So what exactly is it that makes Conrad and Lincoln Democrats? They are just Republicans using resources from the Democratic Party to get elected. They must go.

Well, yeah.....but if the Republicans and just enough uninformed Democrats continue to throw money at ineffective programs when the economy is still recovering, and people are still losing their jobs, many young people will be too depressed and suicidal to think about screwing, right? So, it kind of works.

Then again, having sex might turn out to be the only entertainment whole groups of people can afford, as long as it remains free.

Republicans don't care about the government budget, we know that. Reagan and Bush proved that. The big issue here is Conrad whose whole purpose is supposed to be about reigning in government spending and the deficit.

I think we need to "re-frame" this issue.

Why not call the program "ignorance only" sex education?

That would be more accurate.

Hatch said, "Abstinence education works."

At least as well as Nancy Reagan's "Just Say No. . ."

Here, check out the "sin map", showing different harms like STDs on a county-by-county basis.

http://www.wired.com/culture/education/magazine/17-09/st_sinmaps

"Lust" must map 100% onto effective sex ed programs.

During the Bush years, Texas received the greatest amount of abstinence money of any state, and today Texas has the highest rate of teenage pregnancy. Enough.

One would think that if Hatch even paid the smallest amount of attention to his own cohorts he'd know that even the married conservatives do not practice abstinence with people outside of their marriages. LOL!

Today's conservatives sure do have it in for the younger generations. Between killing them with ignorance, lack of health insurance, wars, poisoning of environment, foods and toys the Hatches of nation are doing an awful lot of human culling.

I'm a big fan of "Ignorance Only" Education. That's exactly what it is, without question.

But a caveat here: most studies have found that conventional SexEd doesn't really have much affect on teen behavior either. The reality is that, with the internet, and that old standby, fellow high schoolers, most kids end up learning a lot more about sex long before they even take a reproductive health course, their attitudes and behaviors towards it are shaped by much more powerful forces than poorly produced videos and gym teachers.

Clarification: I'm a big fan of using the TERM "Ignorance Only Education" not a fan of the actual thing itself.

Religious groups need to be bought off, too. Just because they don't produce any products is no reason they can't be part of the government graft mill.

Thanks for the clarification, Drew. I was just going to accuse you of being one of those perverts who buys Barely Legal...and Pregnant!

Don't Republicans oppose social engineering?

Only when Democrats propose it.

Even Texas is bailing on this:

http://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/165654.php

Steve: this is a party that has thrown 500 billion at missile defense over twenty-five years without any evidence it works, you just have to have faith.

And in reality, abstinence education does work for it's intended targets: parents who don't want to think about their children having sex. Ok check that, fathers who don't want to think about their daughters being despoiled. No thinking about it, then go reason to have the uncomfortable sex talk. Oh, the target is supposed to be teenagers? Laughter. I had a very progressive (for this country at least) sexual education in school and youth groups (pre the whackjob takeover of the boy scouts, of course) and I still learned more about the mechanics from Penthouse and Tropic of Cancer. I just had the knowledge to put it into context and at least have the idea that I could put risks in perspective.

From your previous post:

At that point, Hatch offered a nonsensical answer about "state laboratories" and the notion that Democrats "think everything can be solved by spending."

Science???!!!!

We don't need no steenking science!!!!

We know what we know and that's good enough for us!

Yeah it works, just aske Sarah Palin. I'm guessing Hatch didn't have any real data to support his bogus assertion.
If Texas is rejecting it, you know it definitely does not work.

qwerty, @10:51,

Are you suggesting that the Honorable Senator from Utah is inconsistent??? Say it ain't so.

If abstinence education worked there wouldn't be so many little Palins running and crawling around. A Democrat should have proposed an amendment for an abstinence education demonstration project at that Capitol Hill home where all the cheating Republicans live.

Note....Republicans do not actually want to cut spending...they only want to get the political credit for saying that they do.

