ozone home capacity circulation trends mitigating

Gotta admit, Steve, that even at 5 am when I read that Douthat nonsense, I had the same reaction. I mean, Ross baby, talk about track record...!

Bet Douthat has trouble spelling the names of those oppressed internat'l heroes.

What is the leading prize for douchebaggery?

There's a Reese Witherspoon lookalike joke in here somewhere. The first person to find it gets the satisfaction of knowing that I laughed audibly at my desk in the middle of the day for no apparent reason.

Cheap shot with that closing. There's a huge difference between getting the Nobel Prize, for which there is no metric of future performance, and getting a job, from which you can be fired, and for which you have to produce regular output that will be (mercilessly, apparently) evaluated.

The fact that I agree with Ross that it would have been marvelously smart politics to refuse the prize is not relevant, but worth noting.

I didn't read this column in time to comment at it at the Times. One can debate whether Obama has yet "earned" the Nobel Prize. But when Douthat says that he "wasn't brave enough" to turn it down, here's what I think:

Every time Mr. Obama goes out in public, in a country full of lunatics who increasingly take heavy weaponry to public meetings and are being egged on by the Glenn Becks and Michelle Bachmanns and their ilk to act on their insane fantasies, he is behaving with more courage than most civilians will be required to show in a lifetime.

I think everyone knows now that whatever Obama does, says, thinks, imagines, etc. (you get the idea) the wingnuts and their dupes will without a doubt criticiz him without any rational thought at all. I mean look at the last 9 months.

The Nobel committee hates America and that is why they awarded the prize to BHO. Douthat is absolutely right that BHO should have refused the award, but naive to think that would ever happen.

i'd hafta say this was Asshat's last chance to register commentary that was in any way anchored to planet earth...certainly anything he would say about barack obama -- or his "post-christian, post-marxist" buds.

sheesh, what a fool! best buy for a "post-new york times" ross douthat: a season with the billy graham crusades -- ross and franklin could make beautiful music together... a sort of "good cop/bad cop" evangelism...yee haw.

Have a look at time.com, newsweek.com,ft.com, economist.com

Check out the singular disinterest or negativity as far as the prize is concerned. At Time it ranks 1 in the Top 10 Backlash moments, as a prime backfire.

This award was given too soon - and is becoming an embarrassment, rather than an accolade. The Norwegian Nobel committee has spent the weekend trying to explain its decision, instead of lauding the recipient.

(I'm in Oslo).

Sad - doesn't make me like Douthat's column, but the committee would have helped Obama a lot more if it had awarded the prize to one of the issues he is concerned about.
Such as the doctors giving free health care to the US disadvantaged. The right wing would have been just as livid, but it would have helped Obama, not hindered him.

Yeah don't get above yourself, boy.

there's two different issues here: the first is whether the nobel prize made sense.

broadly speaking it does - the world is a safer and better place with obama in the oval office in lieu of bush - but sure, it's obviously a difficult choice to explain by the nobel committee.

but second, we have the noxious notion that obama should just have said "thanks, but no thanks," which, as has already been pointed out, would have earned him nothing but disdain for being uppity.

well, ok, there's a third point: the notion that by selecting the american president for the nobel prize, the nobel committee proved it hates america. that takes al's special intelligence.

The Nobel committee hates America and that is why they awarded the prize to BHO. - Al

Hey Al, let's see whether you completed your assignment from last week so that you don't slander again the wrong country. The fact that you're now leaving that part out suggests that you're still a bit wobbly on it.

So, answer the question: The Nobel Peace Prize is being awarded by a committee in which country?

One thing about today's conservatives is that they are of such poor professional quality that it is impossible to even view them as adults, let alone credible respectable adults.

It's not hard to see what's really going on here, and you don't need to be a Shakespearean dramaturg to figure it out: jealousy rears its shiny head. No conservative thinks the Nobel Peace Prize is worth anything because it always goes to do-gooders and bleeding hearts, but when it gets awarded, they're secretly -- and sometimes not so secretly -- pissed off because their guy didn't get it. (You see this in other awards, too -- there are still those who don't believe Marisa Tomei earned her Oscar; it had to be a mistake.) And I suspect there's a little bit of internalizing going on here, too; it probably had to rankle that Mr. Douthat hasn't yet won a Pulitzer for his commentary, going instead to that flaming liberal Eugene Robinson at the Washington Post. Mr. Robinson suggests that instead of going off on an Iago-trip of inexplicable rage, the right wing should show a little maturity and send a simple note of congratulations. After all, if the prize doesn't mean all that much, what's the big deal, and why is Ross Douthat making so much of it? Dr. Freud, call your service.

(You see this in other awards, too -- there are still those who don't believe Marisa Tomei earned her Oscar; it had to be a mistake.)

