Hey Boehner - from a New Yorker who was in Manhattan on 9/11 and has been here since - STFU. This is exactly where he should be tried and we're not afraid.

Boehner really thinks it's possible that a jury comprised of New Yorkers might let this guy off? Really? It's far more likely that one of jurors will get a gun past security and shoot him in court.

If these killers are "set free" it will be because at their fair trial per our constitution and morals, and legal system, etc., then their freedom will be thr result of the use of torture and other illegal happenstance done to them by the Bush administartions use of these illegal ectics to elicit information from them. Wasn't Khalid water boarded like 198 times?

Any losss of a guilty verdit wil be laid at the feet of the Bushit Administration, not at the feet of the Administration that is offering a fair trial.

Indeed. I say offer a fair trial to Bushit and darth Cheney for war Crimes against the Iraqui people.

I've come to the conclusion that the GOP lives in absolute terror of everything.

Including fear itself. So don't expect coherence from that crowd. I asked yesterday on twitter - "what exactly are you guys afraid of"

"LOSING OUR FREEDOMS!!" they cried out.

"which ones? what freedoms have you lost?" I replied.

::crickets::

and these clowns think THEY should be in charge.

boehner needs to change his coward's diaper more often... it's affecting his facial complexion

FWIW, they (King & Boehner) are making two very different arguments. King's argument is just stupid, and not worth discussing.

But Boehner is clearly arguing that we can't try them because we might not get a guilty verdict. It's a fairly outrageous and offensive argument, but it's not completly off the wall, given potential problems with tainted evidence obtained by torture. (and whose fault was that, again?).

So I guess Boehner's preference would be to just execute them without a trial?

Can they get a fair trial in NYC?

Boehner and the Republicans dread more than anything the moment when just blocks from the World Trade Center site Khalid Sheikh Mohammed stands before a judge and hears the jury calmly announce "guilty."

Boehner protests too much! After the previous administration did nothing, this administration is enlivening our nation's legal discourse by putting enemies of the state on trial.

Boehner has the spine of milktoast! -Kevo

By Boehner's logic, we should never put any heinous criminal on trial lest he be found not guilty. I guess that means we're only supposed to give trials for innocent people!

Does anyone think they're making actual "arguments"?

They're just looking to get an emotional response from the bed-wetting mouth-breathing paranoid Right. And given the interest of the media -- especially but not exclusively the right-wing media -- in emotional excitement (it sells ad revenue after all!), it will be extensively covered, earnestly discussed, repeated ad nauseam, and as a result will have exactly the effect desired by Boehner et al.

Besides, isn't the real question who looks sexier in a suit?

Superpowers. Havent you heard that terrorists are a threat to the fabric of America because they can fly, become invisible, and grow their beards longer than average.

"Or are we back to Republican fears that terrorist suspects are comic-book villains with super powers?"

That's a damnable accusation, sir! You have maligned the Grand Old Party one too many times! Do you think they're all idiots? They most certainly do not believe terrorist suspects are comic-book villains with super powers! NOBODY HAS SUPER POWERS EXCEPT THE BABY JESUS!

Republicans believe terrorist suspects are criminal masterminds, like a Bond villain or Hans Gruber in DIe Hard, who will escape from a SuperMax detention facility and rape their wives and daughters.

I expect an apology shortly.

Are we back to Republican fears that terrorist suspects are comic-book villains with super powers?

I wasn't aware that we had ever left.......

"conservative Republicans/ coherent and half-way intelligent."

a Nexus search fails to find a single instance. . .

Boehner could request a change of venue ... perhaps to his home district in Ohio.

Aren't these guys supposed to be HUGE supporters of the United States Constitution? I mean the document, not the naval ship.

Seems to me that part of the Constitution guarantees the right to a fair trial. I think it's right after that "all men are created equal" part that BoehnHead read at the rally--I mean, news conference--last week.

Idiots.

mhr,

In my opinion, anyone who condones torture or who does not support the rule of law (the right to a fair trial) has rejected the principles that America stands for, and is therefore anti-American. It isn't anti-American to hold America to a high standard.

"The possibility that Khalid Sheik Mohammed and his co-conspirators could be found 'not guilty' due to some legal technicality just blocks from Ground Zero should give every American pause."

