It's the personification of informed debate to offer non-germane amendments? Did I just step into the Academic Decathlon from Billy Madison?

Raise your right hand:

I do solemnly swear to do everything in my power to uphold and obstruct all efforts of legislation by the majority so help me god.

Will the obstructor...I mean Senator...please explain why it is a good use of taxpayers' money to
obstruct, obfuscate, and pontificate ad nauseum.

Healthcare reform is dead. Any meaningful progress will be neutered beyond usefulness.

Now's the time for a national healthcare co-op, forget Washington, we'll do it ourselves.

At what point does it start making sense to just say, okay, if you're going to use amendments to stall then we'll just skip the amendments? It seems like most of the proposed amendments are to the Republicans' benefit anyway.

Why is the populace not outraged by this? Why aren't the Dem senators at least doing all they can to highlight the callous, obstructionist Republican actions? Shouldn't it matter that the Republicans are not there to govern? And if they aren't, why are they even there?

Grrrrr! I can't even adequately describe how loathesome and despicable they are. It won't take too many years of this to finish off what "W" started, too.

It's past time to abolish the Senate. How many billions does it cost to support it each year? What is its production? Does anyone seriously think it acts as a positive check and balance on the House? On anything? We probably could do as well or as badly with just the House, but if you insist on a second group, abolish all the current Senate rules (filibuster and anonymous holds first) and create a chamber with sane rules. Get rid of all current Senator too, if you try to create a new Senate. Don't allow ANY current Senator to run for the new chamber for 10 years at least. Some good people would lose their jobs, but the place would be better for it. Establish strict campaign spending guidelines with huge fines and jail time for the person running as well as those who cheat. Last question: Does anyone know the totals reported (as opposed to actually) spent on all Senate campaigns, including primaries, in 2008, 2006, and 2004? Disclaimer: Some of those dollars were mine originally.

I have no idea how any of the above could happen since a Senate is part of the Constitution, a document I have also promised (you are not required to swear) to uphold. But someone out there must have some ideas other than guns and bombs.

ABOLISH THE SENATE NOW

The obvious answer is not to allow Republicans to offer any amendments. They'll claim that's what the Dems did anyway, so what have they got to lose?

Unfortunately, Lieberman and Nelson would probably prevent such a rule from passing...

will the Democrats manage to get any good messaging out of this? Use it in any organized, effective way to educate the public or move opinion?

I didn't think so.

Somebody should study the politics of the Panama Canal treaties as an analogy. Those were also the target of excruciating process delays, e.g., not simply the question of the Senate's advice and consent with respect to ratification, but also of the exchange of the instruments of ratification, motions to resolve the Senate into the Committee of the Whole, etc.

The specific tactics are less important than the strategy: Every step was an opportunity to work and build the network of opponents of the "Panama Canal giveaway".

In the end, the treaties were ratified, of course -- but the long process of keeping the debate alive built the wave that elected Reagan. Reagan totally ignored the Canal once he was elected -- but there's good reason to think he'd never have been nominated without the issue.

I don't think it is likely to happen here -- but I'd expect some of the right to think that (Palin is already wondering if complaining about "death panels" could make her President) and they will surely be studying the example.

So should we. Watch the framing.

As the majority, Democrats ought to plan that every procedural delay is framed on a specific issue, e.g., you can't lose coverage if you get sick or hurt, where the public is not only solidly with us, but the Republican delay will REMIND the public why they want this bill to pass.

Remember, there are essentially only two messages for political campaigns -- and passing health care is a political campaign. Either you're demanding a new deal, or getting back to basics.

We can own BOTH messages -- but only if we play offense more than defense. That Republicans want to use Senate procedures to delay means they want to run out the clock -- which is a lot harder on defense, cuz you're not in control of the ball.

So Democrats need to control the ball: frame the specifics which Rs will have to delay. ByallthingsGodly, don't let THEM do it.

What have the members of the Republican party shown us over the past year other than being a bunch of whiners whose sound and fury signify nothing!

If health care is what Americans want, anyone obstructing such an effort should have hell to pay in the next election cycle! You know, any campaign opponent should hammer the Republican incumbant with not acting when some 122 of our fellow citizens die each day from a lousy status quo insurance monopolized disfunctional system!

