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• mcc on July 22, 2011 7:46 PM:

  "Grand Bargain" is dead. The debt limit increase will be a clean one. And it's the Republicans' fault their own initiatives died.

  This really is the best case scenario, isn't it?

  Best Friday news dump *ever*.

• jjm on July 22, 2011 7:48 PM:

  Obama's press conference on this was magnificent.

  The entire way Obama has handled this has been to call the GOP/TP bluff. They've been campaigning FOREVER on debts and cutting entitlements. He gave them an opportunity to do so and they caved, crumpled, and dissolved like the Wicked Witch in The Wizard of Oz.

  Yes, he threw the 'let's seriously address the debt you're complaining about' pail of water on them and they just melted.

  And they will take the ENTIRE blame now if the country defaults. I can't imagine a single American, after hearing this conference, placing any blame on Obama.

  I hope the GOP/TP is bracing for the tidal wave of opprobrium coming their way....

• Schtick on July 22, 2011 7:51 PM:

  I was watching that. Obama almost seemed angered. Not about the walkout, but about Bonehead not returning his call. So now he wants another meeting? Why?
  I also watched Bonehead. He seemed to have inbibed a couple before speaking. He said nothing except poor job creators were gonna be taxed by Obama and the dems and it was just unacceptable. Same old. Same old.

  crapcha....the kinsee....no, it's cantsee

• mcc on July 22, 2011 7:54 PM:

  The captcha is telling me "authority sitici". Inglip is wise, indeed.

• Anonymous on July 22, 2011 7:57 PM:

  Obama finally put the onus on the Rs and their extreme wing. He indicated that the Dems weren't happy with the latest deal but were willing to at least talk about it. He also chastised the press for their he said, she said stories. Awesome press conference.

  Just now a 77-y-o lifelong Republican woman called into CSPAN and is disgusted with R politicians. She's finally figured out that they don't care about her. I hope she's not the only one.

• Charlton Heston on July 22, 2011 8:14 PM:

  While I know in my wallet of wallets that big money won't let a dollar of theirs be harmed, I don't need the adjita. I don't want a replay of this scene:

  "We finally really did it. You maniacs! You blew it up! Damn you. God damn you all to hell!"

• PEA on July 22, 2011 8:19 PM:

  With the repug Govs going for teachers' throats in the states and now this, I have a tiny glimmer of hope that at least some otherwise distracted and dithering Independents (not to mention a few reasonable old-fashioned GOP'ers) MIGHT begin to notice that the T(aliban) Party's GOP is a baaaaad alternative when they are frustrated with the Dems.

• beep52 on July 22, 2011 8:30 PM:

  Moments before Obama's appearance, a package arrived from our daughter with the college diploma she was granted this spring.

  So here I am, holding in my hand this symbol of the hard work, she, her mother and I did over the years to prepare her for a productive future -- while on the TV the president of the US is telling me those hellbent on 'burning the village to save it' just lit the match.

  I wanted so much just to look at that damned piece of paper and savor the moment, but instead, I all I felt like doing was throwing up.

• John B. on July 22, 2011 8:46 PM:

  I am tired of the GOP's awkward and deceptive neologism, "job creators" when they're talking about the top 2% of the wealthiest people in America. I'm also appalled at how many so-called 'objective' journalists play along and use that phrase "job creators" as if it were an officially listed synonym for 'filthy rich' in Roget's Thesaurus. (It isn't.)

  If some new synonyms were needed for that two percent of the "rich" the GOP is protecting, "trust fund babies" and "stock market manipulators" would be more accurate, anyway. But don't hold your breath waiting for the allegedly objective world of journalism to use it.

• cthulhu on July 22, 2011 8:57 PM:

  Great press conference despite the dire circumstances. Hope enough people see it...

• a on July 22, 2011 9:29 PM:

  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wMOz_p7oXVE

  So Obama reneged on a prior commitment and wrecked any chance of an agreement. Typical.

• sapient on July 22, 2011 9:29 PM:

  "I wanted so much just to look at that damned piece of paper and savor the moment, but instead, I all I felt like doing was throwing up."