I hate to bring this up, Mr. Boehner, but if you think that legal technicalities may lead to an injustice, you might bring this to the attention of the government organization that puts such bad laws in place--oh, you're one of the leaders of the specific organization responsible? Never mind.

Republican fearmongering on terrorism depends on the idea that terrorists are supervillains, so normal means of protecting the public are useless, and we must support the conservative superheroes who will use "any means necessary," not weak libruls who will risk our lives with their "laws" and "Bill of Rights."

I vote for the super powers thing. Terrorists can make Republicans soil their diapers at a glance. What a great super power.

By Boehner's logic, we should never put any heinous criminal on trial lest he be found not guilty. I guess that means we're only supposed to give trials for innocent people!

Pretty much. The logic of almost all "tough on crime" politicians is that everyone who is accused is guilty, and everyone who is convicted should be shunned as a "criminal" for the rest of their lives.

(Except Oliver North, of course, who was convicted of a felony and got off on a technicality. IOKIYAR, as always.)

Steve - All the above, in answer to your question. While there are risks in what the administration is doing, the greater risk is the subverting of our concept of Rule of Law and Justice by believing, as Bonier does, that some things just can't be trusted to the rule of law, or democracy for that matter. It is wholly Totalitarian at heart.

A lawyer friend of mine once told me, upon hearing me mention "legal technicalities," that I was talking about the Constitution. In using the term "legal technicality" in this instance, Boehner is saying "if they were to get off because the government violated their constitutional rights." Sounds different put that way.

If I were Khalid Sheik Mohammed, I would have a hardon the size of a tree trunk right now. The notion that his mere presence "just blocks away" from the WTC site should be enough to frighten American citizens across the nation would inspire a stiffy in any self-respecting accused terrorist mastermind.

What's he going to do, John? Shoot rays out of his eyes and set New York afire? Surreptitiously scatter the plague germs he's been secreting for years, in anticipation of just such an occasion? Don't you suppose he will have been searched a bajillion times before he enters the courtroom, and be manacled to a fare-thee-well?

I thought Republicans were supposed to be the Toughie Party. Evidently not.

The Republicans loaded the 'DoJ' with hacks maybe that's why they don't trust it. I sure don't.

Holder is complicit in war crimes for not instigating prosecutions of Bush/Cheney, yet he's going to try terrorists. How Orwellian.

"Can they get a fair trial in NYC?"

I don't see how they could. Any jury there would prefer to rip the heart out of the defendant while he's still alive. The issue would be whether that heart would be shoved down their throat or up their ass. That would be the point of contention. I'd favor ramming it down their throat so they have to watch. Choke on that, bitch. In all seriousness though, the defense will argue for a change of venue, and I wouldn't be surprised if it's granted.

I agree with fostert. The defense will move for a change of venue citing an inability to get a fair trial.
Could Boehner's fear-mongering be that KSM's presence in NYC might be just as symbolic for a lot of other people and attract all kinds of destructive/dangerous behavior?

As they load KSM on the plane to the US, terrorists will secretly climb on board and enter the US, just like James Bond always does, or Jack Bauer.

Actually what the Republicans are scared of is that "nothing will happen". This will destroy their entire premise for GitMo. Once this is destroyed, we can close it.

But the rest of us get a few years of unhinged republican fear-mongering to enjoy.

Freakin' unbelievable! Boehner, have you freakin' slept through every civics class and Fouth of July speech?! It's called the "Rule of Law and it's we protect our freedoms and it's what makes America worth fighting and dying for.

*&&%$#@!!

If you were a Republican, would you want to air your dirty laundry in public about the treatment of detainees? There's probably a lot more we don't know about that KSM would relish repeating in open court.

"are we back to Republican fears that terrorist suspects are comic-book villains with super powers?"

Politicians don't believe a word of what they say, it's all show. (Pundits either, mostly).

They're not afraid, it's just a game they play. Democrats do it too, unfortunately - a difference in degree.

Quick Boehner, get a Republican elected president so we can ponder what to do about it for another 4 or 8 years.

Boner whines because Boner is a whine. I really hate the republicans. They are so stupid, it defies all reason.