Republican Congress people must like seeing their fellow Americans suffer, because how else could they explain why they don't want a better health care industry for all Americans while they've had the best Government Sponsored health care while in office supposedly doing the people's business!

At this moment, I want to shout, "Death to the Republican Party!" -Kevo

60 Senators in the democratic caucus could stop this, today.

Why did we elect Democrats in overwhelming numbers last year?

so they could hide behind Republican skirts, apparently

Just think, if Republicans took all that energy and thought going into obstruction and put it into something useful they could start a new religion, solve global warming, feed the poor, preserve and restore our nation's crumbling historic buildings, or train the next generation of physicists. But... they are simply like old stoners, who would rather say , "NO!" than contribute.

When is the country going to get it -- contemporary conservatives do not believe in representative democracy.

The reason they're in the minority is that the Democrats won more elections, but that means nothing to Republicans -- elections only matter when Republicans win them.

One can only conclude that contemporary Republicans are not interested in governing, but pursuing one-party rule. All that talk about freedom and the constitution and the flag is bullshit to rally the most ignorant and biggoted among us.

[...] the full text of Gregg's three-page memo, which offers specific instructions on all of the various ways GOP senators can interfere, interrupt, and undermine the legislative process [...] -- Steve Benen

How are the mighty fallen! Here he is, writing piddling 3-page memos which, at best, will slow things down a month or two... Yet, had he accepted Obama's "invitation to dance", he could have screwed up the entire country for years and years and years, by making the census numbers come up trumps for the Repubs...

Let's see if this makes it into the network and cable news, so the public can be informed as to what is happening in the Senate.

No? They aren't going to? Oh ... that's right. They are too busy doing nonstop coverage of Tiger Woods' extramarital affair.

Now's the time for a national healthcare co-op, forget Washington, we'll do it ourselves. Posted by: Tom Nicholson on December 2, 2009 at 4:53 PM

Isn't there a political party in Europe that does this for its members?

Gregg must've contacted Jesse Helms in Hell and gotten the lowdown from him.

Not sure what 'a' thinks, that 60 Senators can just avoid all this.

I certainly haven't seen 'a's plan. Until filibusters go, it's 60 or reconciliation.

Why is the populace not outraged by this?

Because they don't know about it. Political buffs will get the gist of it, but the rest of the public has other worries. They depend on a limited number of national news sources to tell them about the important things going on and those sources are socially bound to the Republicans, their mentors, their drinking and golf buddies.

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congress is a crime scene.

why should we pay for them to have the best health care OUR MONEY can buy, but we cannot?

Something to check out: gapminder.org. It shows scatter graphs of different countries based on whatever indicators you choose. The graph that should be linked for my URL is a graph showing life expectancy at birth on the y axis, total health spending (% of GDP on the x). The size of the dot shows population, and the color shows infant mortality rate (warmer colors mean a higher infant mortality rate). So, the goal is to be be in the upper left corner, colored purple. The US is in the upper right, colored cyan (15% GPD spent to get 78 year life expectancy, with 6 mortalities per 1000 live births). The much derided (by GOP pols) Canadian system spends 66% of what we do (10% GPD) for an extra 3 years, and one more baby per 1000 kept alive. South Korea has identical results for 6.5% GDP.

But remember, we have the best health care system on Earth...

Because this travesty must be stopped, period. Thank you Senator Gregg. We appreciate the fact that you care. You are an angel from heaven, especially for those of us with elderly parents who could be denied hospitalization and an IV for having nothing more wrong than simple dehydration.

As in the UK, Canada, and some Asian countries, they would be LEFT TO DIE because of their age.

The nutjobs in the White House must NOT be allowed to tell us who can get medical treatment and when.

Those of you who 'admire' these overt Communists and their violent and deceptive tactic of jamming huge bills through without giving the legislature time to know what's in them are pathetic and your behavior and support for these criminals against life is abhorrent.

If you want to talk about blocking, look in the mirror. This Congress and their head nutjobs like Pelosi and Reid ought to start with the investigations of their own tax evaders, ACORN, and now climategate scoundrels. Al Gore should be in jail... along with the rest of the IPCC.

well.. it's like I knew!

mm... bookmarked thread :)

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