No wonder Obama’s opponents try to dismiss Obama as ‘just talk’ They’re trying to take away his most powerful weapon.

Quite nice. Thanks for the excerpts.

Blah blah blah. I had such high hopes for Obama, I thought he was different.

He capitulated on the wars.
He capitulated on health care.
He's fallen into the Wall Street trap.
He has not lead the democratic party; rather, he has allowed a small vocal minority to frame the debates on all the major issues.

I don't think it's his fault necessarily; no matter how idealist, no matter how well intended a person is, Washington culture corrupts them. It happened to Clinton too. He started out as an outsider, but wound up becoming a pawn of the plutocracy. See the repeal of Glass-Steagell.

Our government is corrupt. All it takes is big business interests to buy a few key senators and the will of hundreds of millions of people, the will of an entire nation, is stifled.

I loved my country, but this place totally sucks ass now.

I watched the ceremony, also, and thought he nailed it (as did the chairman of the Peace Prize Committee). We are no longer sidelined. . .

Yeah- he capitulated on all that, and more. Your fondest wishes for him were there for the taking, and he chose to blow it off. All he needed to do was ask, and the GOP, Blue Dogs, Fox, Wall Street, etc., would have just rolled over for him.
Why the hell didn't he do it? This could have been the golden age, the one in which the lion lays down with the lamb, etc..
Why? Why? Oh yeah- because this is the real world, and he was handed a pile of shit, along with a fractious party, and a completely intransigent minority.

I heard only the last ten minutes or so of the speech but thouoght it eloquent and worthy or consideration...which, of course, it will NOT get because all with mke/pen/computer will be about putting out there what THEY think he should have said, really meant and so on. Few will have heard it all OR bothered o read the text...before running on to the next shiny object (or more about Tiger). If this country is as FU as many believe it has been a long time coming AND will be a long time getting "fixed" if that is even possible. I suggest a total collapse and resulting revolution to see if the potential still exists to take what the FF hoped to achieve and find a way to make it work...happily I'll be gone before that happens...and perhaps the other intelligent beings of the universe will show up and we can have a "DAY THE EARTH STOOD STILL" moment!!!

My comment this morning...what a joke!

Afghanistan...Obama's abyss!

If Obama and the generals want to up the ante, bring back the draft and bring on a war tax, so all Americans can be engaged in their War on Terror!

OKAY, no matter what my optomotrist brother-in-law says I DO, apparently need my glasses changed OR a larger screen on the old netbook...sorry!!!

Such eloquence makes me momentarily despise my cynicism.

Those regimes that break the rules must be held accountable.

Unless this rule and all of the others start applying to the US (and its allies), everything he said is just BS.

This was, I think, the most thoughtful and consequential speech Obama has yet delivered. He outlined his vision for the world and foreign policy in a muscular way that was also humble. How he walked THAT tightrope left me breathless.

I also had the benefit of watching Fox News, who had two former republican speech writers critique Obama's speech--you know, "fair and balanced" and all that rot. What was interesting is that they were both, begrudgingly, respectful and impressed by the speech.

You know a speech is good when both the left and the right claim it as their own.

The President gave a most gracious, humble and realistic speech in Oslo today. He admitted that war is a part of keeping the peace. He strongly pointed out the absolute necessity for better living standards world wide to reduce violence and governments in turmoil.
We were up early and proudly watched it all. It is amazing to me that America elected this man, at this time. We are a much better country than the media and computer posters make us seem.

I can hear the righties howl already. "Obama doesn't believe in American exceptionalism." "Obama thinks we should make sure that everyone has an opportunity. What Bull. He is America's president, not president of the world." Yada, yada, yada.

Damn, tough fucking crowd around here. Even though you may not agree with every decision he's made or can't wrap your head around the current political realities that constrain Obama, can you at least be gracious enough to credit him for an intelligent, stirring speech that represented the US with grace, dignity and humility?

Or, just bitch, I guess. Seems like most thread-lurkers preferred MO.

the man can give a speech.
the man can promote the global good.
it is true he is early on the international stage.
it is true he inherited his post when it was left a cesspool, and he has the job of re-making it a guiding light...

so far, tho, nuttin' -- too much worse than nuttin' -- he seems to be simulatin his predecessor, the cesspool maker, tho in a minor key.

knee deep in blood in afghanistan; stroking the ears of the lamb-munching lion of israel; and at home with the banksters, the mercenaries, and military-industrial complex...there are no good signs of decency for the future. none.

Neill, although I disagree with much of what you said, you sure did say it with style and verve! Nicely done :-)

@ Chris I totally agree. It's become difficult to enjoy Steve's column for all the bitching. We don't lose elections because Republicans have better candidates; We lose because we have no sense of loyalty whatsoever.