Well, I'm one of those, but I assure you it isn't jealousy inspiring my disbelief. I was up for supporting actress in a whole different year.

Obama gave voice to millions of people besieged by 8 years of naval gazing neocon nonsense. Good enough for this American, and god damn proud to boot.

The I hate America crowd is a little tiresome.

Here was a place to draw a clean line between himself and all the overzealous Obamaphiles, at home and abroad, who poured their post-Christian, post-Marxist yearnings into the vessel of his 2008 campaign.

Ahem.

"George Bush should have not accepted the Supreme Court's ruling on Bush v. Gore. Here was a place to draw a clean line between himself and all the reactionary Republicans, at home and in Texas, who poured their pre-Enlightenment, antebellum yearnings and oil company earnings into the vessel of his 2000 campaign."

Can I write for The Atlantic now?

Moral indignation is nothing but petty jealousy with a halo around it.

HG Wells

Doubt-ass somehow cannot understand that it would have been patently insulting to the committee and the Norwegians (and essentially to Europeans in general) to refuse an honor that they conferred according to the criteria they chose to apply (wacky as you may believe those criteria to be).

Obama didn't award the Prize to himself, fools. He didn't nominate himself, he didn't campaign for it, he didn't know it was coming. He has no culpability of any kind in having been honored. And it is absolutely impossible for him to refuse it, for many, many reasons, all of which have already been stated countless times in multiple high-profile venues (yet, curiously, seem not to have penetrated wingnut redoubts).

Just shut up, you clueless, classless, time-wasting twits. To take a leaf from your own book: Haven't you got "more important issues" to whine about?

Ross needs to take off his pajamas and start writing about something that matters. Oh, wait, does he know how to do that?

... and for which you have to produce regular output that will be (mercilessly, apparently) evaluated.

I see this kind of sentiment from time to time, and I can never understand why people express it.

Does any criticism from the left adversely affect people like Douthat in any way? No. Does being criticized for saying stupid things make you a victim of some kind? No.

In other words, if this "poor Ross" stuff is anything other than total bullshit, I'd love to see an explanation as to why. An explanation that itself isn't also total bullshit, I should add.

Obama wins the Nobel Prize and Rush Limbaugh is told by a bunch of NFL players that they would not even take money from him. Plus health care might get out of committee this week so the real work can begin.

Add this to Pam and Jim's wedding and this fall is off to a great start.

bcamarda's 1:45pm point is solid. But we can also consider the fact that BHO spent a good amount of time in parts of Chicago that I'd bet Mr Douthat wouldn't be willing to enter with anything short of a brigade.
I see nothing in Mr Douthat's biography to suggest that he's ever in his life been called upon to display anything resembling bravery. I would be happy to be proven wrong in this. But I won't be holding my breath.

@keptsimple: Douthat would turn down the Nobel Peace Prize even if it was wearing pink pajamas and on the pill. Or Douthat would turn down the Nobel Peace Prize because the committee wanted him to have it a little too much.

After all, when it comes to receiving high-profile, sought-after honors after a brief public career, based largely on hopes of future successes and political considerations, Ross Douthat knows of what he speaks.

Oooof!

Awesome Steve. Can't wait for Douthat to resign from the Times. That would surely demonstrate his instinctive democratic bona fides.

The only person to refuse a Nobel Peace Prize - Le Duc Tho

Awesome, trex.

Someone who deserves an even more acerbic "look who's talking" is Maureen Dowd. The woman who won a Pulitzer for snickering over second-hand gossip about a President's love-life imagined a conversation between Clinton and George W Bush, both steaming with indignation that Obama got the award for being "President Paris Hilton" and so on like that. Our dear Maureen finds a way not only to denigrate the masculinity of the President yet again, but to attack the entire Nobel panel while she's at it ("Oslo ice queens") and of course, to play mind-reader yet again. And guess what she discovers? That everyone else is as spiteful, petty, shallow and envious as Maureen Dowd! What an amazing coincidence!

The only person to refuse a Nobel Peace Prize - Le Duc Tho

So did Jean-Paul Sartre.

Oops, I stand corrected; John C. McCutchen said Peace Prize. My bad.

I see nothing in Mr Douthat's biography to suggest that he's ever in his life been called upon to display anything resembling bravery.

You have no idea how difficult it was to resist that chunky Reese Witherspoon look-a-like who's breasts were spilling out onto Douthat's face as she masticated his neck and whispered "I'm on the pill." That is to say, to turn her down while maintaining the illusion of being a normal heterosexual male. Damn near impossible it was!