$50 million? Why, that's almost as much as we gave ACORN over the last 15 years!!

Baucus is an embarrassment. Can we do without the Finance Committee?

Abstinence should be presented truthfully: It is full proof, but requires a level of self-discipline and will power that needs to be weighed against the alternative.

Thus it should be one of a range of options discusses honestly and fully and not the first one either.

Abstinence education is not only useless, it may be worse than useless. Instructors in these classes repeatedly tell students that they can get pregnant or contract STD's even if they use condoms, the point being that condoms aren't safe enough, and that only abstinence is 100% effective. But the lesson the students take away is, and I now quote a student interviewed on NPR in a story about these programs, "I didn't know condoms were so ineffective." So, when the abstinence-only students decide that "abstinence sometimes" is good enough for all practical purposes, guess what they WON'T bother to use?

...The vote was 12 to 11, with Democratic Sens. Blanche Lincoln (Ark.) and Kent Conrad (N.D.) voting with every Republican to secure passage of the measure..."

We know that Blanche Lincoln is just a highly paid Wal-Mart employee and cannot be expected to act like a dem but Conrad is really getting on my nerves. He's any lobbyist's with money pet monkey doing tricks for coin.

Tell this nonsense to by friend whose pregnant 15 y/o's entire life is now heavily burdened for lack of sexual education thinking if he just takes it out at the last moment without knowing that boys "leak" anytime while having sex...or if maybe condoms were passed out at school. Conrad's condescending attitude is always "blame the victim" with no real understanding of reality.

$50 mil.down the drain but we will never be able to afford healthcare reform or a Public Option. Any normal business would fire this goober...but we have to endure his thinking he's special

Sex education, no way! How else are we going to get more rethuglicans?

It's useless to try to convince a Christian fundamentalist winger that abstinence-only education works. Every single recipient of A-O ed could have a yearly pregnancy and the proponents would still insist that it works.

This is a clash between world views: one that respects data and rational decisionmaking, and one that will tirelessly defend its version of the "Christian view." This is about science and reason for us. For them, it's about defending god and what they define as a godly life against infidels and secularists. We aren't even in the same room.

We will never convince these hard-case fundies of the truth. We can only focus on sharing the data with the moderates not immune to reason, in hopes of outnumbering the loons to the point that Congress stops being so full of people pandering to them.

Hey $50 mil of someone else's money is a very, very small price to pay to be on Jeebus' side come election day.

Do progressive safe-sex programs work? STDs are skyrocketing among pre-teens and teenagers alike. I'm guessing the "let's put a condom on a banana" skit isn't working.

But let's not facts get in the way. We need more progressive safe-sex programs, which teach nothing but sex with anyone at anytime is OK, as long as you use a condom.

Not that I am any fan of abstinence only programs but your arguments carry little water when you trash talk cheating republican leadership when the democratic leadership has the exact same percentage of cheaters. Keep your rhetoric and slander out of the argument.

Nor is there any real evidence that comprehensive sex education works either. Neither does much to prevent early sexual activity, one does encourage greeter protection and more knowledge for the kids who do get the message. And at the same time comprehensive sex education in some places is not sexual health related but more lifestyle and promiscuity education.

I'm all for comprehensive sex education, age appropriate, and science based. But leave the lifestyles and propaganda out of the schools, and ensure it's taught by the schools, not special interest group with agenda to push. Check out many of the leading areas where comprehensive sex ed is taught. often it is not taught by a licensed teacher or even by an employee of the school but rather by a special interest group, political group, lifestyle or gay agenda group, or so called sex experts who are more like sex obsession experts. Lets get real sex education in our schools taught by real teachers in a neutral politically unfettered factual based programs.

If Sen. Hatch truly believes abstinence only education is effective then he should support an amendment to end all federal funding for pregnancy tests, pregnant mom check-ups, well baby visits and vaccinations for the children of teenagers.

Since abstinence education is working this money is just wasted anyway.