An inspirational speech no doubt. He should give it to the Justice Dept. staff some time.

I find it hard to reconcile those words with the positions they are taking on his behalf.

On the earlier article by Steve on DeMint, someone made the observation that when the righties get upset, they go looking for leaders who follow their proclivities and then support them. We, on the other hand, go home and drop out. I think that also explains a good part of the problem that MissMudd has recognized.

The ultra-left has come to the same conclusion as the GOP. Obama must be portrayed as a failure, and a wedge must be driven between Obama and his base. The Ultra-Left believes in some fairy tale that the nation will turn to them as the Obama administration fails. After all, it worked so well in 1968, 1980, and 2000.
The GOP is more realistic. They know that when a wedge is driven between the Dem base and/or activists, the GOP will win. It worked fine for them in 1968, 1994, 1980 and 2000.
It is time to as persistently as the ultra-left hijacks forums like this to say that Obama is the same as Bush (remember Gore is the same as Bush) to tell them to STFU.
If the GOP is willing to pay to put the Green Party on the ballot, they can certainly subsidize trolls.

I loved my country, but this place totally sucks ass now.
Posted by: citizen_pain

Is this what Obama meant by "the satisfying purity of indignation"?

Yes the dems are the worst, most dishonest, most willing to sell out, party, except for the only remotely viable alternative, the repiglicans. It is a task of many years to drag the dems to the more progressive future that we want. Obama is not the end of the struggle, he is the beginning.

The President did us proud.

At a critical time in world history, when the foundation of democracy is shaken to its roots by the knowledge that special interests and corporations have incredible influence over our politics and over our lives, he has found a way to remind us of what this country stands for, our place in world history, and the importance of the continuing success of our American experiment to world peace and to the hope for freedom in all men's hearts.

A GREAT speech, well-written, and heartfully, masterfully delivered.

The talent of the President's speechwriters never ceases to leave me amazed, and the talent of the President in making those words come to life on so many different stages is, in my view, paralleled only by the likes of FDR and JFK in recent American history.

TOday, he made me proud to stand up and say "Yes, Mr. President, I am an American, and what you are saying is exactly what I believe."

And thus, I'm donating the prize money to the Military Industrial Complex..

Sorry Barry but what a crock of shit. Humility it appears has a new definition in this "new" and transparent administration!

O the bliss that would come if I could only water-board "war trollop" with a nice hot cup of STFU.

During his campaign for presidency, I listened to this man's speeches. Either he meant what he was saying, and was damn good at it, or he's just another lying scheming politician.

And that doesn't actually matter. Because he's President. But plenty of the corrupt old-guard are still there. Rahm Emmanuel, Clinton, Pelosi, Reid - the Army of the Ethically Compromised.

I actually kind of hoped he'd lose. McCain/Palin would have made this country into a completely undeniable train-wreck, true.

But I think that Obama's talent is wasted in Public Office. The necessary sausage-making that goes on there, has damaged his credibility, and, maybe even his effectiveness. He could have done so much more good in this world without the corrupting trappings of Absolute Power.

Perhaps this guy's talent will really start to shine after his term as President is over. (who would argue that Al Gore did as much good as VP as he's done *since*?).

I still hope. They'll try, but they can't take that away from me.

The speech was such utter bullshit that I unsubscribed to OFA and won't be raising money for this asshole ever again. Matt Taibbi was right when he called the election of 2008 "the greatest political bait and switch in American history."

I think it's wonderful that we're maintaining such an old American tradition in preventing the spread of terrorism to one country by attacking its next door neighbor. After all, we let Vietnam go Communist, and as everybody knows, all of South Asia to this day is Communist! Why, if we don't stop 100 terrorists in Afghanistan by killing as many civilians as we can there, the Pakistan border guards will be forced to allow all the terrorists that approach to enter their great democratic nation. It would be madness, I tell you, madness! Good on President Obama. I'm glad he's figured this all out.

And the petulent left decides that the country is better off offing itself than trying to fix our problems in any way that is not 100% in line with their beliefs. Idealogues from both the right AND left pollute our politics and put us where we are today.

Obama gave a speech Bush would have been proud of. Let me summarize the speech for you:

There is evil in the world. Can't negotiate with Hitler. Can't negotiate with Al Qaeda. I will act unilaterally to protect US interests.

All the mentions of Walesa, King, Mandela, et al. don't change the fact this is a president who so far has not done anything for the cause of international peace, and whose sole accomplishment is the escalation of a war that was lost a long time ago.

Keep cheering on. Obama will lead the Democrats off a cliff in the same way Bush led the GOP.

Who the F#*& are you guys (the lame dissenters)? What planet do you live on?