Shortstop, thank you, assuming the remark was meant for me, though I don't know how yours managed to go first in that case! But hey, I didn't solicit your congratulations, didn't lobby for them, and am happy to take any "awesome" that I can get ;-)

Quite seriously, however, I think that in the eyes of the Nobel panel and a lot of Europeans, Obama has already done something, and something important. He ran a Presidential campaign that swept the party of Bush out of power. That alone is enough to make the rest of the world very grateful to him. And what's more, as the first African American to be a serious Presidential candidate, he put his life on the line to do it, and is still risking assassination every day that he's in office. Don't kid yourselves; the death threats against this President are more numerous by orders of magnitude than those in the past. He's proven that yes, any American boy with enough gumption can grow up to be President, regardless of color, and it took a lot of bravery to go first.

Why, oh why, did the Times give callow "Neck-Beard" a platform? Oh, wait, he was the replacement for the heinous Kristol. Just a different brand of bad.

Can you imagine the vitriol that would be hurled if Obama had refused the Nobel? Shudder.

Had the Nobel Committee added that they were all on the pill now, it would have been easier for Obama to withdraw from them the honor of having the times of their lives enjoying the President's unusually large ego.

You know, Obama could have gone out there and said that the prize really belonged to Bush and Cheney and he was going to accept it on their behalf and in their honor, and fuckwits like Douthat would still bitch and moan.

Once again, Politico has twisted itself into a pretzel in order to find a way to criticize President Obama and his administration. There is nothing resembling journalism in this story. It is pure tabloid trash. It right up there with People and US Magazine. It's really embarrassing.

"In other words, if this "poor Ross" stuff is anything other than total bullshit, I'd love to see an explanation as to why. An explanation that itself isn't also total bullshit, I should add."

DH--I was saying that the comparison to Douthat getting much desired space at Atlantic and NYT is not the same as winning the Nobel Peace Prize because in the former one is constantly putting out product, which is evaluated. I think if you disagree with Douthat, be merciless, he's putting his stuff out there for consumption and criticism. I can see why you saw a "boo hoo" in that, but it was ineptly written on my part. Steve's criticism was merciless, but fair until the personal dig.

And seriously, is anyone contending that Douthat isn't a massive improvement over Kristol? yes, that's an exceedingly low bar, but Douthat, like another prominent youngish person much in the news, greatly benefits from succeeding a monumentally incompetent person.

Question: would Hillary have won a Nobel Peace Prize? Would she have "deserved" it as much as Obama? Let's assume she also gave a great speech in Cairo, ended torture (although not, apparently, extraordinary rendition and limitless detention without trial), and did everything else that O has done. He conquered racism to reach to Oval Office, she would have beaten sexism to do it. In other words, hasn't O pretty much done what any Democrat elected to follow Bush would have done? President Christopher Dodd would have been largely indistinguishable on policy matters, although obviously the symbolic heft would be absent (and the speeches would be skull-piercing boring)

WWMMS? What would Miss Manners say? I think the correct answer is that if someone gives you an award or a gift, you accept it, unless there is something wrong about it. Person of the Year from the Nazi Party? Don't accept. Generally, not accepting it seems to imply some level of criticism of the giver, making refusal a bit ungracious. Judith?

Chubby Reese Witherspoon dodged a bullet.

Obama: The Manchurian Nobel Laureate

Hey Al, let's see whether you completed your assignment from last week so that you don't slander again the wrong country. The fact that you're now leaving that part out suggests that you're still a bit wobbly on it. So, answer the question: The Nobel Peace Prize is being awarded by a committee in which country?
Posted by: SRW1

Why are you trying to engage in serious argument with a parody troll? Al's been here since the beginning of this blog in 2004. He's yanking your chain. He's not going to respond to your question. He delights in making people like you appear stupid.

Longtime commenters here simply ignore him. Please do the same.

Chubby Reese Witherspoon dodged a bullet.

Posted by: joejoejoe

Among other things ...

It's simple: Nothing Obama will ever do will ever be enough for these jackasses. It really won't.

Ross' craptacular column should more accurately read:

Here was an opportunity to try and appease us, in a stroke, from the clinically fucking brain dead stupidity that we demand from his presidency -- including the implausible expectations, the utopian dreams, the messianic hoo-ha that we have created out of whole cloth in order to criticize him without substance. We will then, of course, criticize him for doing the exact things we asked him to do.

So ... did I ever tell you the story about this girl I met? She looked like a chunkier Reece Witherspoon ...

That'd be more honest and better encapsulate the true nature of their complaints.

The fact he has a gig at the NYT is one of the many reasons newspapers are dying.

If Obama had immediately declined the prize, I'm sure, the freak show on the right would have denounced him for demeaning America.

I have to particularly note how Ross sneaks in the "post-Christian".

Where in the world did he pull that one from??

Hey Douthat, get a life !

@ drjimcooper on October 12, 2009 at 2:55 PM:

Touché.
I stand corrected.

