I always thought it was "cemented to the TV set." I like my way better. Take that, Dave!

Too bad the GOP didn't have the foresight to accuse us of pulling the plug on Grandpa instead of Grandma. The heartless murder of old men who served our country would have been quite a picture to get the dumbfucks' outrage flowing. I doubt WWII nurses and WACs would work as well on their base.

"THEY REALLY THINK YOU'RE STUPID...."
I think you should consider the possibility that it is that they really are stupid.

"The rebuttal includes a detailed fact sheet and a timeline, both of which were sent my way by an administration official and may be sent widely to reporters later this morning".

That's a proper response, of course. But would it be too much for Obama to interrupt his vacation for 5 minutes, assemble the TV cameras, and in plain language call this calculated, hysterical fear mongering... well, calculated hysterical fear mongering.

The solution to U.S. healthcare is not more doctors and drugs; it is more preventive and pre-need solutions. We have been so dumbed down that going to a doctor for everything and taking prescribed and over-the-counter medications is the only way to receive healthcare. yes, there are millions who are already ill with both diagnosed and undiagnosed dis-eases, and who are not adequately covered, so will be the ones lining up for medical services. Many of these degenerative conditions can be reversed without medical intervention and for a lot less money than is being spent per family or per person, now. I won't share the solution, here, because it is not something that is easily explained to a mass audience of skeptics. If you want to know more, then pay attention to what is happening with water and you will hear the information. Generally, people are committed to their own beliefs about healthcare and will not hear a real solution. The rest of us will listen and hear and take action. In that sense, the conservatives are right: take personal responsibility for your healthcare, because the government will not do it for you. So, while the struggle goes on for a decent healthcare plan for the U.S. seek other solutions that you can control.

I am committed to Oneness through Justice and Transformation
peace,
st john

In the Chris Wallace segment Olberman cites, former Faith Based Initiatives director Jim Towey reveals that the government "has a financial stake in the answers that they give" (about end of life care) and that as a result of this stake the VA will steer veterans toward a denial of care & assisted suicide.

Really?? It seems to me the longer the VA hospitals keep their patients alive the more money they make. As far as striving for VA budget efficiencies how will anything change?

These anti-reformers are all about throwing a wrench in the gears of reform, nothing more. They are not serious policy makers.

Jim Towey -- the guy in the Fox interview featured in the Olbermann clip -- is none other than the political hack who turned the White House Office of Faith Based Initiatives into a PR machine for embattled Republican incumbents in the 2004 elections.

David Kuo's book on the WHOFBI makes him look like the scheming ass he is.

As a VA health care client I've got that little booklet. I've also got a bunch of VA doctors constantly hassling and prodding me to stay alive. One thing you will NEVER hear in a VA hospital is the suicide option.

Who are these lying Republican civilians?

This stuff is quite annoying in the short term, but in the long term it benefits Democrats in two ways:

1. During the first few years after reform is enacted, everyone will be closely watching and critiquing the results. What would be helpful is if somebody would create absurdly low expectations for the program among the very people who most oppose it. Thanks, GOP.

2. This poisoning of the discourse is so devoid of substance and so obviously motivated by the political needs of the minority party that it will give Democrats a pretext to change the de facto ground rules for how business gets done in Congress. Republicans are demonstrating how conservative, monolithic and regional a party they actually are. This is a good thing.

Also keep in mind that the bill itself is designed to be bulletproof, so that the only obvious loser is the insurance industry, who everyone dislikes or must pretend to dislike. This creates a dynamic where there are no sympathetic stakeholders to build opposition around, with attacks like "25 million families will pay an additional $_____ each year..." The bill is an economic reform of a sector that accounts for about one-sixth of the economy, but we've seen almost none of that type of argument. There's no convincing substantive case against the bill, so the opposition has nothing but this garbage, which is just a mask for "I don't want Obama and the Democrats to win a political victory." It's sickening to watch, but it's merely a symptom of excellent Democratic political strategy. It's truly a feature, not a bug.

Just to let you know, I am a member of a "Death Panel" . . . my partner just made a living will which, in essence, give me the final say in when not to save his life if his AIDS or cancer overwhelms him. It really sucks to spell these things out in advance, but the alternative is too ugly to comtemplate.