  We'll get through this. The kids will look back at this insane time and be grateful that Obama got us through this.

• ken on July 22, 2011 9:30 PM:

  The only ones wowed by Obama's performance will be those progressives too naive to see that he is still trying to sell them out.

  Lot's of talk but what did he really say? He invited the cons back to help him dismantle Social Security and Medicare. That was the message from this news conference.

• sapient on July 22, 2011 9:33 PM:

  The Republican hate patrol has been summoned, I see.

• RD Padouk on July 22, 2011 9:39 PM:

  I am very proud of this President.

• RD Padouk on July 22, 2011 9:53 PM:

  The implication of the "Obama Reneged" meme is that in the absence of this alleged reneging the house Republicans would have been willing to accept additional revenue. This is contrary to the clear statements of the Republicans. They insist that there be no additional revenues. Without dealing with this problem, all else is noise.

• Bill on July 22, 2011 9:54 PM:

  In addition to watching the President, it's also instructive to read the transcript of both news conferences. Obama deals in some details with the structure of the proposed agreement and the difference over tax revenues. Boehner uses very few numbers and offers virtually no specifics of the package he rejected. His letter to the Republican caucus is also devoid of logical insight.

  Hopefully the 'mainstream' media will call this for what it is, a Republican House majority bought, paid for, controlled and now almost completely populated by extremists, led by the Tea Party. I didn't think it was possible for Boehner to appear weaker than he did after handing the reins of the negotiation over to Cantor, but this is much worse. Entirely predictable but still sad and dangerous for the country.

  My chief hope is that the President holds good on his promise not to accept any deal that does not move the debt ceiling into 2013.

• Skipjack on July 22, 2011 10:00 PM:

  I think the Republicans must be feeling sick that the closer we get to the drop-dead deadline the less leverage they have to effect their demands. They may very well pull the trigger, and I accept the analysis of the many who point out that would be an end of the world scenario. And yet they can't win, but only force a lose-lose. And they are the ones who picked this fight.

  I'm still worried that even if they fold and raise the debt ceiling, the lack of any ability to make progress here and common ground will mean the next year or so is wasted. In advance of the election there may be nothing but paralysis and politicking out of Washington. I know I can expect it but we need so much more.

• memekiller on July 22, 2011 10:02 PM:

  Thank God. It would be awesome if the GOP could scuttle the Grand Bargain so we're left with... oh, say, raising the debt ceiling?

• zeitgeist on July 22, 2011 10:04 PM:

  the markets may as well open with the circuit breakers in place on Monday morning. hopefully it will be like fall 2008 where a 700 point drop changes the Republicans' tune pretty damned fast.

• exlibra on July 22, 2011 10:17 PM:

  I don't, normally, watch clips that are longer than 5-8 minutes (Steven Colbert, usually); I don't have the time, plus it's harder for me to follow spoken word than written one. But I'm glad I listened to this one; I liked what I heard. Obama will never be as much of a firebrand as I might like for him to be, but that also means that he's much less likely to go off half-cocked than I am. And since that characteristic of his -- the ability to keep a cool head under fire -- was exactly why I voted for him in the primaries, I can't complain now :)

  What struck me *in particular* was his response to the question as to why he was willing to compromise further than his base thought sensible, much less acceptable. His answer was, in essence, that the getting the debt ceiling raised was paramount and overrode all other considerations. And that he wanted to give Boehner some cover, allowing the Speaker to save face with his base, when he (Boehner) tried to push them into doing the right thing.

  My husband didn't watch the press conference himself; his impression of it has been defined by David Brooks, commenting on the News Hour. According to Brooks, Obama was disrespectful and hurt Boehner's wee-wee, so Boehner was right to walk out.

  Boehner, under stress, cries. Under the same circumstances, Craptcha misspells. It's *not* "mespop system", silly; it's "messpoop" one.

• msmolly on July 22, 2011 10:19 PM:

  I simply cannot bear to watch that man. I agree with ken, July 22, 2011 9:30 PM. We have been sold down the proverbial river by the charlatan who preached hope and change. Despicable.