Gosh ... it is almost as if the GOP doesn't like having people stand criminal trial for war crimes and mass murder, and has a problem with the basic process. Funny about that. Wonder why.

Maybe the trial will lead to investigations regarding the torture/interrogation practices? Are the GOPs really afraid of our justice system?

Two guilty parties here: the 9/11 guys and those who tortured and detained them. Let's put them both on trial.

Or are we back to Republican fears that terrorist suspects are comic-book villains with super powers?

Of course not. Don't be ridiculous.

Everyone knows they're actually immortal comic-book villains with super powers.

In the end, this could be done by a simple "clerical error." If KSM gets put in G-pop at Rikers, he might make it to lunchtime, but he'll wish he died at breakfast. There's plenty of lifers there who'd be more than happy to take him out. And I doubt the guards would stop it. At least not in time.

I think the GOP fears a real trial for a lot of reasons.

The extent to which KSM was tortured will likely be a large part of the defense strategy, and the circumstances leading up to 9/11 will probably be retold, perhaps without the authoritarian spin about a "evil" monolithic terrorist organization and more about the HUGE SECURITY AND INTELLIGENCE FAILURE by the GOP-run government that allowed these groups of terrorists to successfully execute their plan. That can't be good for the GOP at this point.

And if he does get off because all the evidence is tainted by torture, then MAYBE WE SHOULDN'T FUCKING TORTURE PEOPLE. Illegal acts should have consequences, and this qualifies.

Someone check fostert's meds, please. By the way, Riker's is the local lock-up for misdemeanants and felonious types awaiting trial. No "lifers" there, except people whose lives were cut unexpectedly short while incarcated. KSM will be cooling his heels in MCC, the federal holding pen

Statement I'd like from the White House:

"We were saddened today by the announcement of Congressman Boehner that he has lost faith in the power of justice and the American system. It is, perhaps a sign of the great pressure facing our politicians today that he has so badly "burnt out", has given up on the rule of law and lost confidence in the American system. We can only hope that, after he spends some time in the retirement we assume he will soon be announcing, that he regains his faith in the American way, and the abiding strength of our people, our system of government, and the power of our justice system. We wish the people of his district godspeed in finding a Representative who still believes in American justice to replace him."

You know who would handle this well? Who's that dude...what's his name...Oh yeah: Barack Obama.

Give me a speech along these lines:

"When the towers came down, the GOP offered nothing but fear. That got us illegal wiretaps, Gitmo, and of course, the Iraq war. When we tried to rebuild our health care system, they offered nothing but "death panels" and more fear. As we get off mideast oil, they'll try to scare you into thinking our economy will be ruined when any person with a modicum of common sense can see it will be strengthened. On every issue important to the American people they'll do their best to scare and confuse you. But hear this: Americans are not scared. Not of change, not of justice, not of our own Constitution, and certainly not of some raggedy-ass terrorists."

I wish Boner would pause, indefinitely. Gawd Ihate that orange fuck!

Dear God, please shut Boner up.

But you know what Republicans are more scared of than anything? What truly strikes fear into their shriveled little hearts? Hard work.

Is the trial going to be a circus? Of course. It's the crime of the century. (at least to us.) Deal with it.

Could unappetizing things about their behavior come out? Believe it. Don't do the crime if you can't do the time. Deal with it.

Is our justice system worth it? Yes it is.

I say find them not guilty and release them in New York. Maybe they're really bad dudes, like Snake Pliskin. Personally, I think they'd make it 5 feet before they got run over by a bus.

"Someone check fostert's meds, please."

Well, I don't get any meds. No insurance company will take me and those meds cost a lot lot more than some pot and a bottle of whiskey. Want to change that? Then allow me access to the medical system. The only access I have now is the liquor store. Change that, and I might be sane. But I'm not sure I'd want to go there.

And yes, Rikers really is an intake jail, but most of those people are going to do hard time and don't really give a shit about it. It's a very ugly place to say the least. And KSM will obviously not be there. It was a joke, and your sane ass should have caught that. I'm crazy, so I get to say crazy things. You people who claim to be sane should know better, but you don't, do you? And you sane people run this world in such a way that I feel better being crazy. I surely wouldn't want to think this world makes any sense. And I know damn well that the people who claim to be sane are really just sociopaths. These are the kind of people who think Kissinger made sense. If Kissinger is sane, then I'll stick with my insanity.