I just finished reading the entire transcript of his speech and this guy should be praised for what he said.

It's beyong my comprehension why you don't see what Obama said and stands for is where we need to be as a nation and as a global community.

Obama is the best thing to happen to our country in decades and some nit pick and tripe away at him as if there is some better, thought-through solution out there somewhere that's obvious to anyone who is ignorant, partisan, and devoted to failed ideologies and political parties.

Let me add some Obama quotes Mr. Benen chose to leave out:

"But perhaps the most profound issue surrounding my receipt of this prize is the fact that I am the Commander-in-Chief of the military of a nation in the midst of two wars."

USA! USA! (OK, I added that part myself)

"I raise this point, I begin with this point because in many countries there is a deep ambivalence about military action today, no matter what the cause. And at times, this is joined by a reflexive suspicion of America, the world's sole military superpower."

USA! USA! (sorry, couldn't help myself) Take THAT, you foreign America-haters...how dare you question American use of force...

"Make no mistake: Evil does exist in the world. A nonviolent movement could not have halted Hitler's armies. Negotiations cannot convince al-Qaida's leaders to lay down their arms,"

"And even as we confront a vicious adversary that abides by no rules, I believe the United States of America must remain a standard bearer in the conduct of war. That is what makes us different from those whom we fight. That is a source of our strength. That is why I prohibited torture. That is why I ordered the prison at Guantanamo Bay closed."

Very nice. Yet, Guantanamo remains open, Bagram and other similar atrocities are not even mentioned, and given that the use of torture of the last administration is not going to be investigated (evidently that's what being the standard bearer entails these days...), I am far from certain torture is not continuing at places like Bagram even today...

"But it is also incumbent upon all of us to insist that nations like Iran and North Korea do not game the system. Those who claim to respect international law cannot avert their eyes when those laws are flouted. Those who care for their own security cannot ignore the danger of an arms race in the Middle East or East Asia. Those who seek peace cannot stand idly by as nations arm themselves for nuclear war."

What was that tune McCain sang? Bomb Iran, bomb bomb bomb bomb Iran...

"So even as we respect the unique culture and traditions of different countries, America will always be a voice for those aspirations that are universal."

Which is why we invaded Iraq.

"Somewhere today, in the here and now, in the world as it is, a soldier sees he's outgunned, but stands firm to keep the peace. "

What is that place called? Definitely not Iraq and definitely not Afghanistan.

All in all, a very nice exposition of the neoconservative national security agenda, but wrapped in marginally better rhetoric.

Mr. QE: if the US is to remain the "leader of the free world" it actually needs to START LEADING, not hide behind speeches mentioning deeds long gone by. All the stuff Obama mentions is ancient history. What has the US done in this decade to merit the title of global leader? Is the US going to ratify the Kyoto Protocol? Lead the world toward carbon emission control at Copenhagen? Prosecute torturers within its own government? Ratify the nuclear test ban treaty? Actively engage itself in the Middle East peace process, actually reaching an enforceable, binding agreement? Rein in its own out-of-control financial sector that is wrecking the world economy?

The answer to all of the above is a NO, and you know it. The sad part is that you may be right, Obama may well be "the best thing to happen to this country in decades" (though Bill Clinton's record on peacemaking still stands unsurpassed--Bosnia and Kosovo genocides averted, Oslo Accords, little stuff like that...), which only goes to show how much this country has declined...

So, Mike J., you're saying there is NOT any evil in the world?

Please defend.

Mike J, I'll tell you what I know (and "No" is not one of my answers) and you can tell me where I'm wrong:

Is the US going to ratify the Kyoto Protocol? Good Question. Obama still has time to crack this nut. Bush had eight years and did nothing. Give Obama four years and then come talk to me.

Lead the world toward carbon emission control at Copenhagen?
We'll see. We don't know what more Obama will do to lead this effort to contain carbon emissions but I expect, given more time , he do more to contain carbon emissions than any US president before him. He has done quite a bit already with all of his Clean Energy initiatives (increasing mpg standards for the auto industry by model year 2016, funding smart grid technology, etc.)

Prosecute torturers within its own government?
Not likely but I think he's at least stopping this horrible practice and probably is weighing the benefit of taking on a previous administration on an issue that will suck a lot of air out of Obama's agenda if he pursues it. I'm actually disappointed about this one but I'm moving on in the hope that he does more on his watch to stop it and ensure that it does not come back.

Ratify the nuclear test ban treaty? Actively engage itself in the Middle East peace process, actually reaching an enforceable, binding agreement?
He's laying the groundwork for these and again more time will tell where this is going. Just because it's not done already doesn't mean it won't get done.