Abstinence education is absolutely useless. Teens are going to have sex regardless of what they are told and taught. Just like we spend millions of dollars trying to explain to teens how bad drugs really are, but they still do it. Spending 50 million dollars on sex education is not the brightest thing to be doing in this economy. Teens know how a child can change there entire life they don’t need 50 million dollars used to understand the important of a child. Fact is must teens are going to do what they want to do when they think the time is right. Schools should just have health or P.E teachers explain to them the importance of abstinence sense they get paid to teach and all. Teens can skip one day of flag football once every two weeks. This is one issue money will not solve teens are curious people and they often don’t think twice and nothing will solve this. Not even 50 million dollars.

Here's another amendment Hatch should support: give pregnant girls and the boys who father their children an "F" in the Abstinence-Only course and make that "F" a permanent part of their GPA.

Enough cheap grace! C'mon Senator Hatch, put some teeth into your bill!

In which Steve Benen pretends to care about a mere $50M of public funds. While grimly defending his party's wasting of many thousandfold more.

So as this isn't about money, what *is* it about?

It's about hate. Inciting and sustaining hatred so as to prevent members of the tribe from wandering into areas where he'd prefer they not venture.

But a caveat here: most studies have found that conventional SexEd doesn't really have much affect on teen behavior either.

It depends on which teen behavior you're trying to affect. If you're trying to prevent hormone-filled teenagers from having sex at all, there's pretty much nothing short of outfitting each one with a chastity belt that's going to work. They're teenagers. They're going to have sex.

If you're trying to prevent hormone-filled teenagers from getting an STI or getting pregnant, reality-based sex education is actually very successful, especially if it includes things like teaching kids (especially, but not only, girls) to assert themselves and say "no" to sex they don't want.

Turns out that teaching kids to take responsibility for their own actions and protect themselves actually works. Who'd'a thunk it?

Do progressive safe-sex programs work? STDs are skyrocketing among pre-teens and teenagers alike. I'm guessing the "let's put a condom on a banana" skit isn't working.

Rates of pregnancy and STDs are skyrocketing because progressive safe-sex programs have been replaced by "Sex makes the Baby Jeebus cry" programs where "educators" tell kids that sex is like chewing gum and you wouldn't want to chew someone else's chewing gum, would you?

But, hey, if you want to keep your kids completely ignorant so your daughter doesn't even realize she's pregnant at 15 until she goes into labor, then you should homeschool them rather than inflict your idiocy on the rest of us who want our kids to have actual facts and information at school.

Check out many of the leading areas where comprehensive sex ed is taught. often it is not taught by a licensed teacher or even by an employee of the school but rather by a special interest group, political group, lifestyle or gay agenda group,[...] -- carbonware, @12:22

Verily! Them gays come to our schools and, stealthily, teach the impressionable youth to have gay sex -- all fun, all all the time and the best pregnancy prevention, evah.

That "ware" that's wearing out your brain... was it dioxide or monoxide incident?

Orin Hatch presents himself as a distinguished , perfectly groomed, wealthy older white man. Thankfully, the cultural imprint is shifting, albeit slowly. The American imprint automatically recognizes an Orin Hatch and many of his Republican colleagues as trustworthy, wise and learned exactly because of the characteristics I outlined. I am encouraged to see that this stereotype is failing to resonate with people, driven by larger and larger demographic shifts in the population . Contradictory thinking and arrogance is not singular to Republicans but it is a central characteristic of their national persona: I deserve your deference because I’m well …superior. Hatch bleats about the Government co-opting individual choice while insisting that his own personal , moral and largely religious beliefs be enshrined in national legislation. The unfathomable irony is that he will not support accessible health care for all Americans. I am disgusted by the obvious selling of American interests in favor of corporate interests especially in the face of the widely verified desire for accessible and affordable health care. Congressional representation my ass - I’m not feeling very represented, but then I’m not an old rich white guy.