• Ron Byers on July 22, 2011 10:23 PM:

  He was pissed.

  The initial reporting is that Obama told Boehner that he wanted $400 billion more in additional revenue but was willing to talk. Boehner walked without so much as saying no to the President.

  This presser is why they say the President has the bully pulpit. He told the house Republicans that if the economy goes south it is their fault. He also told the American people to prepare for the worst.

  Lets see if the lawyers warm to the 14th Amendment.

• DisgustedWithItAll on July 22, 2011 10:30 PM:

  I'm still worried. All the Republicans have to do is come back and say we'll take the deal. Disaster.

• c4Logic on July 22, 2011 10:39 PM:

  If you are a Republican then you are by definition a psychopath. No conscience, no honor, no reason, no logic. Only the obsessive compulsion, like Renfield to serve Vampyres.

• zeitgeist on July 22, 2011 10:40 PM:

  what i found most galling was when the little orange asshat said, and I quote "I have the same responsibility as the President of the United States."
  
  not a chance. and if you did, you wouldn't be such a dick about the debt ceiling.
  
  get over yourself, crybaby.

  [Captcha, being more political than usual: FAA icsents/ Yeah, I'm pretty incensed about the failure to reauth the FAA, too.]

• biggerbox on July 22, 2011 10:46 PM:

  Don't worry, Disgusted. I don't think the Republicans CAN take the deal. Orangeman is worried that if he says yes, Cantor will evict him as Speaker. Particularly now that they've spent time today trying to paint Obama as a dishonest dealer who moved the goalposts. Their own rhetoric now makes it impossible for them to take this "moved goalposts" deal without losing face/looking "weak", (which as we all know is a capital crime to the GOP.)
  

• jjm on July 22, 2011 10:49 PM:

  Boehner's only apparent effort in his ludicrous conference was to make it seem as if HE, John BOEHNER was going to be in charge (in fact walking out was another way of disrespecting the president).

  He's an oaf and Obama took him down very deftly. The trolls here claiming Obama sold 'progressives' out are transparently trying to give Boner cover.

• Daniel Kim on July 22, 2011 11:22 PM:

  I am told that I have a 'flat affect.' I do not show a lot of emotion in my voice or on my face, and Obama has a similar habit. Looking at the president, I can see that he is about ready to explode. He is incredibly angry about this. Any other man would be screaming with spittle flying into the cameras, if they carried the same amount of emotion. I would not want to be in the hot seat during the next meeting.

  He made some good points about for whom he carries that anger, though. I am glad that the burning passion of this man is fundamentally on the side of the regular people of this stupid, stupid nation.

• spiny on July 22, 2011 11:22 PM:

  Look, both sides are trying to use disaster capitalism to do what they wouldn't be able to do in a normal budget negotiation- only in this case, the disaster is entirely and utterly an artificial one. In the end, it hurts both sides.

  The Republicans are absolutely nuts to demagogue this issue and threatening to blow the whole place up if the Senate and the president don't accede to their demands and similarly, Obama should have been arguing for a clean debt increase from day one and not tried to foist a secretly negotiated, half-thought out "grand-bargain" for his own political purposes (i.e. the idiot swing voter) on us. I wouldn't be surprised if the president started getting cold feet once other Democrats began telling him how fatal cutting Social Security & Medicare in the face of bad economy was going to be. We can only hope...

• beep52 on July 22, 2011 11:24 PM:

  sapient @ 9:29 PM...

  I hope to hell you're right and that we do get through this -- and soon -- for the sake of our kids and theirs.

  But forgive me if I'm not convinced. My lovely bride of 35 years and I came of age during the tumultuous late 60s through mid 70s. We lived through the firehosings of blacks in the South, the Vietnam protests, the burning of cities and bras, and when it was over thought those matters were settled.

  We had no idea that, while watching the Watergate hearings, a cabal was coalescing with the intent of reversing not only the hard fought social progress we'd witnessed, but the entire 20th century and the deadly battles our grandparents fought.