Le Duc Tho was a Communist. A Commnunist! If President Obama had turned down the Nobel Peace Prize, he would have joined A Communist as "The only people ever to refuse the Nobel Peace Prize" and obviously aligned himself with A Communist--thereby revealing his own Communist sympathies, if not actually that he himself is also A Communist! Imagine Limbaugh, Beck, et al frothing at the mouth over that.

Just another example of the old story...if Obama walked on water, the right wing would vilify him for not being able to swim, being "too narcissistic" to swim, etc. etc.

"Ross Douthat" should always be preceded by "misogynistic neck-beard"--thanks, Wonkette.

When NYT canned Kristol and replaced him with Douthat, Steve (Benen) cheered the move, claiming that here was a much more sensible, reasonable Repressive. Wonder how he's feeling now :)

I'm with Mustang Bobby - if Bush had won any sort of Nobel (hard to imagine what it would be, but suspend your disbelief for a moment), the right would have still been blowing trumpets about it. The prize is only meaningless, a trashy bauble awarded by the European inbreeders, when a Democrat or leftist wins it.

Exlibra, I believe Yglasias (sp?) and Kevin Drum did as well, not to mention Andrew Sullivan.

to Screamin' Demon @3:58

I wouldn't have considered that an attempt to 'engage in a serious argument'. More like an attempt to parody a parody troll.

Promise: no more feeding the pigeon.

For the dopes who think that Obama hasn't done anything yet to deserve the Nobel Prize, look at this. Iran is at the bargaining table and talking about having Russia do it's uranium enrichment and also inviting inspections in their new facility. The worldwide depression was averted. Troops are moving out of Iraq. Torture has been returned to its place as something only shitheads do. Movement in a forward direction on global warming has commenced with the US no longer acting like an anchor tied to the tail of the world. Israel is beginning to realize that it needs to join the civilized world and can't bully little kids anymore with impunity.

What exactly do people want the man to do in order to deserve it?!

What exactly do people want the man to do in order to deserve it?! -- Texas Aggie, @21:57

Scrub his face and body with a Brillo pad, till he's all white. And then switch parties. Is it too much to ask, in the cause of American-Christian bipartisanship?

Aggie, I think some critics of the awarding of the prize will always hate this president, for reasons of race or ideology (or mental illness, frankly). But for others, including some like me who voted for the man and wish him well, we are simply making a point about nearly every achievement you listed, to wit:
Iran is at the bargaining table and talking about having Russia do it's uranium enrichment and also inviting inspections in their new facility.
Yes--and this could all be meaningless posturing by the vicious bastards in charge of Iran.

The worldwide depression was averted.
So far. What if it is a W recession/depression, and not a V? What if unemployment is 20% in 2011? Would you have given the Nobel Prize to FDR in 1933? (and what does averting depression have to do with the Nobel?)

Troops are moving out of Iraq.
If this ends in a complete bloodbath, that draws in the neighbors, I would agree that it is still, ultimately, W's fault, but if peace doesn't happen, what's the prize for again?

Torture has been returned to its place as something only shitheads do.
Well, here I think you have a point. But extraordinary renditions and unlimited detentions are not yet off the table.

Movement in a forward direction on global warming has commenced with the US no longer acting like an anchor tied to the tail of the world.
Pretty words, so far, right? If he gets nothing out of Congress, and the rest of the world continues to miss its targets--what's the prize for?

Israel is beginning to realize that it needs to join the civilized world and can't bully little kids anymore with impunity.
From your mouth to God's ears, and Netanyahu's. But this HASN'T HAPPENED YET. Settlements continue rapidly all over the West Bank and East Jerusalem. Arab houses demolished. "beginning to realize" can also mean--Israel hasn't changed a bit yet.
Even listing your own reasons for him getting it, I give you an 80% on torture, and promising start on a lot else. But it all is just beginning.

Also--you said "troops are moving out of Iraq". The war is still going on. As far as I know, you typically get a Nobel for ending a war (see TR, the odious Henry the K, Sadat, and so forth). Beginning to end a war? A lot of wars begin to end, and then go on for years and years and years. The disappointment from expressed by some Iraqis in the media about the award is understandable. Were I living in a country suffering from an unended war, the winning of the Nobel Prize by the leader of the army of occupation would strike me as odd, to say the least.

Mraow!

Saucer of milk for the delightful Mr. Benen!

But seriously, folks.

It's been reported over the last few days that the Nobel Committee sometimes gives the Peace Prize to people who are doing something good, even if they aren't anywhere near their goal.

They gave it to the West German Chancellor in the early '80s when he embraced a policy of outreach to East Germany, and they gave it to Bp. Desmond Tutu in 1984, when apartheid didn't end for another 10 years.

So this isn't completely out of left field.