The bottom line is that AO is a strategy that DOES NOT work to decrease teen sexual activity.

Go look at the stats. Red states have higher rates of teen pregnancy and teen STDs. So, yeah, there is proof that AO doesn't work since teens obviously are not remaining abstinent in red state.

So, this is just a stupid waste of money, and the people who whine and moan and kvetch about our national debt and think of OUR CHILDREN and we can't afford this and we can't afford that are big fat hypocrites.

Everything is beautiful on Planet Wingnuttia. The girls are all chaste. No homos lurk. Nobody gets divorced. Nobody cheats. Nobody ever has an abortion or uses contraception that might kill a fertalized egg...oh, I mean human being. Nuclear missiles live in peace. There are no commies or nazis. No illegals. Harry Potter and Charles Darwin don't exist. Everyone lives by the Bible. Everyone's a Christian, a REAL Christian. Nobody says Happy Holidays, only Merry Christmas.

God, sounds like Hell to me.

I'm still waiting for the "metrics of success" for the progressive version of sex education. I can sum up the progressive's sex ed quite succintly: have sex with whomever or whatever you want. Just use a condom.

The hands-on portion of the training, of course, is showing school children how to ensconse a cucumber with a rubber.

But pay no attention to rising STD rates, single motherhood rates and other metrics. Those, of course, are because of the small cluster of faith-based abstience programs. Not the progressive sex education programs that are prevalent throughout our public schools and media.

I'm still waiting for the "metrics of success" for the progressive version of sex education.

You mean like this one? Or this one? Or this one?

Yes, it's too bad that there's absolutely no evidence out there so our only choice is to continue doing what we already know doesn't work.

I can sum up the progressive's sex ed quite succintly: have sex with whomever or whatever you want. Just use a condom.

And you should be allowed to dictate who I have sex with ... why, again? Peeping into your neighbors' windows to see what kind of sex they're having is illegal in most states. I suppose you can try to dictate who your own kids have sex with, but it's pretty sick to have a parent decide who's going to have sex with their kid. Are you planning to have an internet auction or just hold private interviews at home to decide who you can picture in bed having sex with your child?

But pay no attention to rising STD rates, single motherhood rates and other metrics. Those, of course, are because of the small cluster of faith-based abstience programs. Not the progressive sex education programs that are prevalent throughout our public schools and media.

I see that the fact that those rising rates of STIs and teen motherhood are happening in states that have banned comprehensive sex education in favor of abstinence-only has completely escaped you. Or are you under the impression that Texas and Mississippi are offering comprehensive sex education?

One correction: We're not talking about $50 million of our money; we're talking about $50 million of our money per year through 2014. So the lede should say "hundreds of millions of dollars," although without pinning down the start date for this spending we don't know exactly how many.

Abstinence education is absolutely useless. Teens are going to have sex regardless of what they are told and taught. Just like we spend millions of dollars trying to explain to teens how bad drugs really are, but they still do it. Spending 50 million dollars on sex education is not the brightest thing to be doing in this economy. Teens know how a child can change there entire life they don’t need 50 million dollars used to understand the important of a child. Fact is most teens are going to do what they want to do when they think the time is right. Schools should just have health or P.E teachers explain to them the importance of abstinence sense they get paid to teach and all. Teens can skip one day of flag football once every two weeks. This is one issue money will not solve teens are curious people and they often don’t think twice and nothing will solve this. Not even 50 million dollars.Many teens who do have sex in there young years are likely under the persuasion of alcohol. Teens will not be thinking about what they learned in school when they are under the influence they will just do what they want to, whether it be using protection or not.

This is the welcome page for the dentaldoctor.us Association web site.

This is the welcome page for the dentaldoctor.us Association web site.

This is the welcome page for the dietguidance.us Association web site.

This is the welcome page for the dietguidance.us Association web site.

This is the welcome page for the dietguidance.us Association web site.