  We both flipped when Reagan was elected, but we were sure it was a temporary reaction to the stagflation and southern incompetence that Carter surrounded himself with. We thought, well, the pendulum swings both ways and always goes past center. When it returns, things will be okay.

  But we never imagined this. This is different. When people who live by Christian principles are labeled socialists and relativists by those who claim the mantle of Christ but only read the Old Testament, we have a problem. When those who went to the trouble of educating themselves are despised as elites by those whose wisdom is based on "common" sense, we have a problem. When the uber-selfish, uber-rich are "job creators," and the most watched news channel is a propaganda network, we have a problem. When science and public investment, which created the environment for private investment to flourish, is denied, we have a problem.

  I used to wonder what rationally minded folks thought as they watched their societies descend into delusional and usually violent fantasies. Now, I think I know, and it's more painful than I ever imagined.

  Still, I hope you're right. I hope that our daughter, now a fine, upstanding young woman eager to work hard and enter the next phase of her life, gets a chance to make her mark. It's what we used to call the American dream.

  But if Republicans get their way, there will be no middle class, no dream.

  I can't begin to tell you how much I hope you're right and I'm full of sh*t.

• Bill on July 22, 2011 11:31 PM:

  Following up on an earlier comment, I watched Brooks on the Newshour and was astonished that he was offended by Obama's tone, particularly after writing back to back columns on Republican extremism. Good grief, how much crap has the GOP thrown Obama's way in the last month? And is not returning phone calls from the President of the United States, be he Obama, Bush, or Calvin Coolidge, just a teeny bit rude? Imagine if Nancy Pelosi had done that to GW during any of their disputes in 2007 and 2008, let alone during an active negotiation.

  Hopefully Brooks patently phony response is not indicative of how this plays in Saturday papers.

• Daniel Kim on July 22, 2011 11:50 PM:

  I hate myself for thinking this, but can't the president declare the conservative caucus a bunch of enemy combatants, and ship them to GITMO?

• Mike Lamb on July 23, 2011 12:07 AM:

  spiny--Obama did call for a clean bill. Numerous times and very early in the process. The House even brought one up for a vote just to prove their alleged bona fides.

• You Don't Say on July 23, 2011 12:24 AM:

  I am not knee-jerk anti-Brooks, but what a prig he sounded like on Newshour tonight.

• Varecia on July 23, 2011 12:34 AM:

  Daniel Kim, I think what the GOP has been doing seriously qualifies as treason; deliberately jeopardizing the economic stability and functionality of the nation, and by extension, our national security. I'd like to see a citizens' arrest of at least Boehner and Cantor, for starters, and then more. People have to have some kind of immediate recourse during extreme circumstances when those in our government are acting to deliberately destroy the country. Why are people sitting back and watching this in such a detached manner? Why aren't there riots in the streets? What we've been seeing over the past three years since the 2008 General Election is a steady, drawn out bloodless coup d'�tat. The the declaration to destroy Obama's presidency, GOP's refusal to participate in the process, and now the deliberate attempt to shut down the government and destabilize the economy. Wake up, folks. It's more than just bullshit as usual.

• spiny on July 23, 2011 1:17 AM:

  Mike- I don't think threatening to veto any extension that contains at least 2 Trillion in cuts counts as wanting a clean debt extension. The fact is that he didn't expend any political capitol or use the bully pulpit to point out what a radical idea it is to use the debt ceiling to extract budget cuts that couldn't be passed under the normal political process.
  

• spiny on July 23, 2011 1:19 AM:

  err.. doesn't contain at least 2 trillion in cuts... preview is your friend. Sorry.

• burro on July 23, 2011 1:32 AM:

  Bill @ 11:31 PM:

  "Following up on an earlier comment, I watched Brooks on the Newshour and was astonished that he was offended by Obama's tone, particularly after writing back to back columns on Republican extremism."

  It's obligatory. Brooks has to be offended. He's concerned that he has already pushed the envelope too far, and if he doesn't make a pissy show of being insulted on behalf of the group he still identifies with, they won't let him be one of them, and he won't have anybody to play with.