Steve, don't hate me for linking to another blog, but I think Rude Pundit has it just right:

http://rudepundit.blogspot.com/

VaLiberal wrote: "Could Boehner's fear-mongering be that KSM's presence in NYC might be just as symbolic for a lot of other people and attract all kinds of destructive/dangerous behavior?"

That depends if Fox News decides to stage a protest, doesn't it?

And look, CJColucci, I live in a world where I admit that I'm crazy. But I'm not as crazy as the people who run this world. Our wold is such that we'll kill three million people in Vietnam to try to turn them capitalist, and the Communist Party there turns them capitalist anyway. This is what you think is sane? I'll stay crazy.

"but I think Rude Pundit has it just right"

The Rude Pundit always has it right.

Or are we back to Republican fears that terrorist suspects are comic-book villains with super powers?

Didn't you hear? John Boehner and the Republicans have inside information that Khalid Sheikh Mohammed can grow 25 feet tall, sprout metal claws like Wolverine and can see through walls! He reportedly has the strength of a hundred men so no SuperMax prison can hold him! He's also able to communicate with his massive army camped out on the dark side of the moon by way of a Borg implant; they're just awaiting his orders to invade with their honking, laser equipped tri-legged war machines!

These people are so fucking stupid some days it's all I can do not to drink myself to death.

I forget which Douglas Adams book it was, but there was a guy who had a place he called "Outside the Asylum." The premise was that he was the only true sane person and the entire world was insane. So he built a house that was inverted so that when you were inside, you were really outside. It seemed really silly when I first read it, but it seems a lot more sane now. And I challenge you sane people to refute it.

And it really comes down to this: If sanity is what this world is, why would I want to be sane?

Peter King has to be one of the biggest ASSHOLES of all time. I won't dignify what the scum said on ABC News by posting it here.

The defense will move for a change of venue citing an inability to get a fair trial.

Prosecutor's response is pretty easy-- where could we move it where he could get a fair trial of unbiased people who don't have a strong opinion about 9/11? The moon?

Mostly I don't know how they're going to choose jurors, aside from that I think it's the right, CONSTITUTIONAL thing to do. It's amazing how little faith the "law and order" party has in the criminal justice system.

NYC is where the crime was committed so that is where they should be tried and punished.

Hey guys, its not just Boehner whos raised his voice against this-its the majority of Americans. Like it or not, the Dems dig their own political graves by this kind of offensive blogging

Boehner simply wants KSM to be tried either in Texas, where we know that evidence means nothing in death penalty cases, like, say, arson or like the line from Breaker Morant: ...tried under Rule .303.

An actual trial, where all those Liberty Law School graduates might handle the prosecutor's work, should scare the pants off JB.

There is no "if" about it; should the defense shows that the evidence was obtained by torture, all evidence based on that torture will be excluded. Only if there is sufficient evidence from other sources will the defendents be convicted. And that is what Boehner et al are worried about; if the defendents ARE found innocent it will be because of the illegal and unconstitutional actions of the Bush Administration. And even the stupidest person (I don't include teabaggers, they aren't even THAT smart!) will realize it.
As to the ability of the defendents to get a fair trial; the reports I have read concerning juries where the defendent/s face a death sentence revealed that those jurors took their jobs very, very seriously. I doubt the jurors will go into the trial with the attitude that the defendents are guilty and have to prove their innocence or, at the very least, not most of them. Considering the national mood then, that is probably the best result available.

The "majority of Americans" want KSM never to be tried? Or they want him tried someplace like Yemen, where the populace is fond of Americans and will do their bit to see he gets the punishment he deserves? Perhaps the "majority of Americans" uncomfortable with the rule of law would prefer to auction off the opportunity to shoot him from behind a two-way mirror. Maybe the majority in the facility where you're being held feels that way. Cite some links that support your allegation. You sound like an independent shoved right up something, I'll give you that.

I hate to dash your hopes but KSM is getting the death penalty. He will be tried and found guilty. Thats the end of it, to think anything else is just plain stupid. Do you really really think that America and her citizens would stand to let this fiend go, even if his admission was coersed? If you do, then you are living in lalaland and it just wont happen.Ever.