The stupid just burns. I mean seriously. I had to laugh when one of the objectionable aspects of the "death book" was the Five Wishes pamphlet, which I as a lawyer give out to clients who complete a living will. It allows people to make end of life decisions with more specificity than just a living will and we give it to clients to review. It asks questions like: Do you want a feeding tube? Do you want water? Anything else?
We had one client write an entire page about how she wanted to be dressed, what music she wanted playing etc. on her deathbed.

The point is, these documents are being reviewed and signed every single day, in hospitals, nursing homes and lawyers' offices. By young people and old people alike, without regard to political affiliation or religious affiliation. If you want all heroic measures taken, you can specify that as well, but in all the years I have done living wills only a handful of people have opted to keep a low quality life (e.g. brain dead) going at all costs.

I am concerned that all this negativity and misinformation will make people suspicious of documents that are completely mainstream and have been done for years without problems. Indeed, I caution clients to remember the Schiavo case, and then they understand the need for imparting their wishes to loved ones.

I am beyond disgusted with these people who are spreading this despicable misinformation.

This HAS TO BE the "at long last, have you no decency" moment. It has to be. Every troop-loving anchor who has ever called out anyone for disrespecting the military needs to be challenged to stand up to this disgusting, disgusting lie.

This was never going to be easy. We (through this administration) are attempting to reintroduce rationality into governance after 2 decades or more of complete fear based paranoia and incompetence based governance. There are people in this country who have never experienced the normal process of how our government is supposed to work or how democracy, (give and take of ideas, open exchange of information) is supposed to function. We have developed and encouraged authoritarian and bullying behavior as a role model. That is why even those on the left advocate for "ram it in" approaches. They don't really understand representative democracy any more than some on the right.

This country is having a mass tantrum similar to what you would see a little kid doing in a grocery store when Mom tells hims he can't have something. I think the best thing is to ignore it to some extent (holding aside physical threats to the President and other peaceful citizens). They have no other way to distract us from moving forward except to throw monkey poop.

The other thing is to be sure to pay attention to local elections, folks. A lot of the anger on the right is going to energize craziness and bad choices at the local level, so keep your heads up to the home front as well.

We can do this. We have not worked hard enough to give up so lets stop whining about the crazies and just do what we need to do. That is to show up at as many town halls as we can, speak the truth, and not be intimidated by three year old children having hissy fits.

So, who is watching/listening to the media, other than alternative such as Democracy Now and Commondreams.org? That all of this blog is devoted to reporting the conservative points of view, with no solutions offered that are meaningful, is very distressing to me. Unfortunately, or fortunately, my addiction to this site is growing less impelling. I have been coming here for quite awhile and looking for answers. What is becoming more apparent to me daily is that, the answers I am seeking are not to be found here, or elsewhere in the blogosphere. It is up to me to choose how I will respond and act on those choices. One of the most powerful realizations I can have is that I have choice. The government, insurance companies, my employer, media of any kind do not control me. I choose the level and intensity of their influence on my life.

I AM committed to Oneness through Justice and Transformation
peace,
st john

Proposed negotiating position for the Obama Administration and Congressional leadership:

No negotiations on health care reform legislation with any elected official who does not issue a public statement upfront acknowledging there is no language in any of the proposed health care reform Bills under consideration that supports the claim that 'death panels' would be imposed by the Federal government on anyone.

If they can't read, why talk to them on the merits?

I just came from a townhall event, and believe me, these lies are working. All the agitated, white medicare recipients in the audience were absolutely convinced by this stuff. I was told by several very earnest and intelligent-seeming people that the language about denying treatment to non-productive citizens and encouraging old people to forego treatment was absolutely in the bill and that I was naive and ignorant to believe otherwise.

What about that section that says all Republicans will be declared brain-dead and euthanized for their failure to contribute to the welfare state? I know I read that in the bill; or someone told me it was there, or something.

Well, my mom is 92, still very sharp.
She is a double-dipper, has both Medicare and retired Army lifer care (my late dad) whatever its called. She basically pays nothing.
She gets spitting mad at the idiocy and lies, as do most of her friends in the senior facility in which they live.
Their attitude is: "Hey, we didn't go thru a depression and the biggest war in history just so Republican liars can screw over our kids and grandkids."
Not all the fogeys are fooled.

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