i think what they usually do after the standard "tit for tat" trades are made is the arm-twisting...

and the blue dog -- there being quite a few corrupt ones who are simply insurance company puppets, hacks and scum-suckers -- need to be threatened: first, with losing their seat in Congress; and then with prison time.

there's your formula for health care reform without ever having to be coherent and explaining why we need insurance companies. (and the only reason we need insurance companies is because they pay congresscritters so well...)

I would hope Ross' corruption is trumpeted on every blog and by every progressive group.

The conservative democrats who continue with smoke and mirrors to decieve americans about health care reform, have not really figured out there is an election next year and the majority Democrats will become the minority because the democrats only listened to lobbyists, and corporation and not the American people.Americans want the Public Option. Extend Medicare to all and use Supplemental private insurance to cover what M'Care does not pay. Simple , efficient, cost effective. Congress cannot relate to those three adjectives. Confusion must reign so Congress can get corporate $$ for election.

It's becoming apparent that the Democratic coalition may not actually have enough in common to be a coalition. Some people think government exists to purely to serve corporate interests but don't hate gay people. A lot of us think that's not enough to build common cause on.

she may not be perfect, but Pelosi sure seems to at least try a lot harder than Reid does.

Does this mean that there will be an organized progressive group to which Democrats must bow and scrape to get legislation passed?

If not, it's time to get one started.

Blue Dogs are a threat to the party.Blue Dogs have been killing all votes on important, party-defining issues (any vote that Republican en bloc vote against). And worse, they betray an implicit promise made by the party to the nation when they give one party a resounding victory over another. They are hornets that flit around our heads and sting us repeatedly, but we are never allowed to swat at them.

Would I really rather have a Republican than a Democrat in there? You betcha.

The Blue Dogs need to be muzzled on occasion, but we shouldn't assume Blue Dog = conservative = industry hacks. Some Blue Dogs are liberals that favor fiscal responsility and will vote for a progressive bill that is funded without budgetary sleight of hand. Mike Ross does not speak for the votes of every Blue Dog Democrat.

Pelosi will get 218 votes for a health care bill. The real issue is what that bill will look like, not whether it will pass.

There's a sizable portion of the House Democratic caucus that won't support reform if they consider it too liberal.

I do not think this is true. I do not think that when it comes to actually voting on a bill, the House Democrats who have been trying to gut the bill will vote against a good bill with a strong public option. The Blue Dogs are the MOST vulnerable if they vote against reform.

My Congressman, Dennis Moore, a Blue Dog from the red state of Kansas, sent me an email yesterday reiterating his support for the public option and detailing the number of people in his district who've gone bankrupt in the last year because of medical expenses, been forclosed on, become unemployed, etc. The Blue Dogs aren't a homogenous group either.

I wonder if part of the discussion is the realization of the politics (as opposed to the policy) dance that Republicans are engaged in. Meaning that Blue Dogs may have philosophical problems with the bill and/or may have electoral issues (i.e face "retribution" at the polls) but that them opposing this too forcefully may not be in the long-term interests of themselves or Democratic control of the House.

I believe it is absolutely necessary to focus our efforts as citizens on pressuring the democrats to pass quality reform including a robust public option available to everyone. I get frustrated sometimes by all the attention paid to the stupid corrupt things republicans are saying. This is sometimes entertaining and I understand it is important to offer a rebuttal, but at this point the republicans are almost irrelevant. The only way to pressure professional politicians is to convince them that you will not vote for them if they don't represent your interests in this matter. Those people who support reform and who live in states with blue dog democrats have to apply this pressure. And blogs such as this need to pressure the democratic leadership in general to turn the screws on members of their own party who are leaning conservative.

just FYI - the 'Blue Dogs' are a MUCH smaller group than the Progressive caucus in the House. much smaller.

When analyzing the motivations and actions of "Blue Dogs" realize that many of them have a very precarious hold on their seats and represent areas that are fairly conservative by liberal standards.

Don't remember where I read it, but upwards of 40 Democrats represent districts that voted for McCain in 2008, and even more than that represent districts that were in GOP hands at some point during the last decade.

When you have a caucus as large the Democratic caucus currently is, you are going to have wide range of viewpoints among your members that need to be accomodated.

Pelosi has a tough needle to thread particularly given the Senate's aversion to endorsing a public option.

Oh good effing God. Pelosi should (and I am sure *is*) just working to get the most progressive piece of lege out of the House without any regard for what the Senate is doing. All the horse trading between chambers will take place in the conference committee.

Pelosi, Reid, and Obama are tacking hard left now. They think they have the muscle to push through their bills using parliamentary procedures.

In the meantime Obama is like a hyperactive teenager tipping over trash cans. LUN.

It's appropriate that matt ends all his posts with the south Asian slang for penis.

Simple , efficient, cost effective. Congress cannot relate to those three adjectives. Confusion must reign so Congress can get corporate $$ for election. Posted by: ml johnston on September 23, 2009

Tut tut, now don't go giving away the game. Heh.

Thinking about it, it's all a bit of political theater on the part of the Blue Dogs, isn't it? But it's exactly the kind we political theater we hope to see replayed in a week or two when the Senate version of the bill comes to the floor, right? After all, the Senate Democrats have to stand together at 60 votes to push back a Republican filibuster, but then the 6 or 7 most conservative Dems (Nelson, Landrieu, and so forth) will have to scream bloody murder and vote against the final bill, meaning the legislation passes with 53 or 54 votes, yet allowing said conservative Dems to return to their conservative districts and convince their constituents they really, really didn't want healthcare reform. See how it works? (Whether they're right about what their constituents really want is a whole 'nother discussion.)

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