Hatch and Lieberman both support the President's decision..that's enough to make me feel VERY ill at ease.

From the comments I'm seeing around the leftysphere, it is NOT going over well. At all. So not sure how representative this is of the left overall, since it does seem a bit low from what I'm seeing.

With that being typed, a lot of folks are still willing to cut Obama some slack this early in his term, so maybe that's it.

::shrugs::

From the comments I'm seeing around the leftysphere, it is NOT going over well. At all.

The upside is, I no longer feel like I need to read a lot of blogs, because of this new uniformity of dismal histrionics. "Look at me! I'm disappointed too! Really, very disappointed! Look! You're not looking!"

Most of those stating "Not Sure" are actually against, I'd bet. They just don't want to appear to be in league with the GOP in bringing the Administration down...yet.

I haven't seen any, but I'm guessing that conservative groups are overwhelmingly against this even though they'd be for it if President Palin had done it.

Could a progressive opponent give us an alternative to Obama's plan? Frankly, I would rather spend resources chasing Al Quida and the Taliban all over Afganistan and Pakistan than only defending against the next nasty attack.

Again the real enemy is in Saudi Arabia, but like good dogs we are never going to go after our masters.

The President deserves our support. He thought this through well. Very well, and for far too long according to ditherer Cheney. He has a pretty solid record of doing the right thing. It is not like we could just get out now. Our withdrawal from Iraq is progressing. You aren't hearing about large numbers of Americans dying in Iraq anymore. I want the Afghan war over ASAP, but honestly, it can't happen immediately. If the left abandons him, well the alternative is pretty unpleasant...President Palin and a republican congress. We can't allow something like that to happen

The Whitehouse listened to the MIC not Move-On.

It really doesn't matter what peaceniks think, feel or do.

Perpetuwar lives!

The indecision must be twice-burned people who wait and see whether Obama's lying about withdrawal like he lied about closing Guantanamo and controlling illegal surveillance. Anybody with half a forebrain has to be braced for the eventual news that all of a sudden now we can't pull out.

Look, there is no good course of action. We went through this under Clinton with the wars in Bosnia, Kosovo, and Rwanda, and people on the left didn't care for those either. It sucks if you leave and it sucks if you stay and ultimately it's the people in those countries who determine when they're tired of the killing. I'm not going to second-guess because I don't fucking know either.

I agree with Patrick. I really don't agree with Tom. And Twice Burned is a jerk.

OK - I'll break Godwin's Law. Say I had donned the brown shirt, polished my black marching boots and grown the stern looking mustache that was a requirement for the trueblood back then in the 30s.

Then, when my dear leader gets elected (or rather pulls the putsch that gives him the Reichstag), he turns around and goes all broken-gun, peace and brotherhood among peoples on me.

Yup. I'd be disappointed, too. "What, no war?"

The only thing that would make it worse was if he got the Peace Prize.

The problem is that Move-on probably comprises the best-informed and most astute segment of the electorate. Having endorsed Obama early in the primary process they are invested in his success and pre-disposed to support him. If a majority of that group opposes the escalation then its probably a terrible idea.

MoveOn has become too radical for me. I don't see how anyone can ask such a black and white question when the problem is way more nuanced than that. I support the President but I of course wish we could end the wars in the Middle East. I know for a fact the President knows more about this than I do and I'll support him for now.

move-on can disagree with obama but do they and those on the left really think that their hold on power, to the extent that it exists today...

is going to grow?

their high water mark was last year's election.

sure its nice to shoot for perfection but get real.

The president is making tough decisions with thought and compassion. I trust him and I support his decision.

So much for reality having a liberal bias. And proof that, from time to time and on certain issues, American liberals can be every bit as ideologically blind as conservatives.

Even though my husband claims I'm "a flaming commie", I think of myself as "a pragmatic moderate, with a slight list to the left". So, I was one of those "not sure" MoveOn members, since there was no 'wait and see" category. I wish we could withdraw -- lock, stock and barrel -- from both Iraq and Afghanistan, yesterday. But I don't see how we can.

But yeah, I still support MoveOn, despite being on the outs with them at least half of the time (sometimes on positions, sometimes on tactics) and despite my serious doubts about how much influence they have (less than they think, I suspect, because, some people hear "MoveOn" and stop listening altogether). But US -- including the current admin -- *needs* harrying from the left flank, and they do do that. It's worth a few bucks every quarter or so, without getting totally wrapped up in them, emotionally.

Two reasons not to be shocked that MoveOn isn't anti-war by 85%:

1) There are strong alliances among
Obama's "Organizing for America"
and
"MoveOn"
and
Howard Dean's "Democracy for America"

By the time these three groups trickle down from paid staff they are all the same ol' same ol' little progressive bunches in towns and communities around the country, they are all the same people.

so obama's grassroots is moveon's grassroots is howard dean's grassroots.

2) MoveOn wasn't even talking about afghanistan until this past summer -- focused on the stimulus and healthcare...

Only in the last several weeks has MoveOn opened the dialogue about the Afghanistan war to its membership...

"...the MoveOn membership -- some of the most well informed, unapologetically progressive activists in the country..."

Yeah. Right.

More like whoever gives 'em five bucks for a t-shirt.

Could a progressive opponent give us an alternative to Obama's plan?

Pull out. Now. And start treating ay-rabs with respect instead of continuing to kick them in the nuts and the crying like a WATB when they respond with a 2x4 to our heads.

Yeah, but that ain't as fun as Obama's plan, is it?

Oh, and what Neill said regarding the interrelationship between MoveOn and Organizing for America.

MoveOn aren't progressive activists so much as they are well-off middle class white folks who aren't concerned about not being able to afford health insurance or being forced to join the military in order to pay for college.

Support of the Lou Zhu, Lou Zhu worked hard
Signature--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Nothing is impossible for a willing heart.
ugg bailey button
ugg classic cardy

there are clearly going to be a lot of people on here that will be shocked when half of us don't bother voting, and Democrats lose 40-50 seats.

Really, this isn't a well thought out post, it's a post designed to make Obamatons feel better about the fact that they just nuked the base of the party.

I second Patrick, maggie, and tiredofgreed. And, as usual, Disputo is an idiot.

Don't bother voting? What kind of fucking moron would vote when it's long been painfully obvious that if voting could change anything it would be illegal? There is no daylight between Bush and your phony reformer on human rights. You slaves are happy with no right to silence, no freedom from unreasonable search, no habeas corpus and no enforcement of the supreme law of the land which requires prosecution of torturers. You gave it up in a panic and you don't mind not having it, now that your chosen dictator's in charge. At least malnourished Afghan dudes know who their enemies are.

second Patrick, maggie, and tiredofgreed. And, as usual, Disputo is an idiot.

Don't bother voting? What kind of fucking moron would vote when it's long been painfully obvious
classic tall ugg boots