Rein in its own out-of-control financial sector that is wrecking the world economy?
More TIME please. Some legislation has yet to be passed and in good time will strengthen consumer protections. But so far he's passed the Credit CARD Act that puts limits on the credit industry keeping them from double-cycle billing, universal default, limits when they can raise interest rates. Passed Helping Falmilies Save Their Homes Act and Fraud Enforcement and Recovery Act to add protections for American homeowners. With such a strong start in only 11 months, I'd say he's just getting started. Time will tell.

BTW, look at what he has done in 11 months. It's pretty impressive:

http://tpmcafe.talkingpointsmemo.com/2009/11/30/progressives_and_obama_are_doing_better_than_we_th/

Y'all sound like Mets fans, down by 2 runs in the second inning in an April game and you want to fire the manager already.

@QuestionEverything, excellent point, can we give the man some time before we start hating all over him?

Can you imagine the speech Bush would have given if, in some bizarro universe I never want to visit, HE had been getting the Peace Prize?

Bluster, swag, thangya very much, strength, 9/11, power, 9/11, must fight eveildoers, 9/11, darkies scary, damn AY-rabs, 9/11.

Let's all exhale for a minute, appreciate the talented leader we have, and give him some time to show what he can do.

Compelling and sober -- great speech.

The president has exposed himself as just another establishment war pig.

"...as just another establishment war pig." Brojo @ 6:15 PM.

That is sooo '60s! And by the way, if you're going to use cliches, use them properly; it's "war monger" not "war pig". Really, the quality of radical leftwing education nowadays!

Brojo, I absolutely despise what the Republicans are trying to do to our country and world.

In your mindlessness and slander, you are their comrade.

Sarah Palin and President Obama don't agree on much, but last year's Republican vice presidential nominee just gave the president's defense of "just wars" a thumbs up in an interview with USA TODAY. In fact, she said that the president's address in Oslo, where he accepted the Nobel Peace Prize today, reminded her of what she wrote on the same subject in her hugely successful memoir, Going Rogue.

"I liked what he said," Palin told us in a phone interview. "I talked too in my book about the fallen nature of man and why war is necessary at times." For Palin, that view strikes close to home: Her eldest son, 20-year-old Track, is an Army infantry member who recently returned from a tour of duty in Iraq.

"I'm on my knees more than ever praying for his safety along with all of his fellow troops," Palin said. "Of course, war is the last thing any American, I believe, wants to have to engage in, but it's necessary. We have to stop these terrorists over there."

Bush = Obama = Palin = Obama supporters

Obama Nobel speech gets praise from conservatives

President Barack Obama's Nobel Peace Prize speech Thursday is drawing praise from some unlikely quarters — conservative Republicans — who likened Obama's defense of "just wars" to the worldview of his predecessor, Republican George W. Bush.

It's already being called the "Obama Doctrine" — a notion that foreign policy is a struggle of good and evil, that American exceptionalism has blunted the force of tyranny in the world, and that U.S. military can be a force for good and even harnessed to humanitarian ends.

"There will be times," Obama said, "when nations — acting individually or in concert — will find the use of force not only necessary but morally justified."

The remarks drew immediate praise from a host of conservatives, including former GOP House Speaker Newt Gingrich and former Alaska Gov. Sarah Palin.

"I liked what he said," Palin told USA Today. "Of course, war is the last thing I believe any American wants to engage in, but it's necessary. We have to stop these terrorists."

Gingrich told the Takeaway, a national morning drive show from WNYC and Public Radio International, "He clearly understood that he had been given the prize prematurely, but he used it as an occasion to remind people, first of all, as he said, that there is evil in the world."

"I think having a liberal president who goes to Oslo on behalf of a peace prize and reminds the committee that they would not be free, they wouldn't be able to have a peace prize, without having (the ability to use) force," Gingrich said. "I thought in some ways it's a very historic speech."

Forgot the rest of the equation!

Bush = Obama = Palin = Obama supporters = Gingrich = random Conservatives

Oops, here's the correct link for the previous quote.

The final equation, however, stands as is!

"Why, if we don't stop 100 terrorists in Afghanistan by killing as many civilians as we can there, the Pakistan border guards will be forced to allow all the terrorists that approach to enter their great democratic nation." - Balakirev

Don't forget that AlQaeda/Taliban DID take over the Afghanistan government, and they DID fly planes into the World Trade Center. And if you don't think they would like to get their hands on the nukes in Pakistan, you are being very, VERY naive.

And everybody else seems to forget that Obama DID campaign for an increased presence in Afghanistan, for precisely the reasons outlined above.

American exceptionalism and platitudes even a neocon could love.

"Those regimes that break the rules must be held accountable."

I'm just wondering how they made the doorways into the hall large enough to accommodate the gargantuan balls it took to make that statement.