  David has a tender heart, just like his friend, John. When Obama is mean, John sheds his tears for all to see, but David holds his sadness close, and shares it only reluctantly on The Newshour, and cries on the inside for what could be, and laments the rude injustice of how roughly his misunderstood friends are being treated. If we could only understand their pain, there wouldn't be so much unfairness, and lack of Democrat, bipartisan generosity in this process. Obama lacks empathy. He just does, and it's breaking Dave's heart. He wants you to know that.

• N.Wells on July 23, 2011 2:36 AM:

  When Obama was running, he said he wanted not a red America or a blue America but a united states of America, and we knew his background as a community organizer. Part of the difficulty is that we are used to people like Bush declaring themselves a uniter not a divider and knowing from the get-go that they are lying through their teeth, so having a politician say what he means and stick to it takes some getting used to. One of the few routes to winning a re-unification struggle is to give up ground early and often and be relentlessly inoffensive and reasonable, until even the most unreasonable opposition finally to admit that he's being reasonable and will decide to work with him. He even spelled that out at one point as to how community organizers got things done. It is our misfortune that his opposition radicalized itself and drove itself so far off the rails that they can't take yes for an answer and wouldn't know reality if it rose up and bit them. However, by being relentlessly reasonable and compromising he has given the rightwingnuts enough rope to have properly hanged themselves: it's getting ever harder for most voters to see the republicans as anything other than crazed dangerous loons.

  There are three flies in the ointment. One is that the R's and their 30% base are still a long way from facing reality. The second is that someone still has to pull together enough politicians to actually raise the debt limit, and I could still see all the R's joining hands to do a giant group happy cannonball into default. Third, no matter how much we don't want to hear it, Obama remains correct that we have problems with structural deficits and that something has to be done about them. Shelling out $430b/yr(15 cents of every tax dollar) on interest payments is about the worst and least stimulating way there is to spend that sort of money - imagine if we could free some of that up for building bridges or rail or research into alternate or improved energy sources or education. This would not require cutting the heart out of social security etc., but it does mean that we have to get the defense budget under control, that we can and should get drug benefits controlled (by having the government negotiate bulk purchase prices, allow purchases from Canada, etc.), strengthen IPAB, and so forth. As long as we are discussing controlling health care costs, someone eventually might come up with the bright idea of cutting out the middle man and going to a single payer plan with well-negotiated rates (alright, I'm dreaming on that one.) Rather than forcing a delay in the retirement age, we could, for example, probably structure a deal to make it rewarding for anyone who might like the opportunity to spend a few years in kind of a partial retirement or do some social service work of some kind. Anyway, even if the R's were to cave completely and give him a clean raise in the debt ceiling, he'd still be coming back later to talk about reforming entitlements, and he'd be right to do so.

  There are time for Keynesian spending, but we can't keep expanding our $14.5 trillion total public debt indefinitely, and some kinds of government spending are clearly better for stimulating the economy than others (hint: pigheaded foreign wars and running up huge trade deficits with oil-producing countries and China are not the most productive, in contrast to research, infrastructure, public health, and so forth), so given that the R's had finally generated the political will to make changes, it makes sense to try and get some needed and helpful but politically difficult changes if the R's could be talked into it.

• Troy on July 23, 2011 2:46 AM:

  beep52, that was an awesome tour d'horizon.

• WorriedExPat on July 23, 2011 2:56 AM:

  Is there a way to excerpt the answer to the last question and post it? That was definitely the high point; too bad there was 30 minutes leading up to it.

• Jon on July 23, 2011 3:31 AM:

  The GOP is committing suicide. This is going to be ugly.

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• Danny on July 23, 2011 4:59 AM:

  Just to note that the breakdown Obama now gave was actually 1 trillion discretionary spending cuts, 600 billion entitlements and 1,2 trillion revenue. And that's a 3:4 breakdown revenue:cuts - not a 1:4 breakdown, not a 1:5 breakdown, not a 1:8 breakdown. (Note that some of the revenue may have been in the form of "cuts to tax code spending", so actors could plausibly call a part of the new revenue "cuts" as well)

  That's a reality check on just how much Obama ever really "caved" behind closed doors. Sure, there's been a lot of leaks all pointing to Obama's extraordinary concessions, but when Boehner walked out, the offer on the table from Obama was 3 parts revenue:4 parts cuts... And keep in mind that there are cuts that progressives actually like, e.g. to defense spending.

  Doesn't sound like caving at all.

• Reality Bites on July 23, 2011 6:31 AM:

  And Danny, that's why there is no deal...

• candideinnc on July 23, 2011 6:37 AM:

  Hurray and hurray again! No grand bargain where we give away the store and have Catfood Commission II! I couldn't be happier. If all of this was grandstanding, well and good, but I tend to believe Senator Sanders, that Obama really wanted the big deal, and that he was willing to sacrifice Social Security and Medicare benefits to get it. That was what the Bowles team was set up to accomplish.

• Sapient on July 23, 2011 6:54 AM:

  I love Steve Benen, and so many of the people who comment here. Thank you for giving me an oasis of reason. Varecia, I was saying the same things to friends yesterday. Why aren't there massive demonstrations to oppose this "bloodless coup"(and how do I organize one)?

  The answer is perhaps that, yes, the Republicans are pernicious, but their power is partly the fault of the left, as well as people who are apathetic and ignorant - people who were motivated enough in 2008, but "disappointed" by 2010 that Obama hasn't done exactly what they've supported in every detail. They're already engaging in false equivalencies - Obama is just as bad as Bush, some go so far as to say. These people are genuinely confused about who to blame. It's unbelievable.

  
  

• Maggy on July 23, 2011 8:05 AM:

  As to your points Apients,
  I have heard this on many occasions that the naysayers form the "left" are really hired by Rove et all to help depress voter turn out, and in this case, keep the masses from revolting. After watching this presser all the way through, I can confidently say that this WAS an ENRAGED Obama. There were no notes. No teleprompter. This was from the core. I find that the media is dismissing it and totally mischaraterizing it incredibly frightening. He called out the house Republcians Repeatedly. He called out the press. He called out Boehner harshly. He gave an eloquent defense of everyday Americans. No this was real rage. WE need to be out in the streets now. This is an attempted coup people. The oligarchs are stretching their wings. We have to stop them.

• zandru on July 23, 2011 1:16 PM:

  As Danny noted:
  

  "Just to note that the breakdown Obama now gave was actually 1 trillion discretionary spending cuts, 600 billion entitlements and 1,2 trillion revenue. And that's a 3:4 breakdown revenue:cuts"

  There's a real question about what's been going on behind those closed doors. Last week, after Eric (totally full of himself) Cantor stormed out of talks, Harry Reid and other Democrats stated publicly that Cantor didn't even belong in these talks, in part because Cantor had been rushing out and lying to the media about what had been said and what was on the table.

  Personally, I'd like to see ALL these talks televised live, and available online, archived. Nothing like a little sunshine to disinfect the process.

  And yes, I think the President did himself proud with this one.

• yellowdog on July 24, 2011 12:16 AM:

  Watch this all the way through. Last line is a classic: "If you want to be a leader, you have to lead."

  The longer the President talks, the more you can see his blood pressure going up. He is what I would call professorially-heated at first, then just a little rawer, then openly angry toward the end.

  He should be a little peeved by now. He has been dealing all summer with a whole cartoon-bus of GOP crazy clowns who refuse to accept most of what was on their Christmas list because they did not get everything. He all but calls them spoiled children. He pulls back from that jibe, though, and just says, when you have been given a position of power, it comes with a measure of responsibility. That's professor-speak for Grow Up. Or, "If you want to be a leader, you have to lead."

  Hope the stenographers in the press corps got the quote right at least.

• Jeff on August 06, 2011 6:43 PM:

  Isn't it time to let someone-anyone else that can't count over 100,000 run the country? I been voting for 38 years now and in that time the republican and democrats have always had the ball-- Look at where we are now!! Scary isn't it. There is so much wasted money in our gov't and it needs to stop-- They are ruining our country. It's time for a major change-- turn the clock back to gov,t spending matching the 1940's...And get rid of our large usless gov